WS6

Maintenance is fine. It bothered me about the double feeds that could not be fixed was all, at least that was what was implied even though she'll stop replacement was hinted at.Supernova it will be. Was just curious what came out of spec so much at 15k.

I'm not sure what route to take, but I feel a PG style stock will offer me more control over the weapon in unconventional shooting positions as well as shooting from low-ready. Maybe it's just because I like the AR platform so much. I wonder if there are any Nova/Supernova's out there with 100K rounds without any breakages. I did find this, and it seems kindof dismal compared to other shotguns out there: http://www.rem870.com/2013/11/26/benelli-supernova-or-nova-must-have-repair-kit/

I did want to ask though...the 870P...I have a friend who is swat and also hosts a lot of training courses. He swears by the 870p. Will the Nova run with it for fit/finish, reliability, and last as many rounds without broken parts?

I like the PG stock on my m4. How is it on the supernova? What about the mesa urbino?

Thanks! Seems like this is the one I need. I'd like to put night sights, a limbsaver recoil pad (I plan on the PG stock, I just prefer them, as it allows easier 1-handed use inextremis. I used to not look at or think about 1-handed use until I began training more seriously with the M4 carbine and Kyle Lamb and hearing from friends of my own who have had or seen someone injur a hand and need to run a gun 1 handed. The field stock is not nearly as good for that. Hence no comfortech stock for me, it seems.), and a +2 extension from Nordic on it (I want it just shy of the end of the barrel, I think +2 is all I can get). I plan on using a Benelli M4 7-shot mag-tube spring I have as it will have a similar length tube, so why not? I have a spare from when I orderd the tube for my M4, and it's custom made by Wolff upon request for a 7-shot tube, and the Nordic follower specific to this application. I know in some pump guns, the magazine spring is an item that is finicky. It cannot be too weak, OR too strong. Is the Nova picky about this, or is stronger just fine as long as you have room for the shells?

Solid. I don't think you have to worry about me challenging you at any matches any time soon. How is the barrel/receiver lock-up? Is it steel on steel and tight? I notice the pictures of barrel tangs I see on replacement barrels are not as long as the autoloaders. Interested in this mainly for regarding slug accuracy. I would like minute of palm at 50 yards and minute of paper-plate at 100 yards with slugs it likes. Also, all the plastic coating...does the bolt/carrier/rails ride on polymer coated steel, or directly on steel itself within the receiver? Reason I ask, is I recall horror stories (rumors?) of the Remington 887 wearing through the polymer or allowing moisture under it and creating a rust nightmare if you get it wet.

You should have no issues with heavy slug loads other then to your shoulder. And I would offer that the Benelli Super Nova is a great pumpgun choice! Hah! Yours was one of the HK VP9 reviews I saw a while back! Good shooting! If it works for you, I highly doubt I will ever "outgrow it"! How many rounds have you had through your Nova? I keep remembering all of those Benelli commercial/ads with the Argentinian dove-hunts and the M1 and how many rounds they lasted. Are the Nova's capable of dizzying numbers like that, or not so much?

One more thing...I held and looked at a few Nova and Supernova tacticals at Bass Pro, and the barrels (near the muzzle, as that's all I could really see to gauge) looked very thin-walled. Am I just used to my Benelli M1014, and are these the wall thickness of 870P and 590 non-A1 models, or are they legitimately "thin"? Would firing stuff like Dixie Slugs and 3" Brenneke Gold slugs and other heavy stuff through them be a no-no?

Looks good! I have been doing some googling, and found one post from a moderator on another forum stating that the Nova's had had some polymer/shell-frame separation issues in the past, but it was never elaborated on. Has the Supernova ever had this issue, or was it exposed/diagnosed/fixed/bad batch, or what? Further, have read of several people "improving firing pin travel" to fix issues with light strikes. What's up with that? Also, one thing that keeps cropping up is I find people complaining that when they work the action the first round shoots out onto the ground because the shell-lifter is not in the correct location. This spawned "The Benelli Trigger Fix" videos all over YouTube, it seems, once I searched YouTube using that phrase. Is this something I should worry about? Another thing...I don't like things touching the barrel. Is the clamp on that extension necessary? I wanted the +2 or +3, nothing past the muzzle. Still needed for such a short piece? Other than the alleged trigger/action issues, and polyer separation, and light-strikes, I have not seen anything undesireable on the old Google.

I know it's for fun, and I LOL'ed, but serious question...that mag tube is in danger of being shot off, isn't it? I don't like anything past my muzzle unless it says "Surefire" on it and has a serial #, personally, but I know many people do run a mag-tube past the muzzle on a shotgun, but nothing like that...

I am not necessarily looking for a gun for 3-gun, but I want a gun that would be good for all the things 3 gun demands (speed and ease of use, reliability over high volumes of fire, etc.). I want a pump gun so I can use it for reduced-recoil 8-pellet loads that won't function in some autoloaders. My M1014 stops at 9-pellet reduced recoil, and that is cycled somewhat weakly. I also want a pump gun because getting soaked with rain and unable to clean it immediately just kindof bothers me on a $1K+ autoloader, as well as just personally enjoying a good pump action shotgun...just because? I have looked at the 870P, but have heard (and seen personally) that Remington's 870 line is somewhat reduced in quality compared to years gone by. I am not interested in an 870. The Mossberg 590a1's I have seen in person are all broken from the start. I have only seen 2, but 2 out of 2 were abject duds. One was an SPX 590a1 that I bought for a friend for Christmas, and the mag-tube threads were so buggered that it takes literally 5-10 minutes to put the mag cap back on unless you "get lucky" and place it just so. You have to force it down on the threads 1/4", and then not crossthread the buggered threads. It was like that when I bought it, not "after a few shooting trips..." The second is a 590a1 I looked at today, with the short stock. It was completely missing the end-cap retaining "BB". Just a vacant hole in the barrel hanger ring. Piss poor QC/QA for Mossberg has turned me off to their products, based on my admittedly LIMITED experience. I did look at 2 Nova's by Benelli today, as well. They had all their parts and seemed to function fine as far as one can test function at Bass Pro. I am also a fan of Benelli, because of the use of chrome-lined hammer forged barrels. SO much easier to clean for me after shooting a bunch of slugs. So, my questions are: Is the Supernova preferred over the Nova, even if the end-user has no preference for the style of stock either way? Why/why not? Are the Nova family reliable over high volumes of fire (the Benelli autoloaders are presumed "just broken in" at 100K+ rounds. Does the Nova family match this?) Do they go down more or less often in practice of matches than other competitors, and how do they directly compare to the Benelli M1 and M2 family for high-volume reliability/parts breakage? Any other info on the Nova family would be appreciated! I am looking at the 18.5" w/GRS version of the Nova or Supernova. Like I said, not planning any 3-gun with it, but I know some people in 3-gun like them and I think 3-gun is an excellent "test bed" for a weapon. Thank-you again!

That day is coming. Arresting a lot of people engaged in "paramilitary training" or "combat games" as one Federal Court Case called it, for having illegal weapons would be a nice media frenzy for them. It would also be a good way to put a black eye on a sport that has increasing social acceptance. It wouldn't matter that most of the charges would be dismissed, or fought and won eventually. There are enough laws in this country that everyone is guilty of something. In legal battles with the government there is no winning; only how bad do you lose. You cannot out spend the people that tax you. IIRC it was 1989. The HK imported Benellis for example were often imported in what would be non-sporting configurations now. There was a recent ruling that the NFA (that can be owned or manufactured by individuals) no longer exempts guns from 922r. Someone had to go and specifically ask. There are an increasing number of US made parts for benellis that easily put them in the realm of compliance. I shudder just to think of all you people getting togather in small groups (cells?) out in the middle of nowhere with your 922R violating weapons and training for hours on end with them. To that end, I am happy to report that CC in conjunction with Geissele is bringing 922R compliant (read: AMerican) trigger group components (currently just the hammer, within the next month or so, with plans for more parts later) to market for the Benelli M4. I do not know if this part is interchangeable with the M2 or not, but it's worth a look at a diagram!

Well at least collapsible M4 stocks are only around $225 or so.

It can, not saying it will, but it can.

Try a different brand of slug.

Sorry, I mis-typed. Bolt-handle/charger. Also I have a Ti mag-tube and love it. There is even a guy who will 1-off you a 5-shot Ti tube if your M4 is an SBS and you want to upgrade from the OEM tube to a lighter one.

How do red-dots (Jpoint,etc.) do, or does that put you in a different division?

I don't know if that is sarcasm or not, but SBS (14") M4S90 barrels are pretty common-place.

LaRue MG Lube is what I reach for when I want a thin lube that will not burn off.

For 3-gun, I can see that the M4 is second-rate. For other uses, I would view the M2 as second rate. However, this is about 3-gun. Lots of parts for the M4 are poorly made. You need to know the right people to buy from if you don't want hack stuff. Tewlman was one such guy who made things CORRECTLY for the M4. Sadly, he no-longer does, so us M4 owners had to find another guy who owned a machine-shop and was handy with titanium alloy to build us proper bolts, magazine tubes, compensators, and 1913 rails and the like.

Some people like to advance a theory contrary to the masses and have it disproven rather than simply take the word of the masses. I myself fall into that category. I have learned and improved many things via this method. Does it make you popular? Not always. However, if you use the technique correctly, it WILL make you better.

What kind of support are you looking for with the M4S90? Hands-on modification, or parts? If parts, most anything can be had for the M4 if you know the right people.

I am not Mr. Hill, but I do know from previous posts that one shotgun he enjoys using is the Benelli M2, and I suspect he has modified it somewhat as well.

Very possible. M4's don't seem to like those kinds of wads. I have owned several and none would keep the pellets on a 12x20" target past about 20 yards or so. Up until then, they produced great patterns. I think it has a lot to do with the more gradual constriction of the choke in the M2. I suppose I could try the M4 with a Cyl. choke instead of IC. With the Flite Control wad, choke has a lot to do with it. In an 870 Police Magnum shotgun with a 18" IC choke barrel, it will consistently give a 14"-15" pattern at 25 yards. This is our issue shotgun and issue buckshot. With an 870 Police Magnum with a 18" CYL choke barrel, it will give 7"-9" inch patterns. In a Mossberg 590A1 CYL, I have seen consistent patterns of less than 6". My Benelli M2 with the IC choke will put it in 5"-7" patterns. When I pattern with a MOD choke it will open it up to 10"-12" patterns with vertical stringing. Moving to a IMP MOD choke, it patterns around 10"-15" inches. FULL is even worse. Our agency had tested this load extensively and have found that the more constrictive the choke, (using a standard Remchokes and Benelli CRIO chokes), we get increased pellet deformation we due to the design of the Flite Control wad. The wad itself is very thick (like a platic cup) and we have found that the the pellets are remaining nestled in the wad for a longer distance while traveling down the barrel. The pellets are clustered together more than conventional wad buckshot when they reach the choke, and they are compressed against each other leading to increased deformation. I have no experience with extended chokes or chokes with longer taper, but then I have not found the need yet. My buddy runs a Benelli M4 with the MOD choke and gets consistent 7" patterns with it. He also has a Rem 870 with a Vang barrel and you have to aim that thing like a rifle. 8 pellet Flite Control will run patterns the size of your fist at 25 yards. If the Flite Control is not giving you the performance that you desire, try loosening up the amount of choke that you are using. Too bad we purchased all the 870's with IC barrels before we started issuing 8 pellet. 12"-15" is still an improvement over the old 00 that we used to issue. As always, some barrels are happier with certain loads. Very good info. Because I was getting junk patterns even with an IC constriction, I just wrote the stuff off. The Benelli uses a .728" bore, IIRC (which is pretty narrow) and so ANY constriction may be fouling things. I noted exactly what you did. Every "constriction" loosened, gave me 5 yards more of "good" pattern. I didn't buy a cylinder choke, but I might well try it. Kinda irritating because that limits me to just that load, though. Do you know the constriction of the remington bore? I know Mossberg's are usually HUGE, and Vang's barrels have a very gentle constriction, so they are a different animal all togather. I will go ahead and order a Cylinder choke from Briley and try it out, as much as I grit my teeth at the idea. I wonder if the 8-pellet reduced recoil stuff will cycle my M4S90. A good experiement I guess. Again, thankyou for the in-depth information! *I have found the *rougher* the choke, the tighter the pattern, all things being equal. This isn't very scientific, but the tightest patterning choke I had was an IC Benelli OEM choke that looked all grooved up inside. I think it retarded the wad a bit. After much thought I am going to stick with my 000 buckshot. Going to order some Federal 2.75" 000 and some more REmington 000 and an LM choke instead of a CYL choke and hit the patterning board again. Perhapse I can improve

Very possible. M4's don't seem to like those kinds of wads. I have owned several and none would keep the pellets on a 12x20" target past about 20 yards or so. Up until then, they produced great patterns. I think it has a lot to do with the more gradual constriction of the choke in the M2. I suppose I could try the M4 with a Cyl. choke instead of IC. With the Flite Control wad, choke has a lot to do with it. In an 870 Police Magnum shotgun with a 18" IC choke barrel, it will consistently give a 14"-15" pattern at 25 yards. This is our issue shotgun and issue buckshot. With an 870 Police Magnum with a 18" CYL choke barrel, it will give 7"-9" inch patterns. In a Mossberg 590A1 CYL, I have seen consistent patterns of less than 6". My Benelli M2 with the IC choke will put it in 5"-7" patterns. When I pattern with a MOD choke it will open it up to 10"-12" patterns with vertical stringing. Moving to a IMP MOD choke, it patterns around 10"-15" inches. FULL is even worse. Our agency had tested this load extensively and have found that the more constrictive the choke, (using a standard Remchokes and Benelli CRIO chokes), we get increased pellet deformation we due to the design of the Flite Control wad. The wad itself is very thick (like a platic cup) and we have found that the the pellets are remaining nestled in the wad for a longer distance while traveling down the barrel. The pellets are clustered together more than conventional wad buckshot when they reach the choke, and they are compressed against each other leading to increased deformation. I have no experience with extended chokes or chokes with longer taper, but then I have not found the need yet. My buddy runs a Benelli M4 with the MOD choke and gets consistent 7" patterns with it. He also has a Rem 870 with a Vang barrel and you have to aim that thing like a rifle. 8 pellet Flite Control will run patterns the size of your fist at 25 yards. If the Flite Control is not giving you the performance that you desire, try loosening up the amount of choke that you are using. Too bad we purchased all the 870's with IC barrels before we started issuing 8 pellet. 12"-15" is still an improvement over the old 00 that we used to issue. As always, some barrels are happier with certain loads. Very good info. Because I was getting junk patterns even with an IC constriction, I just wrote the stuff off. The Benelli uses a .728" bore, IIRC (which is pretty narrow) and so ANY constriction may be fouling things. I noted exactly what you did. Every "constriction" loosened, gave me 5 yards more of "good" pattern. I didn't buy a cylinder choke, but I might well try it. Kinda irritating because that limits me to just that load, though. Do you know the constriction of the remington bore? I know Mossberg's are usually HUGE, and Vang's barrels have a very gentle constriction, so they are a different animal all togather. I will go ahead and order a Cylinder choke from Briley and try it out, as much as I grit my teeth at the idea. I wonder if the 8-pellet reduced recoil stuff will cycle my M4S90. A good experiement I guess. Again, thankyou for the in-depth information! *I have found the *rougher* the choke, the tighter the pattern, all things being equal. This isn't very scientific, but the tightest patterning choke I had was an IC Benelli OEM choke that looked all grooved up inside. I think it retarded the wad a bit.