peterthefish
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Posts posted by peterthefish
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FTFYWow that's an interesting [random bit of speculation from somebody that someone on the internet knows]'. I wonder if Dustin will be able to chime in.
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Could the ti cylinder be changed to a stainless cylinder? Would that fix the problem? Pete
OP never really got back to the thread to talk about this issue, which as described in initial posts frankly didn't make much sense.
If you have sticky ejection, I'd double check load data first and if it's good then send it back to S&W.
So I'd say there's not really an issue to solve with a stainless cylinder. Of course, if you wanted to no reason you couldn't rechamber and cut down a 627 cylinder.
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I have put 300,000 rounds out of my 686+ and I bought it used from a very active steel shooter....I bet this thing is closing in 1/2 of a million rounds. No problems with peening on the SS cylinder. I shoot the crap out of all my revos and never had any concerns. If it's correctly timed you wont. The purpose of the Ti cylinder was to shed weight to speed up lock time. I dont notice much of a difference.
300,000 rounds? How many rounds a year do you shoot?
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I thought the knobs were the same for all assemblies? Uniquetek told me the knob should be stiff enough to not move on its own. The three white tabs make it tight. If it's moving you should call themYes the adjustable portion moves, as I use the press. I will try tightening the allen screw at the bottom of the insert.
The Hornady powder measure doesn't use a bar like a Dillon. The micrometer inserts might be made by UniqueTek but they're different than the Dillon bars and sold and branded by Hornady. Never seen a white tab on any of mine.
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Pressure wash aka gas cutting is a form of mechanical erosion resulting from the hot gases under pressure penetrating the grain structure of the metal and wearing it away. With the powder fouling mixed in you add an abrasive condition to help it along like a sandblaster. Surely you have heard of the throats of barrels eroding out after awhile. That is the phenom of pressure wash erosion. It is more extreme in rifle cartridges but exists on a less lethal level in handgun cartridges as well. The surfaces in chambers, fronts of cylinders, throats, and forcing cones are the most affected areas. With excessive use the lands in the rifling will eventually suffer as well which is more common in rifles vs handguns. This phenom of erosion is more frequent in higher pressure cartridges of course. In the case of a handgun your 9mm, 40, 357 will show signs of erosion quicker than lower pressure cartridges such as the 38 spcl and 45acp. As I said the erosion in a handgun is less extreme than rifles. A handgun will take alot of shooting to erode away metal to the point of accuracy loss. But any surface treatments or coatings will be eroded out in a short period of time. To demonstrate this if you have some older and newer blued revolvers take them out and take a look at a barrel and cylinder area. You will notice the leading edge of the barrel into the forcing cone is rounded and the the bluing on the cylinder face is gone on the well used revo and the new one has a sharper edge and still blued on the cylinder face. That's pressure wash erosion.
The pressure wash? Tell me more. Never heard of this phenom?I have been in contact with about 6 of them. If you were a machinists you would know how you can look at a cut and tell if the tooling is dull. Therefore if the cut indicates dull its one of two things, 1. the tooling is low quality to begin with 2. the tooling has dulled and is no longer cutting but rather gouging and smearing. Thats how you can conclude the tooling is not being replaced when it should. I do not work for S&W but anyone with machining experience can figure this out. As far as not using abrasives to cut through to the base Ti....the pressure wash from shooting it is going to do that. Ti cylinders have been polished and chamfered since they came out....no one reporting any problems that I know of. As far as palming the ejector rod...weak hand reloads.
I have arrived at another conclusion........you obviously have no idea whats going on in the revolver competition world!
Getting back to the Ti polishing, it just that a light polish with a 1200 grit lapping compound to knock down the rough high spots. Your not hogging out material and removing the entire surface treatment. Exposed Ti will react with the air to form a light corrosion on the surface through a chemical reaction. So the very little exposed Ti will seal itself in a manner of speaking. This has been done to Ti cylinders in comp revo's since there inception. Bottom line is if its causing problems you have to address it to work as intended somehow. If spent cases stick on ejection it cant be relied upon for any kind of use where 10ths of seconds count. This is the accepted option to fix it.....
Familiar with the throat erosion - never heard it called pressure wash before... Either way, thats the accepted method for a steel cylinder is are heat treated. The TI cylinders are not the same animal, and the surface treatment is crucial to wear resistance. The treatment is not "eroded out in a short period of time". I've never seen a Ti cylinder erode from flame cutting with the exception of those who ignore manufacturer recommendations to not shoot 125 GR and below 357 loads.
The treatment is only about 100 mm thick - any removal of high spots will cut through the treatment. If you do this to any part of the cylinder near or beyond the case mouth you will see very rapid erosion of the untreated material. The thickness and durability of the oxidation layer that will form through atmospheric oxidation is inadequate protection against flame cutting.
If someone gets a poorly cut cylinder from S&W, better advice would be that they should return it unless they have the knowledge and ability to treat it after any surfaces are altered.
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If it's the adjustment knob turning look and make sure you see three little white tabs between the knob and body. Any less then three and it will turn. Mine was moving and I called UniqueTek and he told me this. I sent it back and they repaired for free
Not sure that the applies to the Hornady LNL.
OP - most likely the Allen screw that secures the adjustment knob is loose. This screw lets you adjust the knob so it precisely passes the zero lines on the body at the correct values. If it's good as is, tighten that screw. You can add blue or purple loctite as needed.
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I have been in contact with about 6 of them. If you were a machinists you would know how you can look at a cut and tell if the tooling is dull. Therefore if the cut indicates dull its one of two things, 1. the tooling is low quality to begin with 2. the tooling has dulled and is no longer cutting but rather gouging and smearing. Thats how you can conclude the tooling is not being replaced when it should. I do not work for S&W but anyone with machining experience can figure this out. As far as not using abrasives to cut through to the base Ti....the pressure wash from shooting it is going to do that. Ti cylinders have been polished and chamfered since they came out....no one reporting any problems that I know of. As far as palming the ejector rod...weak hand reloads.
I have arrived at another conclusion........you obviously have no idea whats going on in the revolver competition world!
The pressure wash? Tell me more. Never heard of this phenom?
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I checked case volume and length. Both are identical to 9mm. The 38 SC and 9mm ones I checked were anyway, there are probably tiny differences between brands. In my mind, a 38 Short Colt is just a rimmed 9mm.
Good to know. Quickload shows the 38 SC as 1-2 GR H2O smaller and so borderline 9mm loads look atomic in 38 SC.
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And who hits the ejector rod with their Palm?
lentz, olhasso, walsh, leatham, to name a few. basically everyone that I see doing a weakhand reload...strong hand stays on the gun, weak hand does the reload.
I am a relic that does miculek style and thumb them out...
I do the same - I thought the weak hand reload was the relic... I'll have to pull some video of Olhasso...
Dave makes a compelling arguement for doing it that way, there are a couple subtle things going on when Dave does it that you will not see in a video though.
He's teaching that steel class next month before the PSA shoot in pennsylvania, recommended...
I started doing it the jerry way when I started and have done a countless number in dry fire and live practice that I am hyper invested and unwilling to invest in another way. Like dave, I am sure jerry is doing(seeing) a couple subtle things that are not going to be apparent on video(and I've studied them all...) but its not been revealed to me....
I was actually planning to shoot PSA Thur / Fri and probably hit this class as well, but was late on the draw and by the time I went to register only one slot was open. Next year I guess...
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And who hits the ejector rod with their Palm?
lentz, olhasso, walsh, leatham, to name a few. basically everyone that I see doing a weakhand reload...strong hand stays on the gun, weak hand does the reload.
I am a relic that does miculek style and thumb them out...
I do the same - I thought the weak hand reload was the relic... I'll have to pull some video of Olhasso...
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How many 929s have you examined to come to this conclusion? Have you worked for S&W, or do you just assume they're cutting corners on tooling? S&W instructs one not to use abrasives on the cylinder lest you remove the protective finish exposing the base Ti? Polishing the chambers would remove that finish - not a good thing in my book.The root issue here is going to be the internal polish (or lack there of) on the cylinder. Titanium is a tricky metal to work with and is most unforgiving during machining. So consistent surface conditions is rather hard to maintain from piece to piece without a lot of care in tooling replacement intervals and setup. Sharp and very durable tooling is a must with titanium such as carbide. Titanium incurs a lot of wear from piece to piece on tooling as compared to most steels. With the cost of tooling S&W is no different than anyone else in trying to push its life expectancy of which is beyond what it should be. So you get a cylinder with fresh tooling you get a good cut, get one on the over extended use of said tool you get a rougher cut. It comes down to which one you get. That is why this is occurring but not consistently with every cylinder. Adding to this is the lack of chamfer on the charge holes. That 2/3rds of titanium that makes up the charge hole edge is left sharp (only the extraction rod area is chamfered). Mine was like a razor actually. That edge is gonna bite into the expanding case like a knife. Now to further exacerbate the situation the chamber pressure is going to dictate the cases expansion against the smooth or rougher cylinder walls and charge hole edge. Therefore now factor in bullet weight and burn rate of the powder. For example the guy with the smooth cylinder shooting loads with say Unique behind a 124 is having no problems. The poor bastard shooting the rough cylinder with Titegroup behind a 147 is impaling his palm with the ejection rod. Simple fix is to send the cylinder out for a full charge hole chamfer and internal polish by a good revolver guy.
And who hits the ejector rod with their Palm?
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Depends what you mean by would not run. I've never had a problem with my Glock 41 feeding SWCs loaded to the correct OAL. However, it is less forgiving to light loads (with resulting FTF / FTEs) than my 1911s.
I also don't shoot bare lead (although I use HiTek) but that's because I hate cleaning leading.
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OP states he's using a dot sight. Hat aside, I agree that different POI <> inaccurate. If it groups well, you'll need to adjust the sight to zero it with the new barrel / comp. My RMR has hash marks on the adjustment screws - I scratched a Zero mark on them, and take a pic of where they are at zero on each gun. I can change it between guns and get it close enough to zero without firing a shot for most shooting.
It takes only a very minor change in
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On sale at cabelas right now.
Thanks man I just orderd 2000 147 grain for $157.48.
Me too. Free shipping to boot is nice.
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Use 9mm load data
This is what Starline told me, although they couched it (assuming for liability reasons) to something like "many of our customers have success using 9mm load data". I've never checked case volume but it seems pretty close.
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Hi there. Nice to have another new englander here - I'm in RI. And having young kids is no excuse not to get out at some matches - I've got 2 & 4 year olds and get out to at least a couple a month. Between MA, RI, and NH there's something going on just about every weekend.
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FL resize and trim. X-die on all future loadings. Never trim again.
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Brazos
2-22
Limited 40
No idea on spot, est. Delivery was May.
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Completely agree and that is why I'm setting my limit at $1000 for this gun. As long as the gun is reliable and reasonably accurate then it is really the shooter. There is a reason that Ben S. has won national titles with a Beretta and the only female shooter to make GM shoots for Taurus.I have a POS Citidale in 9mm that has beaten SVIs, Wilsons, Trojans, les baers, Springfields, Kimbers, Brazos edges (L10), and various custom guns. I had a RI in 45 that had done the same. I sold the 45 and bought a Springfield Trophy Match and while defiantly fitted better I can't say it is actually any better for this sport. I think we all get too caught up in brands, especially in SS. If your gun is reliable and reasonably accurate spending big on a pistol seems to me to be a waste of component money. Buy what you want, but don't be surprised when a kid with a Taurus shows up and whips everyone. (I have seen it happen).
SIG TME 9mm. Good gun, doesn't even have the crazy SIG 1911 profile.
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Second load extracted fine
2.9gr N320
160 Bayou RN
1.145 OAL
No Chrono yet on either load
Same load w 2.6 GR N320 made 115 PF, 2.7 GR made 120 PF. So that's probably right in the ball park. How's accuracy? Are you using the 9mm or.357 Bayous?
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Ive used the WFT and own a WFT2. Bought the WFT2 because I load multiple rifle calibers, and did not want to drop a fortune on different trimmers.
I chucked mine in my drill press at first, but pushing up on the cases sucked. Now I just run it in a 1/2 hand drill set horizontally in my bench vise at about 1500 RPM. Works like a champ and is stupid simple. I SSTL wet tumble, so I dont bother with deburring and chamfering case mouths, the tumbler does that for me.
That being said, the Giraud is probably the best trimmer out there, does everything in a single step.
This is exactly what I do, no complaints.
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The load is nothing special, a typical 147gr/n320 recipeSomebody should ask James McGinty what load he runs in his 929. He shot that gun last year at Revo Nats and everything worked plenty well.
flat primers and all.
heh.
Must be a pretty hot load - although I guess I still haven't worked up a true minor load for my 929...
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I have not tested for accuracy but I got the following outdoors 39deg out of a G17. Same Bayou pill.
1.13 3.0GR TG 878FPS
1.13 3.2GR TG 928FPS
This is closer to what I'd expect than the info posted above.
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The 547, the old k frame without moonclips, for lack of a better term had a second firing pin. This second pin was flattened on the face and hit the case rim to push the 9mm back into the chamber after firing so it wouldn't drag on the breachface.
First hand, I haven't had this issue, even with 40-50 rounds of pretty quick shooting. Moreover, every case in a revolver (or auto) is forced back when the gun is fired. It would take a lot to force it back and expand it so much that it won't move in and out (have some play) that it would cause binding. In other words, if a case is forced back hard enough to bind the gun, I'd think ejection would be tough as the case would really have to be stuck in there.I have heard recently that the new S&W 929 PC has been having lockup issues. It appears that during extended use such as a competition the cases are backing out and causing the cylinder to jam. Has anyone out there experienced this problem? I have been shooting a 627 in 38 Special and also in 38 Super and never experienced any issues of any kind. Please advise.
The tapered case was enough of a problem that they went through a fair bit of trouble to install 2 frame mounted pins during the time period that the other guns had their firing pins on the hammer.
I believe the moon clips reduce the problem enough that the second firing pin is unnecessary.
Not very familiar with the 547, but enough to know its a totally different animal than the 929. Tapered case aside its no different than shooting a moon clipped 38. And there's nothing about the taper that would make it inherently more likely to stick / drag. High primers, out of spec moonclips, or a loose ejector rod all seem more likely culprits than something 9mm specific. I've got complaints about my 929, but this ain't one.
New Guy From RI
in Introduce Yourself
Posted
Paul - as a fellow Rhode Islander, welcome. Where / what comps do you shoot in the area?