To shoot on the move or not to shoot on the move?

[Robco]

Yea it pretty much kicked my butt... Here is what on another thread after the match....

It was my first big match. I made mistakes on every stage except the last one. Lanny Bassham would say I shouldn't focus on the mistakes, but only on the things I did right... Well that's a pretty short list. I actually experienced butterflies (a real tingling in my gut) before we started shooting the first stage. I think I literally fumbled a mag (that is dropped on the ground) on the first 3 stages. On stage 1 I forgot to change my mag as I was dropping to shoot from my knee. No big deal... but when I went to grab the mag it was empty... EMPTY!!! I was so freakin disgusted with myself I forgot to walk over and step on the dadgum activator and got a procedural. It was really getting comical at that point. I hope everyone enjoyed it.

My excuse du jour was that I only had about 5 hours of sleep the first day, and 5-1/2 on the second. WAAA!

The one thing I did do right was go. Everyone on Squad 27 was helpful and I had an awesome experience.

I was over cautious on targets I could have shot faster and really didn't do any shooting on the move. I tend to shoot low, nevertheless I decided to try the targets on the right side of stage 7 from the front of the stage. BIG NS... STUPID STUPID STUPID!!! I also think I may have had a malfunction or two because I didn't clean my mags. Lastly, I never saw the little black popper in the back left side of stage 3. I've never counted my shots from beginning to the end of a stage to make sure it matches the instructions. There's no reason why all these things couldn't have been properly addressed before the buzzer went off.

Oh well.. I went to learn and have new experience, and that's exactly what I got. There wasn't any one thing that was super difficult, but everything together added up to be very challenging for me.

Next step. Find a trainer...

Ha. I like your attitude. That was a very tough match. Heard a few people complaining it was so hard. The swingers were almost all arcing type, same as at Area 2 (you only see them while they are moving, not reversing). And tons of long shots with N/S's too.

Anyway, if you work at and stick with it all, it gets better, little by little. I would get the 3GM videos as a good start for learning all the fundamentals. You can watch them as many times and as often as you like. You have Manny Bragg down at Universal Shooting academy, not so far from you, who is a top, full time trainer in our sport. I would consider getting some training with Manny. But in the mean time, the DVDs will teach you a lot. The more you know, the more you will get out of all of your live fire, match experience and any training.

I shoot Area 2, starting tomorrow. Spent 6 hours today studying the stages. Many stages I will never be still while shooting. Going to be some high HF stages!

[Not-So-Mad Matt]

Moving sideways (not to or away from the target(s)) is the hardest variety. Manny Bragg and I spent a half hour and 200 rounds proving our limitations on this scenario. 4 full-open IPSC targets, spaced 3 yards apart. We moved in a line parallel to them. We found, consistently, that my maximum range was 7 yards. At 8 yards I threw C's. At 7 yards, all A's. Manny, a top 5 or 10 in the world shooter, was only 1 yard longer than my limitation. His was at 8 yards.

That's a helpful benchmark!

[Robco]

Moving sideways (not to or away from the target(s)) is the hardest variety. Manny Bragg and I spent a half hour and 200 rounds proving our limitations on this scenario. 4 full-open IPSC targets, spaced 3 yards apart. We moved in a line parallel to them. We found, consistently, that my maximum range was 7 yards. At 8 yards I threw C's. At 7 yards, all A's. Manny, a top 5 or 10 in the world shooter, was only 1 yard longer than my limitation. His was at 8 yards.

That's a helpful benchmark!

Good deal. But generalize this to ALL aspects of your shooting game. What are your limitations (capabilities) on EACH type of situation? I chose poorly on a stage (8) in Area 2 yesterday, and decided to go for it on a first array where you had to drop a weighted bag in both hands at start, onto a stomp pad activator which activated two screaming fast clam-shells with a full paper in between the clam-shells. Well, I did it, but got two N/S penalties and a mike in the process. One was a hit and N/S at the top 1/4 inch of the N/S on the draw target clam-shell, and also a to 1 inch N/S which did not break the top perf so was not a hit. No WAY to call these at the speed we are talking about. Got all my other hits on the stage, with a pretty good time, but the 35 point HOLE made by those two shots on the Clam-shells, killed me. Had I slowed down a bit (i.e., taken a different approach/choice), and instead, shot ONLY one shot on each N/S before it closed and then a head shot on each after it closed, it would have added about 1 second max to my time, and completely eliminated the risks. My actual HF for the stage was 4.833. Had I done it the smarter way, as described above, and had one A and one B on the heads, (no Miss and Not the two N/S) = my HF would have been 6.420. Dumb CHOICE. That would be 33% MORE POINTS (42.6 stage points for nothing!!) for me on that stage. A tragedy caused by not knowing my limitations and then acting appropriately.

[b1gcountry]

Watch the video in post 19. It is amazing how much faster they are shooting on the move even though it looks much slower.

Edited March 9, 2015 by b1gcountry

[cnote]

Watch the video in post 19. It is amazing how much faster they are adoring on the move even though it looks much slower.

Great example of time difference, but you need to take into consideration points and hit factor,

If shooting all A's then moving wins every time in this scenario , throw in some minor power factor C hits amt the numbers may change or equalize out

[waktasz]

The idea is to practice it to extend that max distance that you can shoot on the move and still hit all A's. Frankly I'm surprised to hear that Manny's max distance was so short.

[Robco]

Watch the video in post 19. It is amazing how much faster they are adoring on the move even though it looks much slower.

Yes, but we do not know their hits or hit factor. But I like the experiment. It is much as I have done.

[Robco]

Watch the video in post 19. It is amazing how much faster they are adoring on the move even though it looks much slower.

Great example of time difference, but you need to take into consideration points and hit factor,

If shooting all A's then moving wins every time in this scenario , throw in some minor power factor C hits amt the numbers may change or equalize out

Ha, I just made the same response, before seeing yours cnote. I guess it is obvious!

[waktasz]

Watch the video in post 19. It is amazing how much faster they are adoring on the move even though it looks much slower.

Yes, but we do not know their hits or hit factor. But I like the experiment. It is much as I have done.

We shot that video at an all A's, or very close to it, pace.

Edited March 9, 2015 by waktasz

[Robco]

The idea is to practice it to extend that max distance that you can shoot on the move and still hit all A's. Frankly I'm surprised to hear that Manny's max distance was so short.

Well, do not try to read too much into this. The SPEED of movement while shooting on the move is not really discussed in my own example with Manny. In other words, we were not timing it. We were simply moving at a constant rate of speed for ourselves. Essentially the fastest speed we could do and not get too out of control with the introduction of gun movement in the process. Thus the accuracy standard - all A's.

If we moved much slower, we could extend the distances accordingly. But then you reduce the value of shooting on the move significantly enough to rule it out - better then to shoot and run.

Good catch though.

Of course this is something subject to change via training, up to a point. You can only get so low while moving at a speed that will be beneficial on the clock, so for each of us, there is a point where we cannot go any further. Once you slow down enough to be able to get all A hits, then at that speed, and that distance, the relationship exists as described. Change any variable and all bets are off.

[Robco]

Watch the video in post 19. It is amazing how much faster they are adoring on the move even though it looks much slower.

Yes, but we do not know their hits or hit factor. But I like the experiment. It is much as I have done.

We shot that video at an all A's, or very close to it, pace.

That helps frame it up. Anyway, obviously, none of us can outshoot Manny, so there is a difference between the video drill at post 19 and what I described doing with Manny. Not sure what the difference(s) were at this point, but something must be different. Distance looks about the same. Not sure where to go from here with the comparison.