openclassterror
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Posts posted by openclassterror
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Question about the shims. I'm right handed, when I put the shim on the back of the action I should see the letter "R" correct?
Yes, visible "R" means stock will be cast off to the right.
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That is a bad deal man. You have my heartfelt sympathy and hopes for brighter days. I am really sorry to hear it
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It looks like the barrel has a burr where the extractor rubs on it as the bolt rotates into place. As you can see in the photos, the extractor is completely out of contact with the shell rim when the bolt is locked. If the worn area is not smooth, the extractor doesn't get a good grip on the rim during primary extraction, and this could be the problem. The extractor notch looks like it needs to be polished and deburred. This is common with Benellis and Versa-maxes as well, especially as round counts go up.
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AHA! I watched the vids in full screen on youtube instead of the embedded video here. It looks on the first video like the round stays in contact with the extractor right past the ejector, then comes back forward against the edge of the ejection port. I am guessing that the next round is on the lifter, and pushing up against the bottom of the empty. When you pull the empty out, the next round loads as soon as it is clear, correct? Check the EJECTOR for free movement. It is spring loaded in a track inside the barrel extension, and should move rearward and outward when the shell rim makes contact, then snap forward under the spring's tension to flip the empty out. Make sure the beak of the ejector isn't worn or damaged, and make sure that itmoves freely in its little groove. If it gets badly fouled and quits moving freely, the shell slips over it instead of compressing the spring. These pics show the ejector in both positions.
HOWEVER, the two photos posted before show the bolt fully back, and the shell stopped at the ejector. This is a typical fail-to-extract. It is possible that the extractor is not getting a good bite on the shell rim from the get-go. Could you please post a pic of the extractor cut in the barrel? it is possible that the barrel is forcing the extractor so far out that it is barely catching the edge of the rim when the bolt unlocks, and losing its precarious hold when the ejector makes contact. One pic of the barrel cut with the bolt removed, one of the bolt closed on a round, showing how far the extractor is off the rim when in battery would be very helpful. The bolt and barrel have to be out of the receiver to see these.
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The second video is a short-stroke. The round is coming back just far enough to tip on the ejector then the bolt is running forward without engaging the lifter. Caused by underpowered ammo, lack of lube, or excess friction somewhere in the system. The first vid is harder to diagnose since the bolt handle leaves the screen I can't tell if it is traveling fully rearward. When you pluck the empty shell out, does the next shell lift right up into the chamber? Or do you have to pull the bolt back before the lifter engages? It almost looks like the bolt head isn't compressing fully, and the bolt isn't traveling fully rearward. If you are running ammunition right at the low limit of recoil for an inertia gun, you may have just gotten a case of ammo that doesn't have enough recoil to cycle the gun. What are the specs of the ammo, and does it do the same thing with something like a heavy dove load? If the problem goes away with 1-1/4oz at 1200fps or 1-1/8oz at 1300, then I would suspect a bad lot of ammo. I would especially suspect that if it is Winchester or Rio. I just can't quite read the side of the shell in the second vid.
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What does the extraction fail look like? Very specifically, is the round on the lifter pushing up against the bottom of the empty? What is the position of the empty in the ejection port? What ammunition is it occurring with? Knowing what point in the cycle the bolt is letting go is very helpful in diagnosing which part is at fault. Could possibly be the extractor, the ejector, the lifter spring, or the shell catch, or could be a short-stroke. A slo-mo video would be ideal, but even just knowing what the empty looks like when it fails is helpful.
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Kurt- I don't think you and Mark are talking about the same phenomenon. You are talking about a barrel that won't group when hot, even though it isn't worn out as seen through a bore scope. He, I think, is trying to answer the OP's question about whether the bore is shot out. If the throat is badly eroded, it probably won't group as well as it did when new. It is easiest to see the difference when the rifle is being shot in conditions that give the best accuracy, thus the cold bore group. If you are getting a 20 MOA group when hot (even if the throat is still OK) then when the bore is shot out, you may not even be able to tell the difference with a hot barrel group. The OP was not explicit about HOW the groups were shot- IE allowed to cool in-between, back to back, etc. So we don't know if thermal cycling is the problem, or bore wear, or possibly other factors, without a little more info from him. I think MarkCo was simply suggesting removing one of the possible variables from the equation for determining the SPECIFIC question "is it shot out" without the use of a bore scope. It very well could be that the bore is NOT shot out, but is still struggling to group well when warm for a different reason, as in your case. The question as posed was not "Do I have a bad barrel?", but rather "Is it shot out?". The two are not necessarily one-in-the-same.
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What MarkCo said ^^^^. On the trigger group pin falling out, the D-clip is the key. Properly installed, the flat leg of the "D" protrudes through the slot in the hammer pivot tube, and retains the pin via the groove that it snaps into. Same as Benelli, Franchi, Remington, and Browning autos.
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Benelli M2 is what we modified. We are working on a purpose-built chute for the M3000 with adjustable guide rails, but production has thus far kept us from completing the prototype. Working on it though!
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Here is a picture of the orientation of the roll pin to the forward assist. The roll limits travel and prevents rotation. If it does not, there is a mechanical problem, or assembly issue. Can't fault you for the nervous tic, I do the same with clicky-pens when I am nervous, especially at doctor appointments. Drives my wife insane. But having something to do when you are waiting in a high stress situation can be the difference between freaking out and not.
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I was glad to help out! My son and I met her at Ironman last year when we shot on the same squad. Super likable and mature young woman. We were hoping to have one of our mag-fed inertia guns available in time for her to use it, but between health problems and the sheer volume of work we weren't able to finish hers in time. She did well, and the Stoegers rocked at Ironman this year! I saw at least 5 MOA Stoegers there, and didn't even get to see half the squads
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Ditto, I shave the weight and build on a slick-side receiver whenever possible. The way we use these guns pretty much anything that causes the bolt not to close is not something you want to cram into the chamber. Just saw a youtube vid where a guy had a squib. Didn't realize it, racked the bolt, click. Again, click. Again, then forward-assisted the next round, forcing the bullet in the throat far enough into the bore for the bolt to close, and promptly blew his rifle up.
But, in answer to your actual mechanical issue, there is a flat on the side of the forward assist body that lays against the roll pin, keeping it from rotating. If it was properly installed with the correct size roll pin but rotates anyway, the roll pin hole is too far away from the forward assist bore to do its job. If so, that is a manufacturing defect and AP should replace the upper. A qualified Gunsmith could tell you for sure with about 2 minutes' work.
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There are only a few shops specializing in the Stoegers, and as a rule of thumb they are generally built for more cost-conscious shooters. So there isn't a lot of demand for high-dollar options like bolt lightening, which must be viewed as a systemic modification. You must balance the mass of the carrier against spring tension to achieve best results. But this is kinda thread-drifting off the original topic. My only point was that it is also a 3.5" gun like the Super-Vinci, and therefore could legally contain more 2-3/4 shells in Canada, where Semi-autos are limited to 5 rounds of the longest shells the shotgun is designed for.
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You can use the M2 trigger, safety, hammer, disconnector, lifter is too short for the 3.5 inch receiver. Inertia spring and extractor components interchange. Bolt carrier, bolt head, firing pin, recoil spring and ejector components do not interchange.
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The Stoeger M3500 is a 3.5" chambered gun, so as I understand it would be allowed the same capacity. It is inertia, similar to the M2. The gun and parts for it are a lot less expensive than either the Vinci or the M2, but it is much more conventional than the Vinci/ super Vinci.
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Steal that Benelli before he wakes up and doubles the price!
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Problem not arrow.......Problem is Indian.......... Haha, nothing like a little demo from Pat to tell you that you need practice, not gizmos.
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Depends on choke design. The Rem-Choke has the threads at the deep end of the barrel, the threads are long, and close to the ID of the bore. The Mobil-choke threads are right at the muzzle, and are the largest diameter part of the choke tube. They are also threaded for a very short distance (comparative to the Rem-choke)after a long parallel section larger than the bore. On the Rem-choke, wad contact is a definite reality. On the Benelli design, much less likely. In either event, the threads are nearly perpendicular to the bore and have no leverage to spin the wad, whereas the Diffusion choke has a very slow twist rate. Realistically speaking, the effect would be the opposite. Increased friction as the wad expands against the threads would slow the wad, allowing the shot to exit the shot cup early, before the petals expand from air resistance. This is proven to actually tighten patterns, as in the pattern-master choke system described here: https://www.patternmaster.com/
I don't think the wad makes significant contact.
Threads are the same as Cylinder. Cylinder is a "thread protector"Is anybody running a diffuser choke? Where do you get them at?
Anyone tested open threads vs. Diffuser? I run no choke for very close stages.
That makes sense. Any truth in the threads spinning the wad like in a diffusion?
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No, I don't. Doing this for any significant length of time deforms the threads and/ or plastic fouls them badly, to the point that chokes are hard to get in and out. Chrome lined bores are harder, and more apt to filling threads with plastic. I had to re-tap the threads on my Remington from shooting no-choke for a while when jump-shooting quail without a dog
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I am not sure what Pat found, but here is what we found during testing: At 10 yards, the diffusion choke is evenly distributed on a paper silhouette target, covering the entire thing. Which means quite a few of the pellets were off paper to the sides. At 15 yards, there are holes in the pattern, and at 20, the holes are big enough for a knockdown plate to have no hits. It does indeed rapidly diffuse the pattern, even more so than a true cylinder choke. BUT, at the price of inconsistent dispersion. So, in my opinion it is a specialty choke. It is GREAT for 3GN classifiers with clays at 7-10 yards, where one pellet anywhere is a dead target. But, I fear the reason I see it as a benefit is because my shotgun technique is in need of improvement. Look in the multigun technique sub-forum at Patrick's "sweep" practice on the plate rack. If I could do this like he does, I wouldn't need the crutch that the diffusion provides. The bigger issue is that in ANY other stage besides the point-blank classifiers it is a liability.
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Mix-ups happen! I don't think I could even function at the kind of inventory levels the big makers have. I am just glad the customer service dept was quick to make it right. Thanks for reporting Paul
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Entirely likely that even though he works for Netflix, he moonlights for the other company he was trying to sell you on, and got scared when you refused to buy it because his scam might get exposed. That would explain him hanging up on you. With older browsers before popup blockers became common I was always getting the "warning! your computer has the following viruses on it! You must click this link to get our cleaning service!" kind of messages. Even though I knew there were no viruses.
Once he had remote access to your computer it would have been a piece of cake for him to install the virus while he was stalling you with "diagnostics", then show you that you needed a "service" to fix it. Especially likely if he is hired help in some 3rd world country.
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Oh, man that sounds like fun! We don't have piggies here, but we do have an abundance of black bears. I try to fill at least two of the four tags I could get per year, and try to ensure that the shots are either far enough to be an accuracy challenge, or close enough to be a panic shooting challenge. Shooting bears between 30 yards and 400 yards just isn't any fun
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Remington STS 1200fps handicap loads are good too. The shells are really smooth and slick , and in the limited testing we have done they cycle great. Definitely a higher quality shell than the bulk pack stuff, but still only about $7 a box
Best method to use to see if a rifle barrel is shot out?
in Rifle & Shotgun - Technique
Posted
I have seen the cold= good hot= bad phenomenon fairly often when shooting bullets with a marginal twist. The big fad a decade ago or so in benchrest was to use the absolute slowest twist that would stabilize your bullet weight. Cutting it close enough that changing from a flat-base to a longer boat-tail in the SAME weight would keyhole. The theory espoused was that spinning any faster than necessary was bad juju. This thought has fallen by the wayside as real life didn't support the theory. What WAS learned was that seemingly minor changes (like 50fps velocity change) might be enough to de-stabilize said projectile. I had a barrel on my PPC at one time that would group outstanding at 300 yards on a cool fall morning, but produced shotgun patterns on the target on a 95 degree summer day with the same bullets.
In respect to ARs, I have had more than one 1-8 twist barrel that shot good cold groups with 75-77gr bullets but poor hot groups. Both grouped much more consistently hot/cold with 69s. 1-7s seem less sensitive with 77s in general.
As I stated on another thread a while back, it is more important to me to have a barrel/ bullet combination that shoots a maximum of 2MOA clean or dirty, hot or cold, than one that shoots 1/2 MOA cold and clean but scatters or moves POI when hot. Some match directors that like to torture cold-bore shooters deliberately place the long range engagements at the end of the rifle section so the gun is good and hot when it is time to stretch out.