Lastcat
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Posts posted by Lastcat
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1 hour ago, GSonnen said:I primarily shoot mutigun (UML & outlaw matches). I've been shooting Tac Ops with an STI 2011 for the past 5 years. I'm going to make the move to open this year and I'm pistol shopping.
I have small hands and have always found better grip with a Glock frame than my 2011. I am considering building my open pistol on a G34 MOS. Any wisdom on Glock as an open gun would be appreciated.
G34 MOS is a good start. Get a KKM Barrel, very accurate.
I converted a G22 to 357 sig (had all the dies, brass and reloaded for my G32 for years). Carver mount, KKM threaded barrel, Carver 4 port Comp, Zev trigger, 13# recoil spring, FastFire3, Ice magwell, Glock Mags with bases at 170 and 140's. You'll get advice not to shoot a Glock in Open, but just ignore the critics. Unless you can afford a $3000 Open Gun. Glocks are easy to find parts and cheaper. I started in 2016 with this setup and had a blast and worked very well. Plus I lived in a van down by the river and didn't have the $$$. Just build what works for you.
I later converted to a G17. KKM threaded barrel, Carver Mount, Carver 4 Port Comp, Zev Trigger, Ice Magwell and Pmag 170 and 140's mags. Works great. Someday I'll get a Chaos or CK Open gun, when I win the Lottery
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With a G34 MOS get a KKM barrel, DeltaPointPro, holster, pouches and Pmags. Off you go. If you ever decide to go USPSA Carry Optics, you are set.
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3 hours ago, Chip3 said:
Crocs, let your feet breathe.
Inov8, Salomon, etc...good choices. Since I live in a Van down by the river (with internet lol) I really couldn't afford the $150 for shoes
. So I found a less expensive option. Saucony Grid Excursion TR12. $54 shipped. Hope they last this season.
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5 hours ago, rowdyb said:
Production. Glock 34. Just change the sights.
this.
Cheap, factory minor ammo and can be used as Limited Minor. Getting started in USPSA is a giant step. Once you get a few matches down, keep the G34 or upgrade if possible.
I wish we all had buckets and buckets of $$$$. Buy ever gun needed, plus backups. Tons of ammo. Then maybe a Chauffeur to drive us to the Matches
. And a Chef to make us breakfast, lunch and diner. Then a Gunsmith to tune and clean our guns, then a Expert Reloader...if only 
. "Show me the Money".
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Religious Shooter, this was me back in 2016. Its a G22 slide and G17 lower. I added a KKM conversion barrel to 357 sig. ( because I had all the brass, bullets, dies, powder, etc....) Carver mount, Ice magwell and Fast Fire 3. Worked good, it was my first open gun and didn't take much to get involved in the sport. Involved, that's the key word, really glad I started in USPSA, wish I did this 25 years ago. Couldn't afford even a 2011 at the time, no $$$. Broke ass as possible, but I got it to run and really had a blast in the Sport and shooting this G31 Open Gun.
This video shows a REF, luckily it didn't impede my COF.
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2 minutes ago, HCH said:
I would have been better off to keep shooting Limited with the 35 I used, and apply that $$ to a savings account, if that’s what you mean.
Actually no. It was Open Gun related.
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11 minutes ago, HCH said:
I’ve done the Open Glock thing too. CO really did away with any “good” reason to shoot a plastic gun in Open, IMO.
That's good. Could you afford a better gun?
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26 minutes ago, HCH said:
This.
Although i wouldn’t recommend buying an Open Glock. Ever.
You are right too, if you had the $$$ then get a better gun. If you don't have the $$$, a Glock Open gun, which many have done, including myself, doesn't take a whole lot of cash to get started in the Sport. Parts are cheaper and easier to find. I wish I had a Chaos, but don't have the dollars. I already had the G17. Bought the mounts, barrel and Pmags, etc.... and off I went. So for under $1,000 or so, one can get started into Open Div and maybe save for the big buck guns. Like I choose to do, someday
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On 3/17/2019 at 8:19 AM, Religious Shooter said:
I have a Carry Optic top end using a Brownells slide and RMR. G17 Gen 3.
On occasion I want to shoot minor Open with the Glock.
I want to use my Production/CO load (147 w/Titegroup) with this Open set up.
I want to be able to fairly quickly convert the top end from CO to Open and vice-versa.
What kind of barrel and compensator set-up would you guys recommend? Have you used it? Does it work with a typical minor 9MM load @ 130 PF? Does it make a marked difference?
Thanks.
If on occasion you want to shoot Minor Open with the Glock, all you would need is a 170 mag, then sign in as Open Minor. Using your current CO setup and not worry about a comp. Which would do very little with Prod/CO 147 minor loads.
If you have the $$$ then get a complete built G17 for Open Major 9mm. KKM drop in Barrel (which are very accurate), Carver double sided mount and Carver comp, DeltaPointPro, Magwell, 170 mag(s), thumb rest. Hopefully your current holster will fit both. Keep both setups.
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34 minutes ago, echotango said:
4.5", 5", 5.4".
Thanks!
Shorty = 4.5"
Middy = 5."
Long = 5.4"
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18 hours ago, BenAlpha said:
What do you consider medium?
I'm with Ben on this one. What does one consider Medium in inches? Short, Long and extra Long? It is about the barrel length, correct?
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That looks good, whatever you did with the 124's, it's a keeper.
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1 hour ago, Apolo said:
Good news. I love them and have been pushing them to 1500 FPS+ with zero issue. And from a Tanfo V12. I have been running them for a bit now. I run and have run the 115g with CFE, AA7, Power Pistol and will be doing more load development with other powders. They have been very accurate, leading hasn't been an issue, and no splitting. Also he runs the coating a little thicker and it doesn't rub off on your hands on in bullet feeder.
Excellent Write John. I'm sure DG appreciates it. DG is local to me and small, but looking into doing match and stage sponsorship to get word out. So support the little guys. Dave has taken a lot of time to listen to us in doing QC and making sure things are beyond satisfactory. Dave is also a shooter. He shoots IDPA and USPSA. lives near Waupaca WI. Orders come fast!
Thanks Apolo, guess I'll have to order a few. I use a Czechmate in (Open Major). Power Pistol is one my favorite powders.
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11 minutes ago, euxx said:
Well, you said it is easier for you as RO, not me. But now the dead donkey is to discuss if string is a stage or not. DNROI already said it is. End of story, like it or not. What to discuss?
When you look down the end of your nose, does your self righteousness get in the way, or is it the tall throne you sit upon?
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2 hours ago, MikeBurgess said:
Actually the fun part is even if you know the shooter Zeroed the course of fire if you can not properly account for all the points and penalties to be applied to get to that zero then you must issue a re-shoot, just knowing it must be a Zero doesn't make it one.
If someone just enters a Zero for my stage score I will ask for the RM and ask to see how the Zero was calculated and if its not all there on the tablet I'll take my re-shoot and try to not bugger it up again.
Ok we are getting off topic here. No one is zeroing a score. I wouldn't do it, call em as I see them, to be fair and just to any competitor, I would score all targets. If you go back to page 1 and read my post.
"Unfortunate for the shooter, but that's how it goes. Even if he had a jam on the first shot. Score all targets and apply penalties. As an RO, I think it would be just easier to enter Zero for this Stage". Don't zero scores, they must be recorded, and on record.
It was just an afterthought, not a submitted action I would apply. It's like we need to carry this dead donkey up the hill, so we can bury it. I think it would be just easier to bury it here. Let's move on, unless we need to talk about the dead donkey.
Anyone?
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3 hours ago, euxx said:
If we follow your logic it would be even easier for RO if competitor haven't shot stage at all.
You can enter Zero scores, but that is not the case when you should be doing that as an RO. Stage should be scored as shot.There's been over a dozen of us trying to hash this out the last 3 days, and you show up to criticize my one line expressing a thought and that's your best contribution? Dude, it's an afterthought, it's not a commitment on my part or an action I would ever take. Chillax.
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1 hour ago, NickBlasta said:
You can't give people a general procedural for engaging or not engaging targets. The rule is telling you that there are other procedurals for non-engagement, or under, or over-engagement of targets, and to use those in place of a general procedural.
"String 2 - engage array 2 with 2 rounds each" is WSB procedure. If they do not engage the targets in that string you do not give them a general procedural, you pick from the procedurals related to engaging targets. If they engaged them in string 1, and failed to engage them in string 2, all they can really get are mikes.
Additionally, think of it like this - the most common procedure on a field course is "engage targets as visible from inside the fault lines". If I do not engage a target do you give me both a general procedural (for not engaging a target according to the WSB) and a FTSA? No, you cannot give me the general procedural because of 10.2.2.1, you can only use the FTSA.
That first paragraph, I have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Explain "a general procedure". Is that what you tell competitors? Your time was 14.25, a hit factor of 5.236 and a general procedure. Write Troy McManus, go bust his balls. You know who that is right? The Director of the NROI. Go back to the beginning and read what the OP posted. The conversation here, for the most part, hinges around his post.
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1 hour ago, driver8M3 said:
that is not what 10.2.2.1 is for.
10.2.2.1 means do not give a procedural for failing to shoot the number of rounds stipulated in the WSB. El Prez says 6-reload-6. If they fire 6-reload-5 or 6-reload-7 (for whatever reason), do not give a procedural for not firing the correct number or rounds.
Negative.
10.2.21 "...failure to comply with stage procedure...." 10.2.2.1 "...procedures do not apply to number of shots fired, which are addressed in other rules".
9.4.5.1 Extra Shots (6-reload-5 does not apply. 6-reload-7 applies)
9.4.5.2 Extra Hits (6-reload-5 does not apply. 6-reload-7 applies, if 7th shot hits)
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3 hours ago, NickBlasta said:
10.2.2.1 still applies, since it tells you that you can't give stage procedurals for number of shots fired, including insufficient shots, and "zero" is a number of insufficient shots. You have to use a different procedural.
Yes and no. I’ll explain with as much respect to the rules as I understand and to you Nick.
10.2.2.1 is a subsection of 10.2.2:
10.2.2 A competitor who fails to comply with the procedure specified in the written stage briefing will incur one procedural penalty for each occurrence. However, if a competitor has gained a significant advantage during non-compliance, the competitor may be assessed one procedural penalty for each shot fired, instead of a single penalty (e.g. firing multiple shots contrary to the required position or stance).
10.2.2 is about a competitor that does not follow the WSB. Whether it is position, stance, or action that is required in the WSB, etc… Also about separating the failure to follow the WSB and the number of shots (or lack of) fired. Say for example, they are required to hold a Panda with both hands downrange and arms parallel to the ground. But they only use 1 hand. One procedure 10.1.1.
Did they gain a significant advantage? not really, so only one procedure and no further penalties for each shot fired thereafter. Unless the competitor did gain a significant advantage, then 1 procedure for each occurrence. Somehow competitors in the past, did not follow the WSB (properly holding the Panda) and they were penalized for each shot thereafter.
10.2.2.1 states not to penalize a competitor for not following the WSB for the number of shots fired. Even though the Panda was held by only 1 hand, then any shots taken after that shall not apply for non-compliance to the WSB (unless they gained a significant advantage). This rule also redirects the RO to apply the correct rules for additional or insufficient shots and not be penalized under 10.2.2
Can you imagine at the “Range is Clear” command, you get 32 procedures for not holding the Panda with 2 hands? So it protects the competitor for a simple mistake and defines 10.2.2 as a WSB procedure.
So yes, 10.2.2.1 was followed and no to rule 10.2.2, which was not applied in this case for the Classifier 18-08 The Condor.
In this case, as posted by the OP. The competitor had a gun malfunction on String 2. Left 4 targets that he did not engage. 1 FTSA for each target, as written in the stage briefing. Score the targets as you see them.
If I would state Rule 9.5.1 and/or 9.5.7 (fails to shoot one round each target…..) Then the competitor could argue, “yes I did, look, there is 1 shot on each target”. And I stick with my call 9.5.1 and/or 9.5.7. Now I have one angry competitor, who feels cheated and his 5 angry buddies, great, that’s all I need, where’s the exit and how do I get out of this?
I rather site 10.1.1 for not following the WSB where it states to engage T1-T8. I would state that he failed to engage as written in the briefing and stick with the word “engage”. Less conflict and I avoid 6 guys looking for revenge. Hope this helps.
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John did you mean ".3555 to .3560?
I saw these last night and considered trying a few. Has anyone pushed these 124gr out to 1370 fps for Major? Cheers.
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24 minutes ago, RJH said:
Once again me, the rule book, and the English language is proven wrong by DNROI.
WTF, why do we even have a rule book, if the rules and definitions in it are going to be disregarded time and again?
And my humblest appoliges to Lastcat, apparently i was mistaken....
RJH, much props and honor to you.
Nothing I lose sleep over. That's one of the reasons Brian started this site. To allow us to have healthy discussions. I later changed my mind last night too, argh!...lol. How can you give a FTSA since the first stage they had at least 1 round each?
So Troy states, each string is a separate component of a stage. If this comes up, I'll point to Rule 10.1.1 ".....when a Competitor fails to comply with procedures specified in a WSB." Then point to the word in String 2, "engage".
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26 minutes ago, DKorn said:
I think the way Troy explained it is the logical interpretation of the spirit of the rules, but there are some wordings that probably need to be clarified to help avoid confusion.
Basically, I would think the penalties make sense, but if the shooter wanted me to find a rule that states they apply to individual strings I couldn’t find one, and they would be able to point out at least a few rules that seem to imply otherwise.
Really, all that would need to change to make this obvious is to change a couple rules to say “course of fire OR string”.
Thanks DKorn for the reply from Troy. First time I heard of a string as a separate component of a stage, I'll go with it. If I were to call FTSA on the last 4 targets, as in string 2. I would have to go by the WSB. Where the word engage is used and rule 10.1.1 (non-compliance to the WSB).
Did the shooter engage all targets in String 2?
No = FTSA
Yes = No procedure
I changed my mind last night from my first post. When it comes to scoring, considering the shooter did engage all targets in String 1, I would have not considered any FTSA.
According to Troy and if I ever encounter this, I would site Rule 10.1.1 ".....when a Competitor fails to comply with procedures specified in a WSB." Even though Rule 9.5.1 states one round each. Must point back to the word engage in the WSB. Being an RO has a way of creating dirty looks (must have thick skin). Good discussion, thanks.
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10 hours ago, RJH said:
NO
10.2.2.1
No, that's not it either. 10.2.2.1 talks about Proc. penalties that do not apply to the number of shots (insufficient or additional shots). It's still:
9.5.1 Unless otherwise specified in the written stage briefing, scoring cardboard
targets must be shot with a minimum of one round each, with the best two
hits to score. Scoring metal targets must be shot with a minimum of one
round each and must fall to score.All 8 targets were shot with one round. Score targets as you see them. Add 4 mikes and no FSTA procedure (correcting my first reply).
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41 minutes ago, DKorn said:
I agree, which means no FTSA penalties in this case because the targets were shot at during the stage.
This is my interpretation based on:
“9.5.7 A competitor who fails to shoot at the face of each scoring target in a course of fire with at least one round...” (emphasis added by me)
True, if this was not a Multiple String Stage. String 2 states to engage with 1 round per target. Since that did not happen, then the WSB was not followed.
9.5.1 Unless otherwise specified in the written stage briefing, scoring cardboard
targets must be shot with a minimum of one round each, with the best two
hits to score. Scoring metal targets must be shot with a minimum of one
round each and must fall to score.The Condor 18-08
String 1: On the audible start signal, engage T1-T4 from box A with only 1 round per target, perform a mandatory reload, and engage T5-T8 from box B with only 1 round per target.
String 2: On the audible start signal, engage T5-T8 from box B with only 1 round per target, perform a mandatory reload, and engage T1-T4 from box A with only 1 round per target.
Reloads and movement
in Video Training Tips
Posted
You'll get many different kinds of suggestions here, that's for sure. This may turn into a 5 pager.
This is my opinion and your mileage may vary. From what I see in your slo-mo vid. Do you see the magwell opening? Just need to see a small bit, once the mag has entered, then send it home with the palm of your hand, while looking up for next target.
Looks like the magwell opening is too far to your left and you are not able to see the opening. Also, get your palm ready to send it home sooner. For me, I try to get the magwell up and to the right a bit, so I can see the opening. Then index finger the mag. Once it hits the opening, I'll seat the mag with the palm. Seems your hand was turned over the top and not able to get your palm in the correct place. It takes practice, that's for sure. Keep at it. Hope this helps. Now prepare for the counter points.