AirForce2

Just got my Green Receiver comp model this week. Well, maybe I'll not ditch the mossberg JM Pro just yet. Haven't shot the Rem Versa Max Competition Tactical yet, but let me just say how sh_ _ _ y it is to load a shell into the tube. Amazing that they let this gun leave the factory and I know it was fired, which means they had to load the tube. The shell is so hard to force into the tube once the brass casing hits the hump on the outside of lifter/carrier and then excessive pressure from the lip of the shell catch once you get it past the lifter, that the sh_ t_ y designed short lifter will snatch the crap out of your thumb. I only loaded 2 shells and single loading is terrible and no way could you do a load 2 or 4. Took it apart today and did a quick grind down on the rear and sides of the foregrip for load 2/4's and this should be ok. -Took down the ears right at the 10, 2, 4, and 8 o'clock positions right at the junction of the shell tube on the load port. -Polished & rounded the chamber entry lip & extractor area on the barrel. -Also made enough room on polishing down the ext/outside hump of the lifter and a hair off the inner front lifter legs that contact the bolt bottom and a slight rounding of the front shell latch corner on the inside edge and corners and now the lifter doesn't cause any drag during loading a shell, but loading a shell into the tube is still excessively hard and then the crap lifter grabs your thumb due to the shell catch lip catching on the brass of the shell. Unfriggin believable. It's a pain to load a full tube for sure, and the Remington folks that test it must know it, because I've seen reviews since last summer that the competition model gun magazine etc.. reviewers told them it was to short and they were supposed to make the lifter longer. The lifter on this shotgun sucks worse than any gun out there because it's too short. At least other guns lifter ears would be long enough to go close to the tube opening so that only the middle of the lifter would catch your thumb. This thing is straight across but a good 1/2 to 3/4 inch to short. The trigger feels like a mushy old rusty grenade pin being pulled. I'll have to say the mossberg trigger is sweet in comparison. Goods: -Nice steel shell tube (not as good as the steel tube carbon arms uses) and the carbon sleeve is also the spacer for the end cap to hold the foregrip tight. -+2 tube ext is not steel inside, so hope the carbon is good enough. It's mostly only going to house the spring and part of the follower with 10 rds loaded, so little risk to hamper feeding. -Fit a finish of most of the gun seem good and came with 4 ext tube chokes which is nice assuming they work good and don't need to buy briley's. -Internal parts and ext had no major jagged edges that I could see. Bads/not impressed: -The lifter sucks (see my comments above in this post). PO'd me off that still need to spend $50 or more to fix their crap design. It's worse than typical remington model shotgun lifters. Remington, pls tell the under 10 year olds/xbox shotgun design team that must have the old blind persons, people who've never shot or used shotguns before to please run their finished design/product thru the "NON blind" QA dept, and maybe someone who knows how a firearm should function before blessing the production. I know they had the right people to give them inputs. -Throwup green receiver, whatever. Might have well made it glow in the dark zombie green. -Trigger pull-feels like it's designed for a jittery 8 year old to not go off if they were having spaz attacks or stroke. Nice smooth 8-10 pds feels like. Hope it will get better and lighten up a little after some shooting. -Also found as set up right now even w/polishing the lifter legs and the hump, I'm unable to unload any shells by pushing the lifter all the way up and releasing the shell release, the shell releases but won't come over the hump in the lifter, so all shells have to be chambered and ejected by bolt which stinks for dummy load practice or unloading live rounds. -Shell catch-loading shells is like stuffin a round peg thru a sqround hold. You have to push so hard to get it by the shell catch and then the short lifter grabs the heck of the thumb becaue you had to force so hard your thumb goes way to far into the tube. Who friggin designed this thing "an old world beaver trap maker". -The rubber tape or whatever is on the stock handle and foregrip-not so grippy and likely just gets in the way or slippery when sweaty or oil. Should have just made the finish rough or left alone so a $3 soldering iron & tip stippling can be done. Not sure if I can stipple the rubber areas or if the rubber can come off. Edits: -I stopped by to show Mark at Carbon Arms the new comp model and ask his input and he was nice enough to explain the differences and what he's seen so far and to get inputs on the shell stop, carbon tube etc... Let's just set it straight per Mark says he helped w/inputs on several areas including the tube/carbon sleeve, but this is not parts by Carbon Arms. Mark said he would have done some items different in respect to a better steel tube and maybe something other than the solid carbon +2 ext due to blasts and carbon ext past the barrel. -He helped show me some of the mods to the shell stop and lifter even though there are items online, I just wasn't quite sure which areas to work and I made mine better, but still to much drag from the shell stop on the brass portion of the comp model. I decided to use the nordic +2 ext instead of the carbon one or at least have it extra in case the blast starts breaking up the carbon past the barrel (I hear getting this stuff ingested is kinda bad for ya). More to come in the next week or 2 when I get to the range and perfect some items. I hand racked the bolt 200+ times and disassembled and cleaned lubed the gun. I will try to post some good pics of any mods I can narrow down. Planned actions: -shorten stock & get LOP at 13 inches & add limbsaver low profile 5/8 inch grind to fit (shouldn't be to bad since the fact puss pad was 2 inch thick) -have to send the lifter to C-Rums to extend it (still want the shell guide groove/hump just less of it). I bitched so much about it to Remington, they are sending me an extra lifter) -a must to smooth out the shell catch/release section so I can load shells smoother -rear sight is ok, but I'm going w/HiViz adj rear on rib -grinded and smoothed front & side foregrip near the load port and it's almost narrows down to nothing so hope this works or may have to cut out a slot on rear center foregrip for load 2/4's -maybe light trigger polishing -stipple areas around the rubber sticker grips on rear stock and front foregrip -match saver install on foregrip

Well, maybe I'll not ditch the mossberg just yet. Haven't shot the Rem Versa Max Competition Tactical yet, but let me just say how sh_ _ _ y it is to load a shell into the tube. Amazing that they let this gun leave the factory and I know it was fired, which means they had to load the tube. The shell is so hard to force into the tube once the brass casing hits the hump on the outside of lifter/carrier and then excessive pressure from the lip of the shell catch once you get it past the lifter, that the sh_ t_ y designed short lifter will snacth the crap out of your thumb. I only loaded 2 shells. Took it apart today and did a quick grind down on the rear and sides of the foregrip for load 2/4's and this should be ok. Took down the ears right at the 10, 2, 4, and 8 o'clock positions right at the junction of the shell tube and load port. Polished & rounded the chamber entry lip & extractor area on the barrel. Also made enough room on polishing down the ext/outside hump of the lifter and a hair off the inner front lifter legs that contact the bolt bottom and a slight rounding of the front shell latch corner on the inside edge and corners and now the lifter doesn't cause any drag during loading a shell, but loading a shell into the tube is still excessively hard and then the crap lifter grabs your thumb due to the shell catch lip catching on the brass of the shell. Unfriggin believable. It's a pain to load a full tube for sure, and the Remington folks that test it must know it, because I've seen reviews since last summer that the competition model gun magazine etc.. reviewers told them it was to short and they were supposed to make the lifter longer. The lifter on this shotgun sucks worse than any gun out there because it's too short. At least other guns lifter ears would be long enough to go close to the tube opening so that only the middle of the lifter would catch your thumb. This thing is straight across but a good 1/2 to 3/4 inch to short. The trigger feels like a mushy old rusty grenade pin being pulled. I'll have to say the mossberg trigger is sweat in comparison. Goods: -Nice steel shell tube and the carbon sleeve is also the spacer for the end cap to hold the foregrip tight. -+2 tube ext is not steel inside, so hope the carbon is good enough. It's mostly only going to house the spring and part of the follower with 10 rds loaded, so little risk to hamper feeding. Carbon Arms is the tube I think and it's nice & light. -Fit a finish of most of the gun seem good and came with 4 ext tube chokes which is nice assuming they work good and don't need to buy briley's. -Internal parts and ext had no major jagged edges that I could see. Bads/not impressed: -The lifter sucks (see my comments above in this post). PO'd me off that still need to spend $50 or more to fix their crap design. It's worse than typical remington model shotgun lifters. Remington, pls tell the under 10 year olds/xbox shotgun design team that must have the old blind persons, people who've never shot or used shotguns before to please run their finished design/product thru the "NON blind" QA dept, and maybe someone who knows how a firearm should function before blessing the production. I know they had the right people to give them inputs. -Throwup green receiver, whatever. Might have well made it glow in the dark zombie green. -Trigger pull-feels like it's designed for a jittery 8 year old to not go off if they were having spaz attacks or stroke. Nice smooth 8-10 pds feels like. -Shell catch-loading shells is like stuffin a round peg thru a sqround hold. You have to push so hard to get it by the shell catch and then the short lifter grabs the heck of the thumb becaue you had to force so hard your thumb goes way to far into the tube. Who friggin designed this thing "an old world beaver trap maker". -The rubber tape or whatever is on the stock handle and foregrip-not so grippy and likely just gets in the way or slippery when sweaty or oil. Should have just made the finish rough or left alone so a $3 soldering iron & tip stippling can be done. Not sure if I can stipple the rubber areas or if the rubber can come off.

Kinda funny, past 2 days had good ending for my JM Pro and tonight I got confirmation my Remington Competition Tact is being shipped to my FFL. Just gonna shoot the Rem a hundred or so rounds before I do to much dicking with it ie...gonna have to cut down the stock shorter, add an adj rear sight, maybe stipple, likely have to fix the shell stop (hear shells are a PIA to load already), weld up or shave down lifter (heard loading double/quad loads due to lifter is iffy). Good god, can't they listen to people and test & develop before they produce anymore? Maybe I'll do a post on the "competition model" later.

70 more rounds today of estate comp 7.5 shot, 1 1/8 oz, functioned flawless. I don't know if it's just the notch in the new trigger assy fixed it, but it's finally shooting good again. I had my old trigger assy with a similar mod and I'm confident the shell stop assy wasn't touching the trigger housing, but maybe I was close . I tried to look at my other pics of the trigger assy but don't have any pics from the front or top view to be able to tell if the new one vs old one has a shorter front trig assy fork. I still have the #2 shell stop assy that I tweeked in the gun and I did measure both and there was not dimensional diff on shell stop assy's. Thanks to all for the assistance. Hopefully this thread will solve some issues.

Shot 50 rounds out of it today and it ran them all fine. Herters 7.5 shot, 1 1/8 oz, 1200 fps. Better than it was before. Something in the new trigger assembly must have made it better. I haven't gone 50 rds without a jam in the prev 400 rds. Nothing changed or added since I got it from factory. They didn't replace my tube spring, recoil spring or anything else.

I think your referring to the little short thin super hard metal cap with the hole in the middle? That sure doesn't polish like normal steel, it's super hard (titanium?) Yep it's all the way forward as far as it can go when I try to install the guide rod & spring. Just seems there is to much angle/guide rod a hair long to get the angle right because the front tip of the guide rod jams against the sharp inner backside of the end cap. I even tried putting pressure with a small screwdriver up against the forward bottom of the guide rod to help it. Should I just shorten the guide rod tip a mm and see if that helps? I surely dont' want to remove from the rear I'd guess. I polished all the areas a hair and it's still a multiple try affair to install it. Would suck to remove the bushing every time. Are you saying I should screw the bushing out some and remove the guide rod cap, insert the guide rod & spring and push the end cap from the top of the gun?

I think Mossberg thinks this will make the shell stop swing in/out front & back portion more freely, or prevent binding in the rear shell stop portion. The rear portion must swing inward toward center of gun in order for the front shell stop portion to swing outward and release a shell. Problem is the front portion of shell stop only swings outward to release a shell as much as the bottom most cut on the bolt rail angle will allow because the bottom rail cut angle ride againse the flat ledge sticking out the top of the shell stop assy. The new trigger assy is a little tighter in the receiver than my other one was so I'm not sure if there are any other dimensions different on the new one. My trigger feels a little stiff, but likely a few shots will be good again. I forgot to take out my ruger 10/22 spring from my old trigger assy, so I lost that but still have one extra. I'm gonna run the stock one and if I get a light primer strike, then replace it. Actually a shell kicking out of the tube to the rear part over the lifter and stopping against the rear portion of the trigger assy also must keep the rear portion of the shell stop assy from locking the gun open. I don't have pics, but the old trigg assy I removed 1/8 to 1/4 inch across the front trigger assy and also still had to shave down the side portion like Mossberg did on the new one. Be careful not to just cut the front face only on one side (I don't know if section is likely where the shell stops against just before lifter throws it up to chamber or if the rear vertical notch in shell assy does some of that) You guys with this type of malfunction, look at my pics and compare the new mossy trigger assy front area with yours and see if your's has a lot more meat across the front trig assy face just past the circle where the hamper spring would get inserted under the hammer or if has a notch cut into yours like the above pic. Mine still looks like its cutting a silver nick right at the front corner from a bunch of hand cycles. I'm going to put 50-100 rds thru it tomorrow and see.

I called Mossberg and talked with claimed service tech lead (Joe) and discussed my gun issues and the hit/miss functioning 930 JM Pro guns out there. I also explained the multiple issues and malfunctions that are out there as not acceptable for a defensive or sporting weapon. I basically said I feel the JM Pro is a coin flip and that if they don't address the issues to make this gun more reliable, the sales will be good for 2 years and then these sales will go down a lot more once there are to many malfunctions and problem guns out of the box for people to deal with. I asked him after describing the fixes I've done and the lingering malfunction of cycling spent casing and then closing on empty chamber rounds stay in the tube and hand cycle works every time, what made them center on replacing the trigger assy, as a cure for this malfunction. He claimed there were some trig assy's that had issues on some models yet didn't really seem to know what the difference was. He seemed to care and said he had seen my gun and all the extra 3-gun mod work put in so decided to leave the carrier on the new trig assy. I looked today to a physical difference on the trigger assy they gave me and guess what at least one difference is mod is? The same think I tried to do night before the pike peak challenge listed in my earlier post. The new mossber replace trig assy has a decent portion cut back on the front forks of the trigger assy portion. This is the channeled area right behind where the lifter swings up and down to clear the front portion of the trigger assy. Also same area in front of the hammer if hammer was vertical as viewed when trig assy is out of the gun. They also put a notch/groove vertically and cut into the shell stop assy side of the trigger section. This is also where the shell as it comes rearward from the loading tube would stop before the lifter flops it upward to the chamber. This is the same exact thing I did on my gun as a last ditch effort and it did not help at all. The new trig assy still shows the rear of the shell stop assy hits right on the new notched area and actually rides across the front ledge ie..shell stop rear portion still scapes the front of the trigg assy sectionfrom the little bit of cycling I've done. This new trigger assy portion was "factory", it didn't seem as if someone had done this on a factory part and was blued. The new trigger assy does seem a little tighter side to side and movement in the receiver area. I'll let you know how the testing goes.

I've been shooting my new accu shadow 9mm since mid Feb 2014 and here are some inputs on it. My background was mainly shooting USPSA pretty heavy 1990-1999 w/Springfield P-9 .40's and then 1911 STI in open and limited class. Was a high ranked A class shooter and one of the first Air Force Shooting Team members in late 90's. I've been out of shooting totally until Feb 2014. I received the CZ Accu Shadow Feb 2014. The accu shadow performed well, which is should for a $1600 custom production piece. -trigger is excellent and soft for a double action production class gun (sucks that USPSA makes the first shot start w/hammer down since I think this is a potentially dangerous habit to drop the hammer on a weapon that has cock/lock capability) -accuracy is good w/just std ammo-100 yd bottom of gun only on sandbag produced a 8 inch group with just some ultramax rnd nose 115 gr. -Function is very good, I did just a minor polishing at the top of the feed ramp as it breaks into the chamber and the outer edges around the chamber opening, but a good job overall from CZ Custom. Let's me know they set the ramp angles right. -Light strikes on the primer: This is not the bullets fault. When I changed brands and shot other brands of ammo, I instantly had light primer hits. With some harder primers it was one more out of 10-15 rds. This is because the trigger and accu springs are much lighter to get the great single and double action trigger pull so light that it "may" cause light primer hits on harder primers. I don't want a gun that's fickle on primer hardness, so I replaced the rear handle hammer spring with a 2 pnd higher version 15 pd vs 13 pd that came with. No need to replace the firing pin or firing pin spring because the accu shadow already comes with an extended firing pin and a light cut down firing pin return spring. I don't want to have to worry about light hits. This cured my light strikes and did make the double action a hair heavier but not enough to worry about. Some guns may/may not have this issue, but if you do like to shoot any primers other than soft federal, it's an option. I wish there was a 1 pd higher spring vs 2 pd but what can you do. -magazines: I have some CZ factory 10 rds (tks CO anti gun politicians). I also have some Mecgar high caps and they all work well so far. I like the Mecgar 17 & 19 rd versions because the outside finish is really "slickery" finish. -holster: I started with the DAA PDR CZ hoslter and just didn't like the draw. If you don't draw at the perfect, exact angle each time, it would stick in the holster like it had a lock engaged and made me feel like Barney Fife (old show for you younger guys). I even tried heating up the holster and created some more front/back and side to side give and this helped some but not enough. Competitive Edge Dynamics was good enough to give me credit and I swapped for the new DAA PDR Pro model that just recently came out and I like the range of adjustments and cant and the holster is more like a heavy duty version of a bladetech but with more adjustments for you. I have a bladetech also and it's great for less than $30 for sure. -sights: I like the sites, but damn, I always want the ability to adjust my rear sight up/down and left/right without using a hammer or some special device. Me personally I have no problem shooting accurate "slow". It's when I use speed it seems for me a smaller front site post and a smaller rear sight window would make me more accurate when shooting fast. The sites are good though, but I'd recommend putting a little clear epoxy around the sides of the fiber optics since for 20 years the front site can hit a prop and bust the fiber optic which falls out or sometimes the ends just crack off and out goes your fiber optic (did that years ago). I hope to get a smaller rear sight blade and/or smaller front & back. ie...not the .120 inch window rear & front but something around .09 inch sized. Will have to custom it though. -guide rod: For some reason putting the guide rod and spring back into the upper end is a pain in the rear. It seems the front point of the guide rod gets caught on the front opening of the busing opening and I have to fight it several minutes to get it to get thru the hole. Had to try to round off the rough edges a little and it's still a fight. -CZ grips: Hmm, they look cool, but who and what reason to put such a non purpose smooth grip on most of the side panels is beside me. I would like to see a little more front & front side corner strap checkering and also on the rear strap on all CZ's, esp the custom ones. Something more like an STI plastic grip checker/stippling as standard. I hate the idea of using skateboard tape on a high dollar pistol. That means it could be better from the factory if bunches of people have to put better grip panels and tape on it. I may try the VZ grips. I think the Accu shadow should already come with them in your choice of color no charge. Hope the slide stop doesn't break on the newer guns much. I think the 9mm should keep that from happening vs the old designs or on the higher powered .40 cal/38 sup. Seems this is still a crutch occasionally and you should purchase & carry a spare with you especially if you like to run a low power recoil spring & hot loads on your guide rod. Kinda hard to do a speed load of a slide stop replacement during a stage, but it can be done like I did at the 199X nationals. Overall, I like the CZ Accu Shadow. It's expensive, but the upside is your getting hopefully a good custom functioning setup and a highly sought after accurate gun for fun, defense, or competition. After only practicing for 8 hours total since 1999, my first match in May at local club after 14 years not even shooting a pistol every year at all and I placed 5th out of 35 at my first match in production class which was also 5 classifiers to get classed in production. Didn't feel to great but not bad and the CZ had some to do with it.

6/5/14-I received my mossberg back from the factory today. I may go shoot it tomorrow and waste another $40 between range fee and shells cost. I don't feel it's needed to shoot the gun, here's why: Upon inspection and reading the work order, the only think they did was replaced the "trigger assy". I sent them a long very detailed description of the previous and current issue with my shotgun and they replaced the part that only required replacing because I told them I modified the front fork in front of the hammer as a last ditch effort in case this was interfering with the rear of shell stop assy. I also told them this mod did not make the problem better or worse and was a last ditch effort to fix my issue is the only reason I needed a new trigger assy. I called mossberg and vented to the guy Ignaseo who works the phones in tech support and he took notes and said he would have the tech support lead call me tomorrow. We'll see if he calls me, if not I'll try to talk w/him after noon since I'm working a 12 hour mid shift tonight. I also sent them the gun cleaned fully & spotless. I won't do that this time if there is a 2nd return. I plan to insist on a return auth from mossbergs dime this time. I was pretty PO'd that either they didn't read the details or care enough to look at or replace any other components. I asked the tech phone rep if he could send me a new piston & the piston housing guts and he said he could only send me the piston. At this point I'd say send me a new barrel and piston & piston housing and a new shell tube. If that doesn't cure it, it's done. Are there any mossberg reps on this site? If you are pls chime in. My only goal now is to get a working gun so I can feel good about selling it to someone else. This is poor service and design on a no so technical firearm and a company that has done nothing but shotguns primarily for years and still puts out such a hit/miss product. If our cars ran this poorly out of the box we tend to not be so tolerant, and cars are way lots more technical. For some reason bad guns are accepted and protected by many as "it happens" or "it's the shooters ammo/fault". Here is the major portion of the letter I sent them with the 1st return: ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mossberg Arms Service Dept, PLEASE, IF POSSIBLE RETURN TO ME BELOW ITEMS, THEY COST A LOT OF MONEY & TIME TO MODIFY FOR MY FITMENT: - MY ORIG REAR STOCK, LIMBSAVER RECOIL PAD, AND STOCK SCREWS, INNER NUT & ALUM SPACER. -FRONT HANDGUARD -LIFTER GATE Ser#: I use Briley Ext chokes and can’t find my orig flush chokes, so insert one before testing pls. I’m returning this problematic 930 JM Pro, 22 inch (700 rds thru gun) in hopes that you can make it a reliable weapon. I bought this brand new in Late Dec 13, but did not get around to shooting it until mid Feb 2014 for the first time. Since this time I’ve had a multitude of malfunctions in the first 200 rds and fixed most except one particular issue has grown noticeably worse after 400 rds. I was able to reduce the tube spring length, and reshape the shell stop assembly to reduce a majority of the issues that seem to plague this platform but one still remains: When gun was new: *double feeds *bolt locks open w/live shells still in the tube *shells don’t feed from the tube yet the empty shell extracts but bolt closes on empty chamber *major scarring/gouging a line into the shell holder tube from the top thread that connects the ext tube down thru the piston assy after only 100 rds. I had to use 2,000 grit sandpaper to remove most of the gouge and also slight debur an area inside the piston housing (an o-ring) of the barrel to keep it from ruining the tube. *Shell holder tube & ext Nordic tube joint misaligned-causing follower to kink at the junction. NOW:I was able to get rid of every malfunction except one and this has grown from a 2-5% per hundred rds to occurring appx 15% to 30% of the time, regardless of soft loads, medium, or heavy loads. Live shell will not release reliably from the tube during firing and the empty casing ejects but will not feed a live shell out of the tube and bolt closes on an empty chamber. Each time this occurs, a hand (manual) cycle of the bolt rearward releases the next live shell from the tube and feeds correctly. Even if all gun parts disassembled & cleaned/lubed, Gets much worse after 20-50 rds. After 100 rds was happening 20-30% of the time but only 0-1 in first 20 rds after detailed cleaning of entire gun. Gas system? I need a new trigger assembly-My last ditch effort before a major match and last time I shot this gun, I shaved off the front portion of the area at the back of the lifter (front most portion of the trigger assembly) to see if this was interfering with the rear shell stop assy. This did not make the malfunction any better or worse surprisingly -It does not seem to be better nor worse with a full, half full, or a few rounds in the tube. -It is not dependant on the power of the load used.Most have been 2 3/4 , 7.5 shot, 1 1/8 ozand some 1 oz shot loads varying in speed from 1150 – 1300 fps. -It appears to happen only 1 or 2 times first 30 rds after a full gun cleaning including a detailed carbon removal from the piston housing & piston & rings (removed for cleaning) and inspection after cleaning. -There are weird marks on the tube portion that sits near the gas holes of the barrel (blackish, burn scores).Since this malfunction seems to grow at a higher rate every 20 rds or so after detailed cleaning, I suspect something in the gas system/area. Sometimes it will fire 8-10 rds fine but most times will jam each round or skipping a few rounds. -Does not matter if pistion and piston housing are dry, dry lube/light lube only on piston & piston housing, wet or very wet lubed piston/piston housing.Also doesn’t matter is rest of gun is dry, mediun, very wet lubed. I was preparing for a major USPSA shotgun match and knew I couldn’t send the gun back and returned before so after hours of inspection of all parts inside, and deburring any/all sharp edges had to attend the match with terrible results. I spent a lot of money in May due to this platform: -$100 on 300 plus rds of ammo function firing/range fees 1-16 May -$45 replacing parts I ordered from Mossberg a few weeks ago, no help. These items were: - the recoil spring in the rear stock - shell stop assembly & shell assy spring: Non of these helped reduce the primary malfunction but a new shell stop assembly did give me a return of an additional problem that I’d gotten rid of previously so now the gun bolt was locking back with rounds in the tube and also still cycling the bolt closed on empty chamber, but round/rounds still in the tube. I had to reshape/debur a brand new shell stop assy just to get back to one type of malfunction. - forward shell tube spring. -$200 cost of major shotgun match entry, ammo, gas, prep. Gun functioned terrible and had to hand cycle 30%-50% of the rounds by end of match and had to DNF last to stages because tired of hand racking and when gun goes click cost me tons of failure to engage & missed activated targets including risk of getting unsafe towards a DQ. If I can't trust a gun in competition, I sure can't trust it as a defense weapon either. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I have a solution in the works thanks to Mossberg's assistance. Just sucks it's cost so much in comparison. Buds Guns shop: $1350 VersaMax Comp Tactical is enroute

PS. If your gun won't hand cycle it's probably not a gas system issue. Likely the shell stop assembly and/or shell stop springs or the tube spring, or lifter. Steve at RAS gave me a good suggestion to removed the trigger assy & lifter out of the gun and see if it hand cycles reliably then. This may narrow down you're problem area to eliminate the lifter/trigger assy section so you can focus on the tube spring/shell stop assy. That's if the gas rings cleaning doesn't work.

Your problem most likely will not be fixed by the recoil spring in the rear stock (I had a few of the same jams you had in the first 300 rds thru the gun) and cutting down the recoil spring, using a Nordic spring appx 10-11 inch past end, and a cut down 14 inch past tube factory spring & a new full length factory spring, no help. Between 300 rds and 7-800 rds the issue grew like a weed and happened 30% of the time or more. I worked over and smoothed out all the internals including the shell stop assy also. I picked and scraped all the carbon off the piston & removed both rings and clean all the grooves to, no help. My piston moved in/out easily also. Issue compounds as the round count went up every 20 rds (from an all items cleaned & lubed start point). The Nordic spring is much stiffer. A new Mossberg feed tube spring is cheap, but should not be installed at full length in my opinion. I think a new Mossy tube spring even w/Nordic XXL end cap should not be 19-20 inches past the tube, but more like 16 inches past and bend down the 1/8 inch of the ends down & into slightly and rounded so no wrapping in the end cap or follower. Remember, it's not a good idea to stretch a hardened steel spring much at all because it likely will only make it weaker quicker back down to the orig spg weight or even less. If you scape out and brush out all the carbon on the piston & 2 rings inside & out and at least remove gunk/carbon and lube the piston housing the piston goes into, you should be good. If this doesn't fix it, then your in the same boat as I am, awaiting Mossberg to fix the same issue on mine. I suspect a gas system issue on yours that you can fix by cleaning. I suspect a gas system issue on mine that requires gas sys parts. Regardless of how or what they do to mine at the factory, it's being replaced by another brand as I write this. I will test it, hope it runs and leave it on a doorstep somewhere and ring the doorbell and haul ass away. I bought a gun that's been out 2 years and had every issue that can plague the JM Pro and fixed most of them which tells me the factory should have a handle on it by now and I don't think they do. No excuse for a company that's been making a not so technical semi auto & pump shotgun for years. My gun was made before Jul/Aug 2013 by the paperwork from the dealer and I bought it new Dec 2013. Good luck.

After reviewing my first couple of posts, it appears I was already having this (bolt cycles, ejects spent, gun goes click, shell stays in the tube) problem leftover after fixing the double feeds & bolt locking open w/shells in the tube. I just only had it a few times every 50-100 rds. Now after messing with it so much and can't seem to get any relief is why I'm hoping it's the gas system. Especially after putting in a brand new shell stop assy and this immediately gave me an additional malfunction back of "bolt locking to rear w/shells in tube". I'm hard headed at times and to some, never should have touched it at all and let the factory do all the work. I like to be in the know and it makes me confident when I can narrow down a problem and fix/learn it in the process. If the engineers and Tech/Repair folks in the gun manf business put 1/3 of my efforts, thought, and care into a working and tested components, there would be a whole lot less bad guns and shooting related products out there to send back. My lesson learned: Be confident and have enough rounds thru the gun before adding your goodies and setup items to it. It was a long cold winter/spring so I did some work to make it better for 3 gun & my liking before shooting it much. Hope I get my stock & fore grip back, that stippling job and stock shortening was a lotta work. I boxed up the JM Pro and shipped it back to Mossy with a 3 page typed letter 5/23/14. I've also done a review online on: -xdm .40 & xdm .40 comp (firing line forum) -ruger SR40 & SR40C (If you own one you should read it) ruger forum.net -Taurus 738 (.380) firing line forum

Thanks Steve, I like the idea of racking a bunch of rounds thru without the trigger assy & lifter in the gun, hadn't thought of that for sure. Here are a few pics of the gun internals and even going excessive on the brand new shell stop assembly versus the brownells example in my opinion. The parts looked scratched up, but all of the internals showing silver are just the bluing polished off. I also tried to setup the primary parts outside of the receiver but in fairly close to where they would be inside the receiver so people can kinda get an idea what's going on inside. Wanted to add a pic of my tube to show some odd burn marks, but think I'm at my limit for pic sizes. Img 102923-The bottom flat portion of the 2 piece bolt assy if you look close along the bottom side has 3 varying steps as the bolt comes back and seems to have 3 areas that change the position of the shell stop assy. The rear most portion of the bolt section 10% has a high side(when the bolt is forward/locked into chamber). This should keep the front shell stop into the middle of tube to keep shells from coming out and also keep the rear portion of the shell stop pushed outward toward the receiver wall. As the bolt it thrown rearward, the middle section of the lower bolt rail (70% or more) is mostly flat and a little lower and seems to cause a slight shift of the front part of the shell stop to partially come out from behind the live shell by the follower in the tube (does not full releases a shell yet) I think the front & rear shell stop assy are appx even tilt so to speak. Then as the bolt comes all the way back there is a slight dip inward (to the center of the chamber). This is what looks like the full release of the front shell stop that allows a round to kick backward into the lifter area and stops right in front or on the front trigger assy area and then the lifter flops upward after the small hammer sticking up in the rear of pic 102923. If you look at your part and pic, you will see I even shaved off a major portion on front of the trigger assy where the lifter swings up/down the night before the match just to see if this was interfering with the shell stop rear assy portion. Surprisingly it didn't make it feed any worse nor make the release of shells worse or better. I guess the rear of shell stop assy is supposed to sit against the trigger assy at times when the bolt is fully locked back or rearmost cycle of the bolt.

What company is this guy Steve working for and what does RAS stand for. tks Let's just say I've never wanted to discontinue a match before, but being it was my first shotgun match and so many malfunctions today, I felt it better to bow out after 8 of the 10 stages at the Pikes Peak Shotgun Challenge with the malfunction #'s growing each stage and was worried that I'd do something dangerous. Great fun match. I'd say out of an avg stage count of 20 rds fired, I had anywhere from 2-6 rds per stage that would just go click on an empty chamber and have to hand rack. The only malfunction free stage was my first one of the day. You watch a lot of clay pigeons go by with all the activated targets thrown and gun malfunctions in between shots and keeping up with reloading let me tell ya. That spinning target you gotta hit and make it swing over is not cool either when every other shot requires hand rack. Funny, out of our 10-12 person squad at least 3 had a JM Pro, maybe 4, one was a Flannigan, still 930 pro'ish and out of all the people that had gun issues Mossberg was 1st Place in that dept in our squad. I took top malfunction honors. The last stage the RO said he'd seen a "whole lot" of mossbergs having issues today. One guy had a versamax and had probs on multiple stages, but don't know his gun or habits ie...new gun, ammo, etc I will let you guys know in a month or 2 when I get my gun back from Mossberg (if they will work on it) since I've 3 gun mod'd it quite a bit. My money's on it being a gas system piston or piston housing issue. Thanks for the suggestions

Has anyone looked at the rear most portion of the shell stop as a dummy round is fed from the tube, the shell feeds out of the tube back over the elevator and as shell goes rearward it slide along the inside flat of the shell stop assembly and disengages the shell stop out from under the elevator to be fed upwards to chamber? Easier w/everything except the tube off the gun and everything in the receiver w/flashlight. My rear shell stop (rear slotted/extractor section) bumps into the ejection side of the front most portion of the trigger group. I assume the shell rides back and stops at this point and by that time has moved the rear portion of the shell stop into the side to release the elevator then kicks the shell upward. I'm not sure if this is a bad thing for the rear hook to hit the side of the trigger housing area or not. Thoughts? I've double checked and all parts in this gun have been deburred/smoothed and recontoured the shell stop forward hook (front area). My friends in the day called me the dremel king and with the soft multi size & shaped polishing heads can do wonders if an area is not 90 degrees then I use a file. I do all of my feed ramps, resurface, shape, mirror finish with these. Find them on amazon in an orange box "54 pc universal rotary assorted grit rubber polish accessory kit for dremel"

Do you guys think Mossberg will pay for shipping ie..(return auth) or make me ship on my dime? I bought the gun in late Dec and didn't shoot it until mid Feb for the first time. I had problems from the start and tried to fix on my own and just recently orderend $40 in parts from mossberg and still issues. I did all of the polishing of the guts, bolt, stock cut & fit, tube junction, sights before I shot it almost. Then in Feb did the shell stop work and from what little pics & instructions found online like Brownells pics it seemed I cured most of the problems that can come with the JM Pro, but they were short lived. One thing I noticed when installed the brand new shell stop assy, is the rear half seems to stick out way more than my orig one (hence the reason I'm sure the bolt gets locked open when shells are still in the tube. This seems to the the area that caused this with the orig shell stop assy. This one has to much to just round off a little. If you hold the gun upside down you will see the lifter should clear the shell stop assy flat section if you push the lifter into the gun when loaded one in the chamber and only a few shells in the tube. Someone send me a pic of your shell stop mods and I can compare it to mine, but I'm pretty sure mine is good on both shell assy's.

I got the parts from mossberg yesterday ie...new shell stop assy, rear stock recoil spring, tube spring. The gun was cleaned immensely prior. First 19 rds had one failure, live shell did not release from tube (empty ejected and bolt closed with no shell). Next 30 rds had 10-15% of the exact same I've been fighting lately. Swapped out the rear recoil spring in the stock w/new (I had cut 9 coils off to see if 1100-1150 fps loads would feed). Shot 50 rds Still had the same exact failure to feed from tube and bolt closes on empty chamber (happens on biggining, middle, last shot of loaded tube). Swapped out the shell stop assembly. Now immediately inherited another malfunction that I had when gun was new (gun locks bolt open before tube is empty) as well as the shells not feeding out of the tube and closed bolt. I retweeked the front shell stop at the range enough to round the top & bottom corners of the forward shell stop (sits on the back of live shells in tube). I left the flat face flat and curled the leading edge since the shell stop doesn't come straight back and swings back at an angle. No help. I tried swapping my old front shell stop half to the new rear shell stop assy, no help. I swapped the new front shell stop half to my old shell stop rear half, no help. Ohh yeah, I found the problem doesn't get any better or worse with a light dry lube on the piston & in piston housing & on the tube & components riding on tube below the piston. The problem is the same if I majorly clean & wet lube with a lot of synthetic tranny fluid. Problem seems same on dirty or clean gun ie..between 1-70 rds. I did not replace the tube spring, because if I remember right a full length mossy tube spring had to much pressure and mine is about 13-14 inches past the tube end cap now. I thought to much tube spring might cause the bolt locking back when not empty or double feeds but can't remember. I shot 250 rds the last few days and I'm stumped and know I'll have problems at the Pikes Peak this weekend. The only part I hanven't removed is the safety assy & the little tube mentioned in prev post that goes into the stock recoil spring tube. What size is most people cutting their stock mossy shell tube spring down to or are you putting the whole thing in? I'm on squad 6 at the Pike Peak Shotgun Challenge tomorrow if you have the "miracle" fix. Tks for the help Billy

Tested my 930 jm pro again today after complete tear down and meticulous cleaning, scraping, checking of "everything" except the safety latch. I scraped and cleaned every tick of carbon off the piston and both rings on the piston as well as thorough scrubbing & scraping inside the piston housing area. Removed the shell stop assy and cleaned. I left the piston & piston chamber barely oiled w/one shot dry lube and of the first 20 shells, had one not come out of the tube, and another 50 rds had at least another 5 that would not come out of the tube. Each time a hand cycle of the bolt made it function correctly as in the last 2 times out. The bolt & rails were fairly wet. After total of 100-125 rds of mixed 1200 fps, 1 1/8 oz 7.5 shot and-1300 fps, 2 3/4, 1 oz, 7.5 shot, and 6 shot loads from win super target, Remington, herters, estate all had issues sometimes with 9 in the tube, half full, or 1 or 2 in the tube. Sometimes 9 rounds straight would function fine and then another 9 rds of the same ammo failed to come past the shell stop. The next 60 rds I did an inspection w/partial disassembly from receiver forward and wiped down primary carbon deposits and "medium heavy" oiled the piston & piston housing, and ext of tube assy & spring etc (very, very light dry lube inside mag tube), and more oil to the bolt/receiver rails and bolt housing and the gun still had issues scattered appx 5-10 times of 60-70 rds fired again. Each time after failure to come out of tube, a rack of bolt and the next shell feeds from the tube. Whatever my issue is, it's not the ammo and it doesn't get any worse if piston & components forward of the receiver are light or heavily oiled. I also went back to the OEM Mossberg mag tube spring today instead of the short Nordic spring, no help. Could not find any obvious burrs anywhere that might be causing the issue I'm kinda stumped now after initially fixing the "double feeds" & "bolt locking open w/rds in the tube", "shells unable to feed from the mag tube" "ext tube misalignment" and having only 1 feed jam for appx 200 rds and now the primary and only issue that's flared back up is the shells won't feed out of the tube 10-20% of the time. It also didn't seem to matter if I held tight shoulder or at the hip, light grip with no shoulder behind the gun. The gun now has 6-700 rds thru it. From about round count 150-400, this gun was shooting no shit, tight shoulder, from the hip, one handed, sideways, loose gripped and just with herters target ammo & estate 1200 fps 1 1/8 oz loads. If a semi auto is dialed in correctly ie...fit (not shoulder stock fitment), dimensions, finish, springs poundage correct, the gun should function with factory common middle road loads reliably regardless of hold. When my pistols are set up correctly they should fire strong, weak, both hands, woman or man shooting it. I shot a guys 22 inch FN/Win X something at the range today and the same exact loads from my shotgun thumped much harder than his gas gun and he said the same. My earlier post that my Mossberg seemed very stout recoiling is likely true since my 26-28 double barrel 12 ga kicks equal or less with same loads and it's a way lighter gun. I'm going to try to polish the shell stop again, more on the side that faces back towards the bolt and try again tomorrow. If this doesn't work, I'm kinda stuck at the Pikes Peak Challenge this Sat. I have some parts on order for the Mossberg but won't be here until next week. If the new shoulder stock recoil spring, mag tube spring, and shell stop assy I ordered don't fix it, I'll give the factory one shot at it before I can it. Hope not since I put a lot of effort and time trying to make a crappy gun into a good shotgun. Sucks that I've only shot a shotgun for 2.5 months ever and I feel I know as much as half the tech dept at Mossberg on this gun. Sad thing is some run great out of the box and some suck like a coin flip. This guns been out for 2-3 years and still their iffy. Out of the box to date have had I think every possible malfunction listed online in forums except the light primer strikes & that's because I replaced the hammer spring before even fired it.

Actually this last time out, the piston & piston area was pretty dry ie...almost not lube on or around the piston/rings or the area where you insert the piston. I'm gonna hit the range after work and try it piston w/decent dose dry lube only & if issues clean and piston wet and see. I've had issues the last two times out with more than powerful enough ammo. My guess is something keeping the bolt from going back hard enough since a hand cycle works after each failed eject from mag tube. Should be related to gas system and those components.

Tks for the video. I do clean everything he talks about and even scrape off some of the carbon that the brass toothbrush doesn't get. Would be nice to have that shotgun/ portable toilet brush for it though. Hmmm, so I guess the consensus is not to use any oil in the piston housing or on the piston/rings except for bullet casing type dry lube huh. This sucks. I don't have much time to test it this week and won't get the new parts in before the Pikes Peak nest weekend. Gonna see what happens Wed after cleaning every thing in the gun as much as possible. Is there something common/brand to buy to remove gun carbon besides or better than Hoppes #9 and MPro 7 cleaner.

Well, I thought I had all the bugs worked out. The gun had 1 jam in about 200 rds with mostly Herters 2 3/4, 1 1/8 & 1 oz & estate competition loads and a few super target Win and Rem game/target 2 3/4, 1 1/8 oz, 7.5 shot and I haven't had any more or less problems with any brand loads from 1150 fps up to 1250 fps for about 200 rds. The last time out I tried some 1150 fps loads (50 rds) to see if the lighter loads would function and they did well (Remember in an earlier post it appears light loads have a hard time getting the bolt back enough to fully release the shell stop but spent shell ejects). I cut off about 9 coils on the recoil spring inside the stock. I also put in a Nordic tube spring and it's much stronger & thicker. Now the past 2 times out I started having a lot of (appx 10% -25% out of 100) of the shell ejects but the next round never releases from the tube "unless I manually had rack the bolt, which works every time after this failure. This problem the 2nd time out is now >25% of rounds shot. I had cleaned the gun pretty well including spraying out the entire receiver area & scrubbing the chrome removable piston & removed & cleaned the rings on the piston and there was enough oil in the gun so that during shooting the underside of trigger assy & rear receiver/stock joint leaks oil during shooting. -I changed the Nordic spring back to the stock one, no help. -Each time a shell doesn't release from the tube, a manual hand cycle of bolt work fine. -I even tried some stout loads ie..heavy loads (hurts my arms, shoulder & cheekbone), no help, maybe worse -I shot so many rounds of the hot stuff I had to hold it at waist level like on tv, trying loose & firmest grips even from shoulder, no help -I checked the tube & spring/follower and it moves freely without snagging -Happens during full tube, partial tube, and last couple of rounds -Noticed regardless of hold some shells kick out far (6+ feet) and others kick out kinda weak (2-3 feet), even when holding firm shoulder, at hip level or loosely. -Found no pieces, shell, metal or function blockers in, on, around any parts that I could see. -Double checked the GG&G shell holder on the receiver and the screws and nuts were not tight or squeezing the bottom of receiver and the shell holder moves freely as well as the screws thru the trigger assy back & forth. The screws push thru receiver/trigger assy and screw into the GG&G and I put nuts on the other side of shell holder that have nylon locking in nut and they stay put. I talked to Roger at Mossberg Tech Support 5/9/14 and he didn't seem to want to talk about any tech details but I told him I had to work out a lot of bugs but needed an extra shoulder stock recoil spring, shell holder tube spring, and shell stop assy including the shell stop pin & retainer clip and he was willing to send them to me for $45 shipped reg gnd mail. I'm at a loss as to what is causing the issue now. I disassembled the entire gun and cleaned every part & orifice including scrubbing/scraping any buildup on piston/rings. I don't think cutting off 8% of the shoulder stock recoil spring should be causing this being there are 95-100 coils and I cut off 9 coils. The barrel gas holes didn't seemed blocked up, nor the piston very dirty. Does anyone know if you are supposed to remove & scape/clean the items in the housing where the chrome piston slides into? Not the chrome piston & rings. It's the area attached to the underside of barrel just above the barrel gas port holes. Looks like a big wound metal item inside and has a metal O ring inside of that and has 2 slots on top as if designed for a slotted tool to remove it. I usually just use a wire toothbrush & solvent to brush it out thru top and bottom. Also should there be no oil applied to this section and chrome piston or light oil. I medium oiled it since new and just barely oiled it last time out after cleaning and no difference in fixing my function issue. Thoughts? It seems the bolt is not going back enough at times to fully operate the shell release during firing and works fine hand cycling after every round after the malfunction. Sometimes it's happening multiple shells in a row and then may fire 5 or 6 good then poof but I see no reason why. I will push something thru the barrel gas port holes to make sure they are not clogged and the gun will be fully cleaned next time out.

Since I can't edit my orig post, I thought I'd clarify a few items: Recoil/Cycling -I only cut the recoil spring after about 250 rds of 1200-1250 fps rounds were thru the gun and all of the other work was done to improve reliability. I've read a few posts that claim you may be able to drill out one or both gas holes in the barrel to get more gas back to cycle slide for light loads ie...1100-1150 fps. Stock LOP Shortened -You will have to hollow out the hard plastic underside of the low profile limbsaver 5/8 inch thick pad about the diameter of a quarter to half dollar size and almost to the rubber (try to go just shy ). This is because when you cut off some of the recoil spring housing threads, alum spacer, and nut, you will still have the top of the tube & nut and just maybe 1/8 inch of one side alum spacer (maybe none) sticking above the stock as viewed from the side. It won't be below the stock. You might be able to get it flush, but not the plan with my pick. I also have the factory supplied spacer between the stock & receiver that angles the stock down a little to line up the rib so take this into account if you have nothing in between (1/8 inch maybe). I'm going to try to shoot a few hundred of the lower velocity rounds next 2-3 weeks and see if they function (with the recoil spring cut minus 9 coils) and report back. I also will be shooting my first ever shotgun match at Pike Peak Shotgun Challenge. I don't expect much since I've only shot a shotgun ever since mid Feb, but I won't come in last for sure. I did notice I shot a Rossi double barrel squire 26 or 28 inch barrel this year 12 ga I picked up cheap from a friend and I replaced the rock hard plastic butt pad w/limbsaver grind to fit and shortened the wooden stock before I ever shot it and it kicks no much worse than the mossberg 930 pro. Reason I'm writing this, is I haven't shot enough 12 ga autos to know, but I'm not so impressed with the mossberg shot to shot recoil control & muzzle jump, even before I cut the recoil spring w/1200-1250 fps bird loads. Just surprised how much jump it has with non magnum bird load stuff. Maybe I'm getting soft, I'm no tiny guy either, stocky (means decently fat and some muscle) and 275 pds to boot. CZ Accu Shadow 100 yd group -when I mentioned the 100 yd group was 7-7.5 inches. It was more like 8.5 inches with ultramax 115 gr. I used my outstretched hand & fingers at the range and they just fit between thumb & pinky and later measure and this is more like 8.5 inch group. Still good.

I looked and when I'm logged in, there is not an "edit" button, only multiquote and quote? I don't know if my account is set up w/no ability to edit my own posts or why, maybe because I'm new? Any help would be appreciated, that way if I get new info I can just add to my orig topic/post. Tks

Does anyone know if I can change or correct something in this orig post if your the creator of it? tks