Old S&W autos second and third gen

[bigbrowndog]

anyone know if there are issues that should be known about the second and third gen smith autos, I'm referring to second gen as the ones that had 3 digits in the model number, 659,439,469,etc. and the third gen as the ones with 4 digits in the model number, 1076,5906,4516,1006 etc. Which ones were better made or more reliable. Anyone know?????

thanks Trapr

[Nik Habicht]

I had some of the third Gen. guns including a 4516, 6906, and a 910 (the 915/910 were the value series counterpart to the 5906, model number changed to reflect capacity during the 1994-2004 ban on regular mags). They all worked well, and the 910 came back from the custom shop with a great trigger, after I sent it in for their trigger job/reliability package.....

[DougCarden]

The extractors need to be pulled to be cleaned on a regular basis, I don't remember how many rounds. Local SO did it every three years...You will need a vise and punches to do it right. That is all I remember of the top of my head...

DougC

[Jhp147]

The 3rd generation guns had some design improvements including better ambi decocker design design, and I'm pretty sure a better trigger, but I would have to check with somebody that had more experience inside the 3-digit series than I have to get the exact differences. I do know my 5904 is better than my 459 and 469 by a mile. I have not heard about the extractor cleaning as part of regular cleaning. The instructor at the armorer's class for 3rd generation guns (4-digit like 5904, etc.) told us not to remove the extractor for routine maintenance. I hose out the extractor with aerosol gun cleaner, Brake Kleen, or whatever. I do NOT like all the hammering that I have to do to take out an extractor pin, that is for sure. It is a good way to make a regular punch into a starter punch. One area that may need some cleaning attention is the firing pin tunnel. Some shooters clean the breech face with the firing pin hole under the brush, which puts mucho misfire inducing gunk into the firing pin tunnel. If you have a light strike, cleaning it fixes many...most problems. Seems like many people don't mess with taking it out due to the safety/decocker, but it is not hard. Some of the 3rd generation guns got out with a out-of-spec area under the extractor spring-too deep or uneven or something. I don't think it was many, but it was enough that they mentioned it in class though. It can generate hair-pulling because the extractor tension is way wacky, and extractor tension is not normally a problem in these guns. I've only seen this once out of a couple of hundred guns, Smith fixes it free and fast anyway. I very much like the TSWs, especially the 4563/66.

Edited May 9, 2011 by sheepdog

[rishii]

I've been carrying a 5906 for nearly 20 years, the 1st and 2nd gen guns were junk

in the eighties when the sig 226 came out,it forced smith to redo their 2nd gen guns to keep up, well until glock took over the police market.

the biggest changes were the grip and front strap area to make them more ergonomic, the trigger group was improved for a better trigger pull and the fixed sighted guns came with novak sights.

some of the early guns had defective barrels that had a flaw in the chamber that the fired case would expand into causing a failure to extract.

and extractor removal is a pain in the butt and honestly it doesn't need much maintenance.

both of my 5906 and 3913 have been flawless, the 1st and 2nd gen guns had such a bad well deserved rep, that people automatically group all smith autos in the slightly better than a paper weight category, but smith corrected all the flaws when they came out with the 3rd gen guns.

the only down side is smith no longer make the 3rd gen autos, and I've heard that they will soon no longer support them, so replacement parts my become an issue

[bigbrowndog]

thanks guys thats the info I was looking for, Trapr

[Jhp147]

the only down side is smith no longer make the 3rd gen autos, and I've heard that they will soon no longer support them, so replacement parts my become an issue

I was worried about this, myself. I called our LE rep about it. He said that parts would be available "for the foreseeable future" for whatever that means. They will still make runs of 3rd Generation guns for LE agencies (like the CHP's 4006s I would guess) so I think that parts will be around for awhile. Wouldn't mind having a few more spares around but I'm not too worried.

I had forgotten how bad the original 59's rep was for feeding-or not feeding, I guess. Had a 459 but swapped it for a P226. I got to handle a pre-release sample of a 5904 our agency was testing and that was exactly my first thought, that they had put my P226 grip on a S&W. The 226 was sold for the new 5904 that I carried till I replaced it with a 4563TSW.

[TonyT]

Both my S&W659 and 5906 have been totally reliable. The trigger on the 5906 feels signkificantly better in the Da mode than the one on the 659. The 659 also had a miserable method of attaching the right ambi release lever - a Phillips head screw which would frequently loosen - that was cured on the 5906.