Hello everyone, another newbie here.

[boba]

Hi all, I have been lurking for a couple of weeks now and joined the forum several days ago. My name is Bob and I live in the Mid Michigan area. I am going to the CCRC club in Williamston Mi this Saturday to watch a IPDA match and see if I can get a feel for the equipment needed. I think they have a IPSC match a few weeks later and will watch that one also. The only pistol I have at the moment is a recently purchased Ruger MKIII. I wanted something cheap to shoot and this fit the ticket. I shot a MKII years ago when I was on a leage shooting bullseye.

For IDPA and IPSC competition I am looking at a pristine condition SW model 935 with the original box, paperwork, and 2 mags. I googled this model and found I can readily get parts for what appears to me to be a cheap price. Looks like extra mags will cost around $30.00 ea. I am also looking at a Ruger SR9 that felt really good in my hands but I wouldn't be able to shoot until Ruger has completed the recall. I am on a pretty tight budget and will still need to pay the joining fees, buy a holster, extra mags and holder for the mags so I have to stay in the sub $500.00 for the gun purchase. Any input you may have about these two choices or another model that is in this price range would be geatly appreciated.

I have watched a lot of videos on U tube and some posted on this board and all of them have been very helpful. Also this link:

http://www.craigcentral.com/idpaipsc.asp

helped to clarify some of the difference's there are between the two games.

In addition I have downloaded the IPSC competition rules pdf and have read through this. Seems like a lot to remember but I suppose it is like anything else, just take it slow and easy and I will get there.

I am 54 and not in to bad of shape so I am hoping I will be able to handle the physical part of the competition.

Thanks for letting me take up some up some of your time and I look forward to reading more on the forum.

Bob

[chirpy]

Welcome to the forum and to the wonderful world of IDPA and/or USPSA. I have been competing in USPSA for over 25 years and IDPA since the beginning almost (I'm 61). The forum is very informative and helpful (and crazy sometimes - check out the Humor thread if you don't believe me!). The best part about both sports is you compete at your own level and ability and progress at your own speed (TOO SLOW USUALLY). I suggest you check out practice nights also. They are more likely to give you the opportunity to check out equipment and etc. under less stressfull/more laid back conditions.

Richard

[G-ManBart]

Welcome Bob!

I won't say that a Smith 935 is a bad choice, but it's certainly not what I'd consider a mainstream choice. Sometimes that's for good reason and other times it's not. I'd suggest that often a more mainstream choice is better because there's more support for it, more gunsmiths will be familiar with it if you need work on it and should you need anything, the parts will be cheaper. An example is that you're going to need about half a dozen magazines for USPSA Production division. If you go with the 935, that's another $120 compared with a Glock where it might be half that.

It shouldn't be too hard to find a decent Glock, Springfield XD, Smith M&P etc for around $500. I think the success of those three are more than a coincidence and might save you time in the long run.

Even before buying a gun, get out to the matches, talk with the shooters there and see what they're using....don't even think about listening to what people in gun shops tell you....they simply don't know what works and what doesn't work. It's pretty common for someone in a club to have a complete rig they're looking to sell far cheaper than you can piece it together for yourself. All it takes is an interest and letting folks know that you're looking to get started. Good luck, be safe, and have fun!

[Paul Burtchell]

Hi Bob & welcome to the shooting sports and the Forum

G-Man just gave you some good advice. Watch, read and ask LOTS of questions and then make your own decisions.

I would suggest shooting as many guns as you can get your hands on to see what you like and do not like and what you shoot the best. Most of us shooters are more than happy to share our equipment to let you see what you think of a particular gun.

Again, welcome.

[mlmiller1]

Welcome to the forum. Great advice you got up there. I will just say I agree with it & second(or third) that advice. Remember as you look at the rules, uspsa is the version of ipsc most often played here in the U.S. Ipsc is the international version. There are lots of differences in the rules.

MLM

[boba]

Welcome to the forum and to the wonderful world of IDPA and/or USPSA. I have been competing in USPSA for over 25 years and IDPA since the beginning almost (I'm 61). The forum is very informative and helpful (and crazy sometimes - check out the Humor thread if you don't believe me!). The best part about both sports is you compete at your own level and ability and progress at your own speed (TOO SLOW USUALLY). I suggest you check out practice nights also. They are more likely to give you the opportunity to check out equipment and etc. under less stressfull/more laid back conditions.

Richard

Hi Richard, your right about the humor, I was reading some of it the other night and was laughing to myself and my wife wonder what to heck I was doing.

I would love to check out practice nights but the range is 45 miles from my home and the price of gas has gone out of sight here. I did set up a 21 foot range on my property and plan to practice there when I can. Once I get it set up I will post some pics..nothing fancy but I have a good berm already to start with.

Thanks,

Bob

Edited April 25, 2008 by boba

[boba]

Welcome Bob!

I won't say that a Smith 935 is a bad choice, but it's certainly not what I'd consider a mainstream choice. Sometimes that's for good reason and other times it's not. I'd suggest that often a more mainstream choice is better because there's more support for it, more gunsmiths will be familiar with it if you need work on it and should you need anything, the parts will be cheaper. An example is that you're going to need about half a dozen magazines for USPSA Production division. If you go with the 935, that's another $120 compared with a Glock where it might be half that.

It shouldn't be too hard to find a decent Glock, Springfield XD, Smith M&P etc for around $500. I think the success of those three are more than a coincidence and might save you time in the long run.

Even before buying a gun, get out to the matches, talk with the shooters there and see what they're using....don't even think about listening to what people in gun shops tell you....they simply don't know what works and what doesn't work. It's pretty common for someone in a club to have a complete rig they're looking to sell far cheaper than you can piece it together for yourself. All it takes is an interest and letting folks know that you're looking to get started. Good luck, be safe, and have fun!

Gman, thanks for the opinion and you are probably right about the mainstream and I am weighing that on my decision. I do have one question though about the need for 5 mags. Is that because the mag for the S&W 935 is a low rnd count mag? Would I need less mags if I bought the Ruger SR9 that has an 18 rnd mag?

Thanks,

Bob

Edited April 25, 2008 by boba

[boba]

Welcome to the forum. Great advice you got up there. I will just say I agree with it & second(or third) that advice. Remember as you look at the rules, uspsa is the version of ipsc most often played here in the U.S. Ipsc is the international version. There are lots of differences in the rules.

MLM

MLM you know I was getting confused between the acronyms thanks for the heads up. I am reading everything I can and trying to keep it all straight..))))

Thanks,

bob

Edited April 25, 2008 by boba

[boba]

Hi Bob & welcome to the shooting sports and the Forum

G-Man just gave you some good advice. Watch, read and ask LOTS of questions and then make your own decisions.

I would suggest shooting as many guns as you can get your hands on to see what you like and do not like and what you shoot the best. Most of us shooters are more than happy to share our equipment to let you see what you think of a particular gun.

Again, welcome.

baerburtchell, your right I am very good advise here and am looking forward to watching tomorrow's match at CCRC.

Thanks,

Bob

[G-ManBart]

Gman, thanks for the opinion and you are probably right about the mainstream and I am weighing that on my decision. I do have one question though about the need for 5 mags. Is that because the mag for the S&W 935 is a low rnd count mag? Would I need less mags if I bought the Ruger SR9 that has an 18 rnd mag?

Thanks,

Bob

Generally speaking, for Single Stack, Production and Limited-10 you'll see folks with at least four or five mags on their belt with another in the gun to start. In SS you pretty much reload every time you move between positions. If it's a 32 round course you're going to reload a minimum of three or four times shooting any of those divisions, so you're at a minimum of four mags....miss a couple of times and you'd better have another mag on you. It's always possible to drop one and grabbing another off the belt is a lot faster than picking one up off the ground (and it's probably dirty). I'd guess that most folks have five on the belt for all of those divisions.

The Ruger would be best suited for Production division where you're limited to 10 rounds in the mag, so you're still looking at three reloads during a long stage. You could shoot it in Limited-10, but you'd still have the same number of reloads. In Limited you'd need less reloads, but it honestly wouldn't be very competitive there...minor scoring and down several rounds in mag capacity to the specialized Limited guns (tons of folks have 20 and 21 round .40 mags).

[Matt Griffin]

If you aren't set against Glocks, there's a guy with a heck of a deal on used LEO glocks here: http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=852186.

H.

[boba]

If you aren't set against Glocks, there's a guy with a heck of a deal on used LEO glocks here: http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=852186.

H.

H, thanks I got back to this thread too late. Looks like they are all gone. To bad for me....

[chirpy]

Just another word about mags...It's a pain in the a$$ if you have 2 stages in the same bay and have to take time to reload your mags before you start the second stage. Grab and go is better. It's done a lot but if you can buy more mags do so. I would love to have a range on my property but I haven't hit the lottery yet. Good luck on yours.

Richard

[boba]

Just another word about mags...It's a pain in the a$$ if you have 2 stages in the same bay and have to take time to reload your mags before you start the second stage. Grab and go is better. It's done a lot but if you can buy more mags do so. I would love to have a range on my property but I haven't hit the lottery yet. Good luck on yours.

Richard

Richard, after watching the match yesterday in Williamston I know the 2 mags won't cut it. Right now I am looking at this pistol locally

http://m1911.org/prodte30.htm

mags are cheap plus other parts are cheap and are readily available

[ChrisStock]

Bob, again, welcome to the forums!

That's the pistol frame I'm building on for SingleStack competition now. It is a great pistol to start with, and yes, parts are everywhere along with a ton of advice. I have replaced the beavertail, as the stock one literally beat my hand bloody at one 500 round practice, and I am having the sights replaced this week to compensate for my own fading visual acuity. It will run all day long on near anything I throw in it...not a bad pistol design at all Everyone here will help you get up and running in no time.

[G-ManBart]

Richard, after watching the match yesterday in Williamston I know the 2 mags won't cut it. Right now I am looking at this pistol locally

http://m1911.org/prodte30.htm

mags are cheap plus other parts are cheap and are readily available

There's nothing wrong with a Springer Mil-Spec, but for a similar amount of money an STI Spartan is a better buy for someone looking to shoot USPSA on a budget. It's already got most everything done to it you'd eventually do to the Springfield....fiber optic front sight, adjustable rear sight, high-rise beavertail etc. About the only two things it doesn't have are ambi-safeties and a magwell.

I'd give Chuck a call at Shooter's Connection or the folks at Dawson Precision (both forum sponsors) and see if they have any in stock...I'd expect a touch under $600 from either (Dawson lists them for $594).

Edited April 28, 2008 by G-ManBart

[ChrisStock]

Here's a link to one listed at Dawson...sage advice from G-ManBart. In hindsight, I wish I'd gone that route, but in my case, the journey to what I want is indeed half of the adventure.

[chirpy]

Just a word about cheap mags...we started out using cheap mags because Wilson and McCormick hadn't come out with their mags yet and Colt mags were too expensive. Some of the cheap mags worked well, some didn't. Those that didn't were used in practice and not matches to save the good ones. When Wilson mags came out we bought as many as we could afford and saved to buy more. They were 7 rounders at first and then he came out with his 8 round conversion kits and we bought them. That was 25+ years ago and I still have all of mine and they continue to work every time (I sometimes carry a full size 1911 and use these mags). I consider that a good/wise investment. I know money is tight (I'm retired and on a fixed income) but you might save and buy good mags. You won't be sorry.

Richard

Edited April 28, 2008 by chirpy

[G-ManBart]

This is the sort of deal you want to keep your eyes open for here and on the USPSA classifieds:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=748647

[boba]

This is the sort of deal you want to keep your eyes open for here and on the USPSA classifieds:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=748647

CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I watched this board from work but couldn't reply to anything....that was a good buy.

[boba]

Richard, after watching the match yesterday in Williamston I know the 2 mags won't cut it. Right now I am looking at this pistol locally

http://m1911.org/prodte30.htm

mags are cheap plus other parts are cheap and are readily available

There's nothing wrong with a Springer Mil-Spec, but for a similar amount of money an STI Spartan is a better buy for someone looking to shoot USPSA on a budget. It's already got most everything done to it you'd eventually do to the Springfield....fiber optic front sight, adjustable rear sight, high-rise beavertail etc. About the only two things it doesn't have are ambi-safeties and a magwell.

I'd give Chuck a call at Shooter's Connection or the folks at Dawson Precision (both forum sponsors) and see if they have any in stock...I'd expect a touch under $600 from either (Dawson lists them for $594).

I would have to go through a gun broker or somthing correct? I wonder how much mark up they would want.

[Matt Griffin]

Richard, after watching the match yesterday in Williamston I know the 2 mags won't cut it. Right now I am looking at this pistol locally

http://m1911.org/prodte30.htm

mags are cheap plus other parts are cheap and are readily available

There's nothing wrong with a Springer Mil-Spec, but for a similar amount of money an STI Spartan is a better buy for someone looking to shoot USPSA on a budget. It's already got most everything done to it you'd eventually do to the Springfield....fiber optic front sight, adjustable rear sight, high-rise beavertail etc. About the only two things it doesn't have are ambi-safeties and a magwell.

I'd give Chuck a call at Shooter's Connection or the folks at Dawson Precision (both forum sponsors) and see if they have any in stock...I'd expect a touch under $600 from either (Dawson lists them for $594).

I would have to go through a gun broker or somthing correct? I wonder how much mark up they would want.

15$ to 25$ should be the proper range for an FFL transfer.

H.

[G-ManBart]

I would have to go through a gun broker or somthing correct? I wonder how much mark up they would want.

As Houngan said, something like $25 is pretty typical. Some shops will crank it up to like $50 to discourage buying from other sources, but I'm sure the folks at the local club can tell you who has the best deal. Pretty good chance there are one or two folks in the club that have their FFL and will do it for a minimal fee. Here's a link to an FFL finder. I'm pretty sure Shotgun news and a few other sites have them as well.

http://gun-deals.com/fflfinder

[boba]

Well I thought I would check back in with everybody and let you know what I ended up doing. I got this S&W Model 59 from the original owner. Before I bought it I had a pistol smith look it over first and he said it was as good as new and didn't appear to be shot much (what ever that meant). Any way I gave $370 for it with 2 mags and bought a 3rd 10 rnd mag for $39.00 locally. I also picked up at holster (Front Line belt slide) and a dual mag holder (Fobus) and 250 rnds of Remington UMC 115gr. bullets.

The pistol feels great in my hand and has a fantastic trigger pull. Very smooth but could use an overtravel adjustment. I shot 50 rounds through it at the range w/o any problems. I need to add something to the front sights so I can see them in lower lighting conditions as I had a heck of a time seeing the front sight. It's all black.

Sunday will be my first match (USPSA) wish me luck .

Any way here it is:

Thanks again everone!

[G-ManBart]

If you can find another mag or two, get it before the match. Some field courses are 32 rounds and you'll be one short. There are lots of stages that are 24-28 rounds and you could run dry if you miss even a couple of times. Some clubs will have stages longer than that, but it's not terribly common as the rule book says 32 is the max (level I matches can get around this). Good luck!

Bart