maxima

It is amazing that somebody would rather get support hand BBQed like hamburger in the middle of the high round count stage (and face the consequence in the following stages and the life after) than just simply move the hand to a cooler but not optimum position, as a last resort to avoid such the tragedy. Masochism? Now the implication that burnt hands can maintain accuracy better than a simple mag-well hold is really the finest of this thread. This thread delivers.

So our fellow shooters participate outlaw 3-gun match with rifle targets further than 300 yards are called high power shooters now. How smart the idea is! That may cover majority of the members here. Guess a lot 3-gun pro shooters would felt embarrassed if they knew they got beat by "silly gun" in the hands of Daniel Horner. None of them won beauty contest where the looks are the decision factors.

Your poor attitude aside, who does that stance work for? Please name names please of shooters who actually distinguish themselves using it. If you can't, then it "works" in the sense that you can fire the gun that way, but not in the sense that you can shoot it accurately or fast. Heck, I could shoot my rifle one handed while on my back and holding a rabid raccoon in the other hand but I won't be hitting the targets a lot Or .. maybe you are just trolling in which case, well done. Congrats! You just proved again how narrow-minded and ignorant you are! From back seat driver analogy to bazooka hold, and snarky remarks. In the club "outlaw" matches around our area, from my observation, basically there were two groups frequently used mag-well hold: In the first group, shooters were shooting at steel gongs around 300 yards or beyond off-hand. Most of their rifles's center of gravity close to or right at the mag-well section. They adopted mag-well hold to help stabilizing the rifle better with the help of elbow being close to body, since set-up a sling is too slow. And a stable rifle hold improves accuracy. This group includes top/most experienced/match winner shooters as well as average shooters. Among the second group, ones with SBRs, especially with barrel length less then 10 inches. They did that because they won't risk their hands being shot or blasted by muzzle brake using weak hand extended hold. Most guys in this group are also experienced shooters. Again, another unexpected benefit is that mag-well hold also helps mitigate heat issue like OP mentioned. By no means I am trying to advocate mag-well hold, just want to provide something I observed as another option for OP. Shooting situation is very dynamic, no simple "one stance/hold fits all", whatever floats your boat. I won't look down my nose at or mock people trying something not main stream. Anyway, that is how innovation came from and how our country being so great.

Butt-hurt that much? Sounds like you are the one acting like an arrogant jerk and fits the "Range... Douche..." description. What part of "Different strokes for different folks" you do not understand? I do not care what kind of style any shooters use, as long as it works for them. BTW, I am far nicer than the author of that article, therefore, I won't call you mom names, even you really deserve it.

Don't do that, that is probably the worst solution to a problem. That's like saying that the solution to not having enough lumbar support in your cars driver seat is driving from rear passenger seat. Don't do that, that is probably the worst solution to a problem. That's like saying that the solution to not having enough lumbar support in your cars driver seat is driving from rear passenger seat. Funny. And don't forget to take the stock off your shoulder to really complete the look. Different strokes for different folks. Now read this article: http://www.deathvalleymag.com/2010/11/14/tactical-commentary-you-shoot-the-wrong-way-what/ Here is the summary from that article in case you missed: 1) Shoot the way that works for you even if it is not the “right way” 2) Don’t be a Range know it all Douchebag or I will call your mom namescase you were wondering – the two points of this commentary are: 1) Shoot the way that works for you even if it is not the “right way” 2) Dobe a Range know it all Douchebag or I will call your mom names

Holding the mag well with support hand could be a solution without adding any extra parts:

BCM KMR, from primary arms website: https://www.primaryarms.com/BCM_Gunfighter_15_KeyMod_Rail_Black_p/bcm-kmr-15556-blk.htm Maybe BCM fixed similar issue? Anyway, the BCM KMR is very new and the jury is still out on it. FYI, here is a recent thread on ar15.com regarding KMR issue: https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_12/668089_I_m_at_a_loss_for_words______I_think_my_new_BCM_KMR_is_a_lemon__PIC___update_on_page7_.html

223/556 may have less noise level than 9mm: http://www.freehearingtest.com/hia_gunfirenoise.shtml 18 inch barrel with comercial 223: 155.5 DB 9 mm : 159.8 DB Rifle vs. handgun... the OP is talking about running a 9mm carbine. Assuming a more likely 16" barrel in both cases, I would expect the 9mm to be less blasty. If the rifle is primarily used for competition and fitted with a muzzle brake, I'd expect even more blast. No offense. Since OP and your previous post did not provide any specification for comparison, I could not "assume" or "expect" anything arbitrarily, that is why I provided a little bit of published data for reference, and I did put "may" in the sentence.Except this is a thread about rifles.. but some cool data on that link none the less! Which post in this thread is not rifle related...

223/556 may have less noise level than 9mm: http://www.freehearingtest.com/hia_gunfirenoise.shtml 18 inch barrel with comercial 223: 155.5 DB 9 mm : 159.8 DB Rifle vs. handgun... the OP is talking about running a 9mm carbine. Assuming a more likely 16" barrel in both cases, I would expect the 9mm to be less blasty. If the rifle is primarily used for competition and fitted with a muzzle brake, I'd expect even more blast. No offense. Since OP and your previous post did not provide any specification for comparison, I could not "assume" or "expect" anything arbitrarily, that is why I provided a little bit of published data for reference, and I did put "may" in the sentence.

223/556 may have less noise level than 9mm: http://www.freehearingtest.com/hia_gunfirenoise.shtml 18 inch barrel with comercial 223: 155.5 DB 9 mm : 159.8 DB

AP CF is one of the best options.

AP light weight carbon fiber hand guard with barrel nut, is the lightest, even compared to BCM KMR with same length. AP CF also isolates heat better and reasonably priced. Aside from 3 gun support, AP also has excellent CS compared to BCM who does not even have CS representative to answer the phone which is ridiculous.

Great infomation! Thanks a lot, folks! Plan to order +6 nodic MXT extension first. Will play with different sights, do loading port mods and maybe lifter weld after break in, just in case if there is any issue that needs warranty work. Looks like barrel clamp is not a necessary. .

I just ordered CZ 712 ALS with 26inch barrel and I have the following questions: 1. To replace the gold bead, which fiber optics sight is the best for 3 gun while still good for informal clay and hunting? 2. Do I need to have the lifter welded or the stock one is good to go? 3. What length of nordic extension tube that sits flush with muzzle or protrudes just a little bit? 4. Do I need barrel clamp for extension tube and which one fits CZ 712? Thank you in advance.