michael1778
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Posts posted by michael1778
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Sorry, thought they were up. Will be this A.M.
I just looked again. The album of Versa Max pictures is up! Looks great. Is that a 26" barrel? Do you have the tools to properly further particular design of Remington barrel down to shorter lengths? Some matches in NC require 24" maximum barrel length or else you go into Open.
Would you please PM me with your rates for that package you displayed? Thank you.
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Definatley gas.
What Division do you want to shoot? .223 caliber or are you going Heavy?
Mark, for the day later this year (I hope) or early next year that I try my hand at Heavy Metal, what barrel length would you recommend for that situation? I feel like we missed out on some wisdom with your unanswered question. As a follow on to that, what do you think of the JP LRP-07 as a Heavy Metal platform?
Thank You,
Mike
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In the sake of clarity and redundancy, is there any reason to pick one of the JM models over the other, other than 1 extra round capacity?
Depends on match rules. The match rules over in Durham, NC require 22" barrel or shorter. That may well be the minority, I don't have enough experience to be able to say.
Edit: the 2012 rules have edged up to 24". Over that puts you into Open at that monthly match.
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Want to see what a truly tricked out versa-max should look like, check out the one on our facebook. Triangle shooting sports.
I'm afraid I only saw images of a wonderful M2. Well.....and cool pistols, and so on. But the latest shotgun pictures were the M2.
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If you are planning on doing WW2 division in Texas in April, be aware that the magazine capacity is restricted to 6, if I recall the rules correctly.
I have a Benelli SuperNova 24" myself. But I doubt I'll do actual WW2 at the Texas match. Heavy Metal in later matches? Maybe. I'm trying to keep my options open.
Chicken, bet you're all coxy warm sitting on some eggs right now. WW2 all the way.
Sheldon, don't be funny when I'm trying to drink. I almost choked!
Emotionally, I'm totally there for WW2. But financially, I have a hard time making the M1 and .45 single stack purchase for a match I'd do once a year.
I'm also a fairly terrible rifleman, for now. So, for the moment, I'm registered for Limited. I suspect the WW2 shooters will have more fun than anyone else at the match. -
Just wondering what a good out of the box shotgun would be to buy for heavy metal/ WWII division. Looking for something reasonably priced, pump 12ga and something that I shouldn't have to do to much to... Wondering what others are using and what's been done to them to competition ready. Thanks for the info!
If you are planning on doing WW2 division in Texas in April, be aware that the magazine capacity is restricted to 6, if I recall the rules correctly.
I have a Benelli SuperNova 24" myself. But I doubt I'll do actual WW2 at the Texas match. Heavy Metal in later matches? Maybe. I'm trying to keep my options open.
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Based on my past readings of United and US Airways rules (prior to a gun related trip that was cancelled) as well as discussions with computer security people (who now work at NSA) about how they protect their expensive computers form being snatched by baggage people, you declare the weapon unloaded in a hard-sided and locked case at the ticket counter. Then you go through a detailed TSA inspection of the weapon, case, other case contents, etc.
Check out this TSA web page ( http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/assistant/editorial_1666.shtm). Also, consult your carrier's policies on firearms and ammunition transportation.
Why did the white-hat hackers pack guns with their computer gear worth tens of thousands of dollars? Why so they were allowed to use non-TSA accessible/"openable" locks. Just buy a cheap Glock, don't load it, stick it in the hard case with the 10+ high power notebook PCs or MacBooks and then you have a much better chance of protecting your computer assets en route.
Travel safe my friends!
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Why no to the heat sink? I ask because I have a rifle on order and I included it. Guess I should have searched first.
+1
I have the same question. I was talking to the staff at JP today and the recommendation of th eheat sink came up. I was asking about an 18" light contour barrel for either an SCR-11 or a PSC-11 Upper.
Thanks.
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Good points. Thank you, gentlemen. I'll watch this all unfold.
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Club that holds well attended monthly matches in my region has two rules on shotguns that guide me:
#2 is "Barrel length may not be changed for the duration of the match and must be 24 inches or shorter, however a non-ported extended choke can be used it cannot extend more the 1.25 inches past the end of the barrel."
#8 is "Tactical Shotguns may only hold 8 rounds maximum in the tube. Ghost loading is specifically not allowed."
Not to be *too* much of a lawyer's son, but does 'hold' mean only that capacity or simply 'don't put more than 8 in at any time'?? Easy to meet their needs with a different Nordic tube when required.
But, if I change directions away form this CZ712 Utility for Texas Multigun, before I put any real money into it, then I had better change up soon. Ugh. Maybe a Versa Max with a pistol grip and get the barrel cut down to 24" and rethreaded? Hmmm, that is worth considering. I think I can find the current versions of the Versa Max for less than the Tactical will go for at release.
Decisions, decisions. For now, I'll finish getting my rifle ready for the season.
Thank You Very Much,
Mike
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Stay away from the Sparc. I am going on the second replacement. The blue tint hurts if it's not a clear day. I did shoot one at the Larue match last year. I did pretty well with it. It's just not durable enough for 3 gun. It's just going to end up on a 22.
Mike
Hi Mike,
I'm sorry to hear about your problem. Thanks for the tip. I'll just pony up the money and go with the "pro's" choice for Limited 1x optic, the Prismatic. I'm component shopping right now, so your response was timely. I have to rework the rifle to best accommodate the Prismatic. So.....adjustable low profile gas block, 11" or 13" free float guard, and a comp that will fit my longer-term needs for this upper (not all competition). It will cost me, but I had always intended this rifle to be a working model for experimentation and learning how AR systems work at a low level.
It's like Lego for grown ups.
Mike S.
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You will love the Troy TRX Extreme 15" handguard (not the VTAC series). It's ugly to some, but it's got full access to the ecosystem of TRX Extreme add-ons like the QD lugs and K9 barricade-grabber from Noveske, among other offerings from other companies. It's also tough as nails and very, very lightweight. I love mine so much I bought an extra one that's just sitting around waiting to someday be used in a build.
Dennis, thank you! I had seen that and forgotten about it. Looks like a great hand guard and the idea of other accessories is appealing. I'm now considering that one or the Samson Evolution.
Mark, thanks for the extra info on the way that match could unfold with all the pros. I am leaning toward staying in Limited, but as part of that I'm favoring getting a Prismatic with DCD and reworking the layout of my rifle to better suit it. The iron purists might be disappointed, but a man needs to understand his weaknesses and compensate!
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That is one bad ass shotgun. I have enjoyed reading this thread over time as your experiences have unfolded. Thank you very much for sharing your explorations with us.
I've thought about a Versa Max for myself. It's good to see there are two general options available: 1) work on a sporting version and make it into a 3-gun tool, or 2) be on the look out for the Tactical version in the near future.
For someone considering a Versa Max in the near future, would you have a recommendation on which option to take over the other?
Thank you,
Mike
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I called Remington yesterday looking for the 22" barrel and they said that it won't be in Production until Q2.
Ugh!!
That's unfortunate. Appreciate the information.
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My rifle has a simple A2 sight setup with the gas block integral to the sights (16" M&P15 Sport). Does the Leupold Prismatic co-witness (either absolute or 1/3) well? If not then I could replace the gas block and pitch the irons.
What about speed at close range targets compared to an Aimpoint or similar clones (e.g., Vortex SPARC)??
If the Prismatic can handle the close as well as a 2 MOA red dot, or nearly so, then I'd think hard about getting one and making it my one and only 1x choice.
Any recommendations on mounts? The stock one or other?
Thank you,
Mike
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Though I own it I have been known to throw inferior quality items away.................
I just have not heard of this barrel manufacturer. Subsequently I need to find out how good or how bad it really is. I assume and hope that since it is a heavy S/S and flutted that it is of good quality. Maybe I should just go out and shoot it when I receive it.....LOL ! Anyway I do appreciate your respose.
Again, any and all information will be appreciated.
What did Stag has to say to your inquiry?
Meanwhile, shoot the snot out of it. I've been considering their fully assembled 3G upper in the future.
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are you allowed to have irons and prismatic in limited?
That seems to depend on the individual match rules. Larue in April seems to allow it; no explicit limitation on the irons, just a mention of a 1x optic. I was trying to look up the rules for my regional match location, but they are in an extensive web site redesign and move today. I have heard that it varies from match to match.
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Also, in case I do want to free-float the barrel, what are good handguards to consider that don't break the bank? And I like it to be long (I'll replace the gas block, that's fine) since I'm 6' 1".
Thanks all!
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Hey Michael,
I may have missed it but have you shot any local 3 gun matches? I'm sure you can find what gear works or doesn't at a local match for a fraction of the cost of finding out at a major. Plus, people are way more eager to let you use their gear at a club level match if you see something you might want to try out. Again, not sure if this is news to you or not but if it is you will also find out about something much more important than gear - the mental game, including being safe. There's nothing quite so humbling as getting DQ'd on your first stage at a major.
You raise an excellent set of issues. I am trying to get myself set up for two local/regional matches (nothing is actually "local" to me) before heading to Texas in April. I need more range time on all platforms, familiarity drills with my chosen kit, and actual match time 'on the clock' to see how this all shakes out. Thank you.
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Cameron, will you be running the Prismatic again this season in Limited? Thanks for your reply. The video of you and your teammate at Texas in 2011 scared the crap out of me on the long rifle! I'll try not to be discouraged no matter what direction I choose.
William, regardless of my configuration, I need a ton of practice. My hope is to get to my competition configuration soon so I can practice, practice, practice with it. Finding a good rifle range near me is my challenge. I'll try to be thoughtful about any further investment in the rifle, if warranted. Current rifle configuration out shoots me, for sure.
Mike, I was worried about my 16" barrel and velocity over distance. Your comments bring that anxiety up a small amount. I would be interested in your thoughts on a Prismatic if you get one. My other 1x option under consideration was a Vortex SPARC (2 MOA dot).
Pat, points well taken regarding general proficiency across all three guns. Thanks for the reminder. That reinforces my existing plans to concentrate on the shotgun and rifle with small investment in the pistol. I carry M&Ps all the time. I've standardized on them across 3 calibers. But practice with the belt and holster setup has to be done.
Trapr, thanks for the assurance of a warm reception in Limited.
Thank you all for your time and recommendations. I encourage more.
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Hi, thanks for reading. I'm doomed!
Here is the deal. New to 3-gun, and hardly any rifle experience. No rifle experience over 100 yards. 42 year old with fairly good eyes for my age. Very comfortable with pistol (M&P Pro 9mm), based on some years of experience. Getting more comfortable with shotgun (CZ 712 utility).
My first big 3-gun match will be Texas Multigun in late April. I signed up for Limited. Honestly, I was hankering to try WW2 division, but I'd have to spring for the M1 (which is cool) AND a single-stack .45 (not so cool after the M1 buy). The total $$$ amount and few opportunities to use that WW2 gear makes me wait and watch others this year at the match. I made a newbie mistake with Limited thinking I'd avoid a "Gear War". Within the past week I have seen some YouTube videos from that same match last year. One stage had 480 yard shots and strong wind.
I call those "Mike will miss them for sure" targets.OK, here is what I have as a rifle:
- S&W M&P15 Sport (stock irons, that don't seem so great) 16" 1-in-8 barrel
- ACS stock
- MOE carbine length replacement hard guard
- MOE+ grip
- Magpul Pmags with windows (plenty of these)
- Trigger seems serviceable, for now.
I see a few ways to go from here, in no particular order:
- Beg the match staff to allow me to switch to their Tactical division that allows magnifying optics (then get either the MTAC or Viper PST)
- Suck it up and buy an amazing 1x optic. Thinking Leupold Prismatic based on what threads I have seen in my searches here.
- Rework my irons on the existing rifle, like replace the front post, somehow get the front sight out near the muzzle, etc.
- some other way to approach this problem that I haven't considered. Hint: this is a great place for you, dear reader.
I am eagerly anticipating your comments, concerns, and recommendations. I think I'm in over my head and am wide open to your suggestions.
Many Thanks!
-- Mike
- S&W M&P15 Sport (stock irons, that don't seem so great) 16" 1-in-8 barrel
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Just an update, I went with the Geiselle SD3G and a Vortex Viper which I am going to sell and get a Burris MTAC instead.
Thanks for all the advice.
It is very kind of you to give the update. Would you please expand on why you are replacing the Vortex Viper with the Burris MTAC? I've been looking closely at each scope for my first rifle optic, so any real user feedback is very welcome. Did you get the Viper PST model? What mounting hardware did you select? Will you continue to use that mount for the Burris MTAC?
Thanks in advance for the details.
-- Mike
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You could always get a 308 rifle and shoot heavy metal, with or without optics, there are a lot of really good shooters in TAC optics. Some people find it Intimidating others like me love it.
You could always just get an optic for your m&p and shoot either class
With the .45 and the pump action shotgun, you could see I have plans to be able to shoot Heavy Metal someday. I think that would be cool.
It's different and not part of the crowd, which is nice to me. Bryan Ray was kind enough to converse with me online about M1A vs AR in 308. That's for another time as I get better.I don't want to get in a "Gear War" with people (so forget Open and why HM is interesting). Truth be told, I have the money to go all-out, but I don't have the time to commit to Open or shooting a ton of matches to get the enjoyment from a pile of gear purchases. The rules for Texas Multigun in April don't have a traditional Heavy Metal division. Instead they have Tactical-Heavy (which is Tactical but with a .30 cal rifle and one optic of any magnification). To me, the whole point of HM is all three guns being different, not just the rifle. So, that Tac-Heavy division isn't interesting. WW2 division is very interesting, but I'd need to invest in an M1 Garand that I would shoot at a match once or twice a year (if I'm lucky) and invest in a single stack .45. That's a lot of investment money even though I have a terrible crush on the M1 :-) I reluctantly decided to stick with either Tactical or Limited for this year. My question came down to what recommendations would people have for a first-time 3-gunner who have very little rifle time except bench work at the indoor range in 2011.
For April, I'll have time to practice with one set-up with my M&P15 Sport. I can see I will get a few optics as time goes by. But what's a good way to start so I don't get frustrated with either totally awful results, or having to fuss with gear within stages, or some other disappointment I cannot foresee??
Thanks.
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OK. What kind of rifle do you have? You can put a red dot on and still shoot limited. TacOps is what most new shooters shoot. If you are really a novice, you need to be very careful and practice handling your guns, not breaking the 180, putting safeties on. Pat Kelly-a great 3 Gun shooter gave me some great advice at my first 3 Gun Match. When you start you have to be consciously aware of everything you are doing as you do it. It will be slow compared to top shooters, but it will be fun and you will be safe. As you get better you progress through to become unconsciously aware as you shoot . Kind of walking through the match is the best way to describe it.
Thanks. I've got long term experience with pistols, so general safety is well in hand. I was a range safety officer at Edwards AFB 18 years ago. Also, I have taken two tactical pistol classes in recent months to improve my moving and shooting on pistol since I concealed carry regularly.
But you are certainly correct that at these early matches I will have to pay careful attention to long gun handling. I plan on some one-on-one training with a local PD & SWAT firearms instructor. He trained a contestant on Top Shot recently.
Gear-wise I have the following:
- Smith & Wesson M&P 9mm Pro 5"
- CZ 712 Utility shotgun
- Smith & Wesson M&P 15 Sport with MOE+ grip, ACS stock, and replacement MOE carbine hand guards
I also have:
- Smith & Wesson M&P 45 full-size
- Benelli Supernova 24" pump
Planning on a Safariland ELS set-up for my belt/holster/caddy rig.
It's the "Oh boy, now I have to finally buy an optic" that is worrying me. I've intentionally held off while I was flirting with the idea of WW2 Division for the Texas match (no optics in that division, but I'll pass on it this year). Thinking either Leupold Prismatic for a 1x (Limited) or a Vortex or Burris for 1-4x (Tactical). Price wise, those are in the same ballpark. That made me realize it won't be about money but instead about what a new rifle shooter should select for his Division as he starts 3-gun. I registered for Limited but I talked to them about switching divisions if I needed and the match staff were cool with that.
Thank you for your recommendations!
-- Mike
- Smith & Wesson M&P 9mm Pro 5"
I'm also a fairly terrible rifleman, for now. So, for the moment, I'm registered for Limited. I suspect the WW2 shooters will have more fun than anyone else at the match.
I call those "Mike will miss them for sure" targets.
Holster
in S&W (M&P, etc)
Posted
Anyone using one of these holsters with a 5" 9 Pro on a Safariland ELS rig?