Split times

[Dave Gundry]

I need some help...

I'm happy with my draw and transition times as a newbie C (minor, L10) shooter, but my splits are horrible...

I'm fairly certain my horrible split times are due to my grip and lack of recoil control... But being that I have had no formal training, and cannot afford any (time or money) such at this time, what can I do??? I am shooting consistent ~.60 splits with the M&P, with an occasional string of .50's if I really push it. This is shooting @10 yards, going for all A's (winding up around 80% A hits or 80% of a paper plate). With my Witness, I can shoot ~.50's consistently, MAYBE .40's if I push it.

In either case, there is tons of room for improvement... I have played with altering grip pressure on both the strong and weak hand, and the guns seem to track very vertical... It just takes me a long time to get the sights back in line. Some of my faster (haha) splits are just relying on indexing at that distance, but I'd rather be able to see the sights clearly and be able to call the shots better...

If it's any help for advising, I am very tall and skinny, and have very weak (i.e. non-existent) eye dominance. My weak hand barely makes contact with the grip due to my long strong hand fingers.

Any ideas where to start or what to work on? I am shooting a very small local IPSC match tomorrow afternoon and plan on using my timer to track my splits under pressure...

Thanks,

Dave

Edited January 10, 2008 by Krautwagen

[HoMiE]

You don't need a "perfect" sight picture at 10 yds or less. You're not shooting for groups, you're just trying to hit the 6x11 A zone. Sometimes you have to let go. Bill Drills helped me improve in this area. Check this out, read the bottom where BE talks about control/abandon...

http://www.brianenos.com/pages/words.html

If the gun is tracking very vertical, then why is it taking you a long time to get the sights back in line?

Edited January 10, 2008 by HoMiE

[G-ManBart]

Without seeing you shoot, it's pretty hard to tell, but I can think of one thing to definitely check for that's pretty easy. I was watching a Saul Kirsch DVD and he stopped his line of shooters to illustrate this point. He said that most of the shooters were stopping the gun near the top of it's muzzle flip, then deliberately bringing it back down onto the target. It was sort of a pause at the top. What he showed was how the gun should go up and then right back down without a pause. It might just be that your hands and wrists are too tense and the gun stops at the top...which would make for slow split times. So, get someone to watch you shoot, or borrow a camcorder and see what's happening.

[JThompson]

Don't get hung up on speed at this point... read everything you can get your hands on. Brian's book has some really good stuff in it too. What you should be doing is taking as long as it takes to get As. You're a C shooter take the time to learn now instead of trying to go like a bat out of hell for B and learning a bunch of bad habits now you will have to fix before you get to A or M.

Don't do as I did do as I say.

When you have the grip arms and body right the sight should fall right back to the notch... You may have to drive it a little, but it should be close. If you are having to drag the gun back down or raise it back up then you have grip/tension/stance issues.

I was watching a guy shoot recently and he always took a long time between shots... the accuracy was there, but the speed was slow. I looked him up and down and saw that he was standing staight up and down and was on his heals when the shot went. It would rock him back slightly and he had to wait for his body to come back. If he did try and go fast he just kept getting more and more off balance. IF you shoot with a good shooter, ask him to take a look and see if he sees anything. Don't be afraid to ask for help. Most people love to share what they know with others... look at this forum. The problem with this is we can't see what you are doing. It makes it very hard to give advice on what to fix if there is no feedback visually.

If you have a camera, have someone take pictures of your grip... both sides and include your arms. Post it here to get some feeback... won't cost you a dime.

The people here will give you some good advice...

[Jake Di Vita]

Check out the search function. Everything you'd ever need to know is in the archives here. If you still have questions don't hesitate to ask them.

[tpcdvc]

This and rounds down range is all you need.

Tim

[Dave Gundry]

Thanks for all the help guys,

The match went great - I told myself to push it, and wound up with some very decent splits just relying on indexing and what I think they call driving the gun... Lots of Alpha-Charlie's though, even at 4-7 yards.

I didn't even try my timer, as it's not set up for indoor ranges, so I don't know for certain what my split times were But they sure felt good. Overall times were about twice that of the fastest guy there.

I'm off to do some Bill Drill's and see what I can do with a little more confidence... Thanks again.

[Dave Gundry]

Hmmm, guess I was just hung up in practice. Lately I've been shooting .30 splits, mostly alpha charlie's. Just needed to start driving and let go of getting a perfect sight picture...

Match results were posted - 44 shooters total, 14 production - I got 17th overall and 4th in production There's a bigger shoot on Saturday that I'm going to, so hopefully I'll do just as good. The high is supposed to be 3*F, so the chill may add a little more excitement to the shooting