EZ score fix

[cking]

EZ score lacks in several area's. Here is what I would like to see added for three gun.

For mixed gun stages, designate the primary gun, and secondaries. Keep track of all guns stats, minor, major, open, limited tactical, production.

Designate which targets are shot with what gun on score sheets, plus round required for stage.

Ability to change score point values for ABCD areas, example for 308 i.e. major A6,B4,C4,D2. This would allow better weighting. Maybe even setup PF for points.

Neutralize targets type targets, ie. one A major or Minor, etc.

Access to the database to add fields, such as Alias, so we don't have to publish real names on web pages. Name databases so you can run multiple clubs.

Future version should be able to use WiFi or Infrared to run scoring programs on Palms or Ipods that would upload to portable to have score available during the match and final immediately at the end of a match.

Would to here other comments!

[Rob Boudrie]

Some thoughts:

"Real-Time" WiFi would be cool, but it offers only marginal incremental benefit over picking up Palm scores manually, since the ranges would have to be in range of WiFi, and it creates a financial obstacle few clubs will accept. My opinion is that getting Palm scoring working at a match provides 90% of the value. WiFi would add to the "coolness" factor, but now you're not talking about buying a bunch of out of date Palm IIIxe's or similar, but getting a modern PDA on each stage.

We are adding support for the www.autoscoringsystem.com Palm scoring system directly into EzWinScore which will make it very easy to set up a match to tansfer from Palms to EzWinScore. If you go to the setup page, you'll see we already have a field for the Palm transfer directory. That "hook" was added in 2.25 so that the Palm support feature can be released without any database schema change.

EzWinScore/Palm integration is currently possible through a separate application, available for free, but requires Microsoft Access to interface to the database and requires a few manual steps to set up. Even so, there are currently two clubs in the US doing this at all their local matches with great success.

The fastest way to post scores in "Real time" is to set up a clubhouse area network, and put various workstations around the club for people to pick up scores. I did this with a Linux/Apache web server, and it worked great ... perhaps someone will be interested in doing the same on a Microsoft IIS platform. Uploading from EzWinScore to such a system takes well under a minute when everything is properly configured.

We did this at A7/2004, and we actually managed to get overall and stage scores posted before some of the squad members got done packing their gear up and walked up to the clubhouse. My performance goal for A7/2005 is 5 minutes.

If the *RULES* ever support different A/B/C/D point values, EzWinScore will as well. Adding features to support variants of scoring not in compliance with the rules is not even on the feature roadmap.

The aliases is an interesting idea- we already restrict results to "members only" specifically for privacy reasons. I will have to ask HQ, but I don't see a problem is someone chooses to register with their first name and last initial - just be sure to get the member number correct.

Another item on my "wish list" is the ability of EzWinScore to interface to a true multi-user database, so that a major match using several computers for data entry does not have to match stages to specific machines - they would all work on one single database. The trick here is getting the database software for free, and I think I may have a way to pull that off.

[cking]

Thanks for the quick reply. I'll check out the palm section. Did the users have any trouble adapting to the palm from paper?

Access to a multiuser data base would be nice.

[Rob Boudrie]

Info about the first major Palm scored match may be found at http://www.boudrie.com/Area7_Palm_Scoring.html

This document describes the first major match use of Palm/ASS, and the vairous issues we encountered (which are described in the document) have been resolved. It's an effective system, however, it is my opinion you still need to maintain a paper log of hit counts and time to handle any protests.

A7/2003 wrote totals on traditional scoresheets. A7/2004 used summary sheets which allowed 8 shooter scores on one 8.5x11sheet, with carbonless tead-off strips abot 1 1/2" wide each shooter was given as their copy of the stage score.

[jkmccoy]

How about some actually USEFUL changes to EZWinscore...

Tactical Division???

Ability to score multi-gun stages with different power factors. We'll keep the scoresheets correctly, let me enter them directly into the scoring program without having to kluge around the "one gun" problem.

And throw out the useless "Provisional 3-Gun" rules that just prevent people from running 3-Gun matches they way they should be run without helping anything.

Cheers,

Kelly McCoy

[George]

I too would like to see Tactical incorporated, along with support for easily adding future divisions like HM. The HM wave is coming and USPSA should ride it just like the Tactial wave, they should just get on it a little quicker this time ;-)

I do however, see Rob's point about not supporting features that the rules don't support. After all, the software is USPSA owned/maintained and if USPSA doesn't allow something in the rules, the software has to tag along for the ride. Don't deride the software, change the rules. The tools will follow the rules.

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Regards,

[Wakal]

During this same discussion last year, the comments from those "in the know" boiled down to "the system doesn't support it, so we didn't change the rules."

Talk about the broken-down cart driving the racehorse...

And the fact that no one in a position of authority has expressed ANY interest in FIXING the known flaws of EZwinscore tells me that those folks just don't care.

I care. But according to one of our sport's very active Grandmasters (and generous sponsors), when he tried to tell Mike Voigt...directly...about how one club SOLVED the 3-gun scoring problems in 2002, he was ignored. Twice.

That tells me that there is no interest in FIXING the problems with EZwinscore.

1. Where is Tactical class?

2. Why can't we score major pistol/minor rifle combination stages?

This ain't rocket science, folks...

Alex

[George]

During this same discussion last year, the comments from those "in the know" boiled down to "the system doesn't support it, so we didn't change the rules

That’s not what I remember being said (in effect, or actually).

IIRC, the statements from Bruce and Rob (those in the know) in the threads in question all boiled down to “we have to settle the rules first, then the software will be fixed to handle what the rules specify“.

The rules still do not support mixed major & minor PF being scored on paper targets within a stage so the software cannot be blamed for that one. But I will have to agree with the complaint that a year has passed and we still do not have Tactical division supported in the scoring software.

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Regards,

[tomneal]

1. Where is Tactical class?

That would be an Aggregate way of scoring a 3-gun match

and

It's been in EzWinScore for months.

On the Registration window of a 3-gun match look at the rifle and shotgun divisions.

[George]

\1. Where is Tactical class?

That would be an Aggregate way of scoring a 3-gun match

and It's been in EzWinScore for months.

On the Registration window of a 3-gun match look at the rifle and shotgun divisions.

Huh? The “tactical aggregate“ has nothing to do with the addition of a new gear “Division”.

Tactical “Division“ is still Not incorporated in EZ-Winscore. Only Open, Limited, Limited10, Production & Revolver. We are still using L10 to represent Tactical and subverting Revolver to handle Heavy Metal/He Man.

BTW, We still need to see some output from Sedro Wooley concerning the addition of HM division too!

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Regards,

[bberkley]

How about the ability to customize the style of the html results the app prints? Like linking to external style sheets, or a template file? Or creating one file instead of 10+ indvidual files?

[wgnoyes]

No Tactical Division? Uh.... excuse me??

Tactical Division has been available in ezwinscore 2.25 since December, as a rifle division and as a tournament aggregate division. To wit:

This screen shot shows a competitor registered in Tactical Rifle and Tactical Aggregate.

This is an example of the score entry form for the rifle match portion of a 3-gun tournament, with the competitor clearly marked in Tactical divsion.

This shot shows the overall results for the rifle match portion of a 3-gun tournament for tactical division long guns.

This is a screenshot of Aggregate Overall (who won the tournament) for Tactical Division.

Match results from the above examples that clearly demonstrate full support for Tactical as a division are available at georgiaipsc.com

Downloads that will upgrade 2.20 or 1.x of ezwinscore to 2.25 (which will get you tactical division support) are available at http://www.uspsa.org/ezwinscore

You are correct in that major and minor pf's on the same stage are not currently supported, but that's a whole different issue that USPSA is currently beating on.

If you have any further questions about tactical division, please let us know. Thanks.

[wgnoyes]

How about the ability to customize the style of the html results the app prints?  Like linking to external style sheets, or a template file?  Or creating one file instead of 10+ indvidual files?

I detect the mark of a fellow Dreamweaver webmaster. Yeah, it would be nice. I used the .html pages for about 8 months (and had to do a big customization project every time) before I got a full version of adobe acrobat and started publishing as-printed results that way.

[George]

Tactical Division has been available in ezwinscore 2.25 since December

In the immortal words of Steve martin, “Excuuuse Meee!”

I will download the update and make amends.

Thanks,

[wgnoyes]

Be sure to get the December patch, too, which fixes an error in uploading classifier scores to uspsa.org.

"ExCUUUUSEEE MMMEEEEEEE"? Steve Martin: Let's Get Small, '78 or '79, I believe. Showing your age... and mine!

[bberkley]

How about the ability to customize the style of the html results the app prints?  Like linking to external style sheets, or a template file?  Or creating one file instead of 10+ indvidual files?

I detect the mark of a fellow Dreamweaver webmaster. Yeah, it would be nice. I used the .html pages for about 8 months (and had to do a big customization project every time) before I got a full version of adobe acrobat and started publishing as-printed results that way.

No, I don't use dreamweaver, I use the <PRE> tags with the .txt output via a text editor.

You can see an example at: http://matchresults.arpc-ipsc.org

[George]

Showing your age... and mine!

I am still coming to grips with the fact that I ain’t a spring chicken anymore, let alone the wild and crazy guy I thought I was once ;-)

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Regards