jmbaccolyte

theycallmeingot-I plan to carry this pistol on duty, so I want to fix it before it breaks. Sin-ster- If I have to pay for all those parts or send it in for repair, maybe I'm carrying the wrong gun. I love the way the M&P feels in my hand, but my Beretta 96D & Tanfoglio Match have been reliable, while the two M&Ps (early models both, I guess) even at really low round counts (1,500 rounds each) have been unreliable to say the least. mcracco- I'm not sure I understand your comment. I said on 29 May 2012 - 07:55 PM: To aeropb- that's a sh*tload of spare parts!" To which you replied, "Count wise it really isn't." We procured the M&Ps used and the round count adds what we were told had been shot through the pistols (the owner didn't shoot much- probably not even that much) to what we actually shot (600 rounds apiece), but the problems I listed are just the problems that we had with the pistols, while we've had them. Are you saying 1,200 rounds (or even 3,000 rounds lifetime) should cause the problems I listed? If so, please reread the part of the original post that lists the parts that I replaced in a Beretta and a Tanfoglio while shooting over 55,000 rounds. S-391- I guess we screwed up by buying early M&Ps. But if you read everyone's post on this topic, I believe you will find that average respondent has had a fair amount of trouble with this model of pistol, if he shoots much. The striker problem still seems prevalent. I'm glad that your's work (do you work for S&W?). Just kidding, I love S&W revolvers for hunting and shooting paper, but prefer semi-autos for carry. I'm not yet sold on S&W semis, regardless of how well they feel in my hands, if I need a armorer to follow me around to keep them running, then perhaps they're not the right duty/carry pistol for me. I plan to run another 5,000 rounds through mine and if it sh*ts the bed much more, I'll have to make a list of shooters that I don't like, so I can sell it to one of them (but most shooters are really good people, so that may be a problem). Hopefully there won't be another reloading component shortage before the next election. I think the FAQS said don't discuss politics, so maybe I should close here instead of mentioning why I think we had the last component shortage.

feederic- Have you had a chance to load and shoot a few?

1006- I understand why you want to use the same powder for everything, it's a pain to dump out all the powder, clean it a little and refill it with a different kind of powder. Hogdgon lists 7.0 grains for 1,100fps at 26K psi at 1.125" OAL as the starting load for the 155 grain bullet. Some guys have done fine loading outside of the published reloading data, but I'd be careful. You may realize that you're giving up some efficiency by trying to use one powder for everything. For example, if you use WST in the .40 S&W, you can use less powder (with less felt recoil) and still make major, especially if you're loading longer than SAMMI specs. If your barrel throat is long enough, you should be able to use a longer OAL (loading longer allows for less chamber pressure) in a 1911 platform. Personally I would reserve AutoComp for the hottish .40 S&W loads. My $.02

Does anyone know whether the factory will supply the updated/redesigned parts free? The night sights are dated 2008. It sounds like I need the updated mag release, striker and updated sear housing (& larger sear spring)? Is there an updated slide stop (aka slide release) as well?

I've wondered about this too. Maybe you'll have to try it and let us know. Try it with a minor level load.

aeropb- that's a sh*tload of spare parts! Dr Mitch- I guess I'd better buy a spare striker too. Sin-ster- the night sights are dated 2008. Will S&W send me the updated mag release, striker and updated sear housing (& larger sear spring)? Is there an updated slide stop (aka slide release) as well? Thanks for the help.

A buddy and I have very low round count M&Ps (1,500 rounds) and we have had some problems with parts breakage and wear. First thing, his slide release broke and the slide started locking back when the magazine still had cartridges in it. Then my magazine release wore out and started dropping magazines by itself. Is the magazine release plastic all the way through, including the portion that retains the magazine in place? Then my trigger started failing to reset, so I couldn't fire again (this last was traced to a mildly dirty firing pin channel). I like the ergonomics of the M&P, but if these problems are common, I'll have to consider unloading it to some guy I don't like. I have fired about 50,000 rounds through a Beretta 96D and I broke two trigger return springs (since fixed permanently by a Wolff Gunsprings redesign of the part) and the lever that lifts the firing pin block out of the way (fixed by a Beretta redesign of the part). My Tanfoglio Witness Match has 5,000 rounds through it and I had to tighten the rear sight. Both pistols run fine with some dirt in them, although I normally keep them clean. Could someone with a fairly high round count tell me what to expect with this pistol?

+ 1 for WST. Its fairly cheap, burns pretty clean, recoils nicely, doesn't push the pressure limits to make major power levels like Clays, doesn't smoke as bad as Titegroup with lead bullets or require as much to do the job like slower powders. I use it at an OAL of 1.24" in my Tanfo .40 S&W with 10mm magazines. I bought an 8 pound jug of it at a major sporting goods store for $112 at the height of the last component shortage (they found it in the storage room after I asked them to look for larger bottles than they had on display). While I don't doubt that VV N320 is better, I expect we won't find many jugs of it with a two year old price sticker on it. WST is carried by most every store that sells components, so deals are more likely. I use Clays for powder puff loads to teach beginners to shoot handguns, but practice with major level loads myself. No experience with Solo, but Toby Keith wrote a song about it, so it must be good.

Will, my two cents worth is the Tanfo has a better trigger, but practicing the fundamentals properly is much more important than what pistol you're using.

I mostly shoot cast bullets, but then I don't use Titegrope. I've heard that Titegrope & cast bullets smoke terribly. You might want to do a search on that.

I am considering trading an older friend one size of primers for another size, but his primers are several years old (he doesn't remember exactly when he bought them; mid nineties is the best he can remember and if I found out later that they had been made in the mid eighties, then I should have demanded a three for two trade or something like that- cause I know mine are good). Just from my own (admittedly limited) experience, I've found that primers eventually go bad. I have heard that the factories advise that primers are good for ten years, but I have found it's more like 30-35 years (for non-corrosive primers) before you start getting FTF and then it's only 2-4 per 100 primers and I'm trying to pin down exactly how old his primers are. Oddly enough corrosive primers seem to last forever, as I've never had a problem with thousands of 80 year old corrosive primers. Although you do have to rinse your barrel out with hot water after shooting corrosive primers and then clean normally.

Blade-Tech makes one that I like.

Can I tell the date of manufacture from the lot number of Federal brand primers? Supposedly they were made in the mid nineties, but you know how the seller's memory can blur about such things even in honest people. Anyway, I'm looking at "LOT 1B 1738". They're No. 155, Magnum Large Pistol Primers. Thanks.

I have been running a .40 S&W at 10mm lengths (1.243" to 1.26" OAL). I've run 155 gr bullets with 5.9 grains of WST and 180 grain bullets with 4.8 grains of WST. Both are moderate loads. I am considering trying 3.5 grains of Clays with a 180 grain bullet at the long OAL. Sorry I couldn't help you with 200 grain bullets, but I expect any mid-range to fairly warm .40 S&W load will be pretty mild in a 10mm revolver if you load it to 1.25" OAL or thereabouts.

My Witness Match in .40 has plastic grips which I believe are probably much lighter than the earlier rubber grips, with no alterations it weighed 42.4 ounces. Correction/Edit: Sorry, that's with a K10 magazine (10mm -I've been loading long at 1.243" OAL) which has no spacer, unlike the .40 and I assume the 9mm.

My idea of trigger work is to take the gun to a smith with a good reputation for working on that brand of gun and ask politely.

That's a good idea, Nealio. I wouldn't be straying so far from SAAMI standards. I guess, though that the brass supply is limited to new. Probably not much departmental once fired available. Do they make the full size polymer witness in .38 Super or would that be a top end swapout?

I had leading issues with hard lead alloy bullets except in the top 10% of chamber pressures. It seems to me that the vendors supply harder alloys to the consumers because the hard alloy gets damaged less in shipping.

I ran across some older Vihta-Vouri (misspelling?) loading data on the 9x21mm cartridge and without going into the reason that cartridge was developed, it occurred to me that here we had Open Class pressure tested loading data for the long loaded (1.61" OAL) 9x19mm cartridge that amounted to mid-range .357 magnum power levels, but in a much thinner, lighter handgun that holds 14-16 rounds. However, after thinking about it, I realized that a Witness Polymer in 10mm would make more sense.

I do not yet own a CZ, but I have a lot of respect for the platform and am considering buying one. A Shadow in .40 is on my wish list because I have some once fired brass in that caliber. But back to the thread... 1) Could the slide stop failures be because the recoil spring is too weak? I prefer the way a pistol with a slightly soft recoil spring feels when I shoot. But Wolf Gunsprings company recommends that the ejected spent cases first hit the ground three to six feet away from the gun, if I remember correctly and it seems most pistols I watch during shooting, kick them a lot further. 2) Could the slide cracking be from people dropping the slide when the pistol is empty and therefore all of the force is focused on the slide when it slams forward? During normal firing, some energy is subtracted when chambering a new round. Just theory, but if we run a little stronger recoil spring and ride the slide forward when the magazine has been ejected, maybe we can reduce these particular failures even lower than they are now.

Thanks. So the worst case is that I'll have to have the barrel throated a little. I appreciate it. Do you know how these magazines differ from those for the steel witnesses?

I am thinking about buying a full size polymer Witness in 9mm. Can I load the 9mm out to 1.161" OAL and still fit in these mags? EAA lists the mags as EA9MP10 Full Size Polymer #101922. How do these mags differ from the steel witness mags?

Oh, okay,thanks. I appreciate it.

If Henning offers a reduced power firing pin block spring, I missed it on his website. I noticed that CajunGunWorks lists one for the CZ, will this fit my Witness Match? I can't give up the firing pin block for IDPA as I understand the rules and I may carry it anyway.

It seems that the forum is big enough to support differing opinions. I'm certain CHA-LEE, Joe4d, and TISCHLJ are above my skill level. But it seems to me that the higher you go, the harder you have to work for the next little increment of improvement. At my skill level, it wouldn't be a good idea to push the envelope like CHA-LEE is doing for a small gain, but it makes sense for an upper level guy. MHO, YMMV.