PTX Having a Slight Issue

[Babaganoosh]

Ok I got the Hornady Bulletfeeder. Set it up last night. Dumped about 1000 rounds thru it and I think I have it set up correctly because all the bullets fed properly. I hope I didn't jinx myself there. However I am running into an issue after I installed the PTX insert into my powder measure.

I can't seem to get it to bell the mouth enough. I've played with the turnbuckle that you add on the side, and I have tried putting the powder measure a few threads deeper into the press as well. Both seem to cause issues. When I added the PTX insert and pull the ram with no case in it, the PTX insert hits my shellplate. You can actually see the powder measure start to push up and start to activate when you bring the ram up. It's only a little but I am pretty sure that isn't supposed to happen. So I loosen it one turn at a time until that doesn't happen. When I do that it will no longer put the powder measure thru it's full range of motion and I will either get no powder or very little powder due to the rotor not rotating enough to get the full charge, and it won't bell the case enough. That is when I started messing with the turnbuckle on the side of the powder measure. You are supposed to insert the bottom screw further to get more bell on the case and back it out for less. The top of the turnbuckle is supposed to show 2 threads.

I adjusted that turnbuckle every way I could. I adjusted it all the way in until I ran out of adjustment. Still not belling the case enough. Plus every time you adjust that, it doesn't allow the rotor to turn as far, so at a certain point it doesn't throw the powder correctly.

Anyone know how to fine tune this this? Am I correct that the powder measure should not be touching the shellplate with no case in it?

[acekc]

On mine the insert will touch the shellplate and will very slightly actuate the powder measure. It's not enough that any powder actually drops so I don't think it's a big deal. When you say that you adjusted the bracket all the way, did you only adjust one of the two screws all the way in and leave the other one with two threads showing, or did you adjust both of them all the way in? I was able to keep one of the screws with two threads showing when loading 9mm but I recently switched to .40 and had to turn the other screw so more than two threads were inside because I ran out of travel on the other screw and it still wasn't belling enough.

I would adjust the height of the powder measure back to the way you had it (so long as it's not activating the measure enough to drop powder without a case present) and then back the screws in the expander bracket back to their "starting positions" and adjust them from there to get the proper belling.

[Babaganoosh]

I started with the top showing 2 threads. Then I went back and forth adjusting the bottom one while trying to get the right amount of bell to the case mouth. Then I adjusted the top one when I was ran out of adjustment on the bottom. No luck.

I know you said that your die also hits the plate but I don't think that's what should happen. Wouldn't that throw all the settings of the seater, crimper, and resizer off?

At the moment I am loading 9mm if that makes any difference.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Babaganoosh

[acekc]

I know you said that your die also hits the plate but I don't think that's what should happen. Wouldn't that throw all the settings of the seater, crimper, and resizer off?

I don't see how. The die in each station is adjusted independently, so just because something in station 3 is making contact with the shell plate doesn't mean that the dies in any other station are contacting the shell plate. When the shell plate makes contact with the insert, it pushes the insert up, so the insert contacting the shell plate doesn't restrict the ram from going all the way up. Can you explain what you think would happen to throw off the settings of the other dies?

[Babaganoosh]

I know you said that your die also hits the plate but I don't think that's what should happen. Wouldn't that throw all the settings of the seater, crimper, and resizer off?

I don't see how. The die in each station is adjusted independently, so just because something in station 3 is making contact with the shell plate doesn't mean that the dies in any other station are contacting the shell plate. When the shell plate makes contact with the insert, it pushes the insert up, so the insert contacting the shell plate doesn't restrict the ram from going all the way up. Can you explain what you think would happen to throw off the settings of the other dies?

If it is contacting the shell plate and there isn't even in a case in it then it means it is down too far. If it's down to far then the ram won't be able to go all the way to the top of the stroke, especially when you add a case to the mix. This is speculation and theory because I am not in front of the press at the moment. However I really don't think a properly set up PTX die should hit the plate and make the powder measure move a bit when there isn't even a case in that station. Now I could see it touching the plate because there is some slack in there. The PTX bushing has to travel a little bit before it engages. I don't see an issue if it hit and pushes up the slack, but if it goes beyond the slack and you can see your powder measure move a little bit that's gotta be wrong.

Now I could be wrong mind you, but I don't think it should be like that.

[acekc]

If it is contacting the shell plate and there isn't even in a case in it then it means it is down too far. If it's down to far then the ram won't be able to go all the way to the top of the stroke, especially when you add a case to the mix. This is speculation and theory because I am not in front of the press at the moment. However I really don't think a properly set up PTX die should hit the plate and make the powder measure move a bit when there isn't even a case in that station. Now I could see it touching the plate because there is some slack in there. The PTX bushing has to travel a little bit before it engages. I don't see an issue if it hit and pushes up the slack, but if it goes beyond the slack and you can see your powder measure move a little bit that's gotta be wrong.

Now I could be wrong mind you, but I don't think it should be like that.

Contacting the shell plate does not in and of itself mean the expander insert is down too far. Remember that the expander insert moves enough to push the metering insert from the bottom of its slot in the powder measure to the top. Until and unless the expander insert moves enough that (with a case under it) the metering insert contacts the top of the slot in the powder measure before the ram is at the top of its travel, everything will work as it should.

Ideally you want the expander insert in a position where when the ram is at the top of its travel with a case under the expander insert, the metering insert is at or near the top of its travel, perhaps barely touching the top of the slot in which it rides. If the expander insert is too low, the metering insert will top out in its slot before the ram reaches the top of its travel; this would mess up every station because the brass wouldn't make it all the way into the other dies. If the expander insert is too high, it will not fully actuate the metering insert when the ram is at the top of its travel.

If the expander insert hitting the shell plate still troubles you I would suggest calling Hornady tech support to verify. From a practical standpoint, when I'm set up for 9mm my expander insert slightly actuates the powder measure (but does not cause it to drop powder) when no case is present, and I've loaded over 1,200 rounds this way with the proper amount of belling and proper powder charge being thrown.

Edited December 28, 2011 by acekc

[blind bat]

What caliber and model number PTX insert? Hornady came out with a new set of PTX inserts about a year ago because the old ones wouldn't bell enough. They basically had one OD with a chammfer/radius at the bottom. The new inserts have a radius, one OD to size the ID of the case then a step/second OD to do the belling.

I know the old .357" inserts were stamped "357" and the new ones are stamped "358".

[Babaganoosh]

What caliber and model number PTX insert? Hornady came out with a new set of PTX inserts about a year ago because the old ones wouldn't bell enough. They basically had one OD with a chammfer/radius at the bottom. The new inserts have a radius, one OD to size the ID of the case then a step/second OD to do the belling.

I know the old .357" inserts were stamped "357" and the new ones are stamped "358".

I'm going to guess the newer one because I just got it and it was included with the bullet feeder die. However I will take a look when I get near the press.

It's not belling enough because the insert isn't going far enough into the case mouth.

[biggdawg]

What caliber and model number PTX insert? Hornady came out with a new set of PTX inserts about a year ago because the old ones wouldn't bell enough. They basically had one OD with a chammfer/radius at the bottom. The new inserts have a radius, one OD to size the ID of the case then a step/second OD to do the belling.

I know the old .357" inserts were stamped "357" and the new ones are stamped "358".

I'm going to guess the newer one because I just got it and it was included with the bullet feeder die. However I will take a look when I get near the press.

It's not belling enough because the insert isn't going far enough into the case mouth.

you said it right there. so you need to adjust the powder drop back down that is the main adjustment. the screws on the link are for fine tuning

because as you found if you screw them too far it can affect the powder throw.

[Babaganoosh]

I think I got it working well. I adjusted the powder measure into the press enough so the powder measure throws the rotor all the way to the top. Then I messed with the linkage on the side. To get it belling correctly I had to adjust it all the way in. There is no adjustment left but it does work. The powder measure still moves a little bit when I raise the ram all the way up with no case in it.

[noylj]

I have been using a L-N-L AP almost from when they were first introduced.

Never had any problem and never needed a turn-buckle. I could only conclude that Hornady fixed a non-problem and made one.

Yes, the PTX hits the shell plate on ALL my loads. The smaller the case (say .380 auto), the more the PTX hits the shell plate.

It just doesn't matter.

Why do people keep trying to fix something that isn't broke just 'cause "it doesn't look right."

If you had measured the charge weight on a string of cases, you would have discovered that everything was working just fine.

If you are going to use one PTX for .380 auto through .38 Super, you have to accept that some major adjustments need to be made.

With the Lee PTE dies, you have individual expander plugs for each cartridge.