FFL Requirement when selling Private Citizen to Private Citizen?

[boo radley]

You know, looking at that link MPolans supplied to the ATF FAQ's....I don't see anything about the oft-quoted "copy of the FFL signed in blue or black ink."

I would seem to me, as long as you ship TO a VALID FFL, you're set. All you'd need from the buyer is the FFL #, and you could ensure it's valid, and get the proper shipping address from the ATF website's EZ-Check.

No?

[Cactustactical]

I mentioned this process was clear as mud a few days ago.

Some dealers will not accept ANY shipment or provide a copy of their license to ANY non FFL person. There is not any law about these and it is not in the ATF regs. Simply fear of signing into the bound book a stolen gun and showing up in an ATF trace later on or having their license used fraudulently. I guess once you guys undergo an ATF audit or have their friends get raided and not know the reason( ala Cav Arms), you might understand why a lot of dealers go above and beyond the law to protect themselves.

[mpolans]

You know, looking at that link MPolans supplied to the ATF FAQ's....I don't see anything about the oft-quoted "copy of the FFL signed in blue or black ink."

I would seem to me, as long as you ship TO a VALID FFL, you're set. All you'd need from the buyer is the FFL #, and you could ensure it's valid, and get the proper shipping address from the ATF website's EZ-Check.

No?

Correct. IIRC, the "blue ink" idea is either outdated, or is just to help verify that the copy of the FFL is an unaltered legit copy. Of course, anybody who's had or made a fake ID back in college knows how easy it is to forge a document. That's why I think the whole insisting on a paper copy is a little hokey...I'd rather get the info, verify via ATF's eZCheck, and print out the eZCheck page. I'm assuming it's a lot harder to hack the eZCheck database to modify an address.

Some dealers require extra hoops, all in the name of fear.

Also, as someone already pointed out, states and localities can have their own additions requirements.

Like I said, entertainment purposes only, go find a competent lawyer licensed in your state to give you the true poo.

Edited March 16, 2008 by mpolans

[warpspeed]

The copy of FFL is nice for a non-FFL to keep as a record but I'd never ship to it w/o verifying through EZ Check.

[gmantwo]

Everything has pretty much been said, but I'll put in my thoughts. The problem I've had when trying to ship guns, is not that the laws keep me from doing it, it's that NOBODY seems to be on the same page. USPS doesn't know their rules, UPS doesn't know their requirements and neither does FedEx. I was told by my post office that there was no way I coould ship a gun through them, long gun or handgun, I had to be an FFL. That's not what the USPS website says, it shows that long guns can be shipped in state by anyone, but try to convince the postmaster of that! UPS and FedEx both require that handguns be shipped overnight, but have never asked me for an FFL. I'm lucky enough to have a friendly dealer who does transfers for $10, so usually I use him, and he doesn't have to log a gun in unless he has it more than 24 hrs, so no paperwork required there. Years past, the USPS would let you send a gun in for repair, to a manufacturer or gunsmith, but mine won't do that now. It would be nice if the ATFE would put out a guide on this, but even then, it would not be read by everyone, and we'd be in the same state of confusion!