Todd's Steel Challenge

[ToddKS]

Sights are installed but rain has been persistent. I am going to shoot my monthly steel challenge match with the Glock and hopefully get some work in on the plate rack as well.

[ZackJones]

So you didn't have any trouble getting the Dawson adjustable sights? I thought I saw somewhere (Doodie?) that the adjustable rear had been pulled by Dawson.

[ToddKS]

I did not have any issues getting the rear sight. I got the fiber optic rear. I wasn't sure if I was going to like it but once I had it installed I liked the sight picture. I wish the front sight didn't have to be so tall but I can live with that.

I spoke with them on the phone and they did not mention any issues either.

Edited July 10, 2015 by ToddKS

[Pasley]

So you didn't have any trouble getting the Dawson adjustable sights? I thought I saw somewhere (Doodie?) that the adjustable rear had been pulled by Dawson.

That would be terrible. They are probably a lower volume item but they do seem fairly popular.

[ToddKS]

Shot my monthly Steel Challenge match with the Glock from low ready. Went better than I expected. I shot very accurately with very few make up shots which was my goal. I had some issues early on related to the new sight that caused some of those misses. I bought the .285 front sight that Dawson recommended and it is almost too short. The gun shoots high at 25 yards with the load I was shooting Saturday. I had to hold slightly low to get solid hits. This is with the rear sight bottomed out. I wish I had bought the .300 but there is no time to make that change now. Might order it in the future.

The good news is that the loads I am planning to shoot next weekend shoot dead on at 25. I verified that Saturday evening.

After the Steel Challenge shoot I had a chance to do about 15 runs on a real plate rack. This is where the smaller front sight really helped. I was able to comfortably run under 4 seconds consistently without missing. Felt much better after that given my previous struggles.

Shot Saturday evening as well. Working on confirming zero on the sights and transitioning from the 15 to the 25 yard target. I believe I may have figured out what I need to see at 25 yards to consistently hit the A zone. The question will be can I do that on demand.

I can practice 5 to Glock with my range flooded but I may not be able to practice Glock'M again before the match. Will have to see how that goes.

[Pasley]

I have the .300 tall sight on a G17 and a G30 and it seems just right to me on both of them. Still only have 2-3 clicks left on the rear sight from being bottomed out.

[ToddKS]

The only reason I didn't buy the .300 was because when I called Dawson they said to get the .285. What you are saying confirms what I originally thought. I may call Dawson and see if they will trade it out after the shoot.

[Pasley]

I guess Dave likes a six o'clock hold. My brother bought a set of fixed sights from them that shot way high. They swapped it out under their "perfect impact" guarantee.

[ZackJones]

Sounds like you're making great progress. I started dropping hints about needing to buy a Glock . I'll put Dawson sights on it when I do.

[ToddKS]

I had my last practice last night. It was not the full display of awesomeness that I was hoping for but that is the way it goes. I am running the pace that I want but my accuracy was spotty at times. Slowing down did not resolve the problem. I was simply not being consistent with my grip and trigger pull.

I never did get an opportunity to practice Glock'M again due to the conditions on my range. I think this will be OK as 7 and 15 yard targets do not seem to be a problem with regard to holding the A zone. My inconsistencies have been on the 25 yard target. Interestingly enough I am typically clean on the 20 yard target however at one point I was running clean on the 25 yard target and the C's moved over to the 20 yard target. Go figure.

The match is tomorrow so it is now time to see what we really have. No matter how this goes I will likely continue to shoot GSSF in the future as I have enjoyed the journey.

[ZackJones]

Good luck! Looking forward to hearing how you did at the GSSF match.

[ToddKS]

Thanks Zack. All did not go according to plan but I learned a lot, had a great time, and did not do bad in one division.

Lessons learned:

1. Practice the alternate stages. Even though I had been told previously that they were going to set the standard stages apparently the Glock rep showed up and said that people like variety and made them change 5 to Glock. Yes, that would be the stage I have been practicing over and over again with the standard set up. That guy needs to be punched in the face (just kidding...sort of). The 5 to Glock that was set had the number 1 and 5 targets at 20 yards with a wide spread, the 2 and 4 targets at 10 yards, also fairly wide and the number 3 target at 5.

The real issue with all of this was that I had not practiced anything that involved a first shot on a long target. That is on me for not being prepared for that skill. I will definitely work on that in the future.

2. Have enough magazines to shoot all divisions back to back. I had to shoot 2 divisions and then get back in line to shoot the third. I would have been far better off had I been able to shoot the third gun immediately after the second. This is also on me because if I had been thinking the range owner (this is the same range where I shoot Steel Challenge every month) would have loaned me 4 more mags. Again, this is on me.

3. Practice with the gun before you show up (Heavy Metal). This one should be obvious but I did not execute here. The one practice session where I intended to shoot the gun I forgot the mags.

4. Physical conditioning: Be in gooder shape. I have maintained my weight loss through diet but for a variety of reasons I have not been making it to the gym regularly. I know there are various opinions on the topic of fitness vs. shooting performance but in the 100 degree heat this issue combined with #2 above torpedoed Competition division for me.

Here are the results:

Heavy Metal: First gun shot. As mentioned above I had shot maybe 6 mags through this gun. The gun had been running fine for my friend when we practiced but we had issues Saturday morning. Some may have been ammo related or related to my overly high grip (Gen 2 gun). I believe this gun needs a new recoil spring.

5 to Glock: 21.8 +25

Glock'M: 17.44 +10

Glock the Plates: 14.62 (I was pretty proud of this one. Only 2 pick up shots)

Total time: 88.86 with 35 seconds worth of penalties

Civilian: Second gun shot. This is the gun I had been practicing with. Shot my game plan and had some very close misses. If you added up the total distance from the A/B ring of all 7 misses the total distance out of the A/B ring would have been around 8 inches. It was a little heart breaking really. I had 2 D's, both were within 1/2" of the C ring and the 5 C's were all right on the line or just barely out. That said I did catch the perf with a couple as well.

5 to Glock: 21.72 +8 I had been shooting low in practice on the longer targets so I favored my POA a little high...and shot right where I was aiming. Last target accounted for all but one penalty and had an awesome little group about 3 inches high of center. This could have been worse.

Glock'M: 18.54 +3 Shot this well (particularly given the lack of practice on this stage). C's were all close. No D's.

5 to Glock: 15.45 I was on pace for about 13.5 here until I train wrecked the third run. I did have the presence of mind to stop, reset my sight picture and carefully finish dropping the last plate with the last round in the gun. This could have been +10 so while I lost the 2 seconds I am happy that I was able to adjust mid string.

Total: 66.71 with 11 seconds in penalties. Would have been 55.71 clean. This was roughly the pace I had been practicing so I executed my plan as intended.

Competition: The real story here was that I had to run this division after shooting the other 2. This meant getting back in lines that were now much longer. My physical conditioning was not up to the task. I have also been battling a sinus infection for the last few days and the combination resulted in a sub par performance. I was physically gassed after 4+ hours in the heat and did not perform how I needed to. I had several D's that were way out that I did not call. One on Glock'M and several on 5 to Glock. Due to the lines I also ended us shooting Glock'M first which was not my plan. This caused a mental error.

I strongly believe that had I shot this right after Civilian my performance would have been as good or better than my performance in Civilian. Live and learn.

Glock'M; 18 +5 I had intended to shoot 5 to Glock first and had that programmed in my mind. On the first run I forgot about the popper. Shot the first 4 paper and just stood there. Someone kindly yelled "popper!" Cost me about 1.5 and I had an uncalled, way out D on the far right target.

5 to Glock: 23.18 +14 4 D's, not good.

Glock the Plates: 22.05 This is where the wheels finally came off all together. I decided that since I was already out of the money I would "go for it". Bad plan. I was physically not able to rise to this challenge. The best I could muster was one clean run at 4.00 (my best run in Civilian was 2.96). Again managed to prevent leaving any plates standing so that is my positive takeaway from that.

I want to thank the guys who loaned me guns to compete in this. I am going to buy my own (unless I hit a random) and start getting ready for next year.

[Pasley]

The 5 to Glock that was set had the number 1 and 5 targets at 20 yards with a wide spread, the 2 and 4 targets at 10 yards, also fairly wide and the number 3 target at 5.

The real issue with all of this was that I had not practiced anything that involved a first shot on a long target. That is on me for not being prepared for that skill. I will definitely work on that in the future.

That is exactly how they had it set up when I learned for the first time that they could be set up differently. I shot it 3, 2,1, 5, 4 which seemed to work fairly well.

Double check the rules on shooting more than two entries back to back. Unless they have an "express bay" set up you might not be able to.

I have found the best way to get in and out of a match is to be there 30-45 minutes before the stated registration time on Sunday morning.

[Nimitz]

I had my last practice last night. It was not the full display of awesomeness that I was hoping for but that is the way it goes. I am running the pace that I want but my accuracy was spotty at times. Slowing down did not resolve the problem. I was simply not being consistent with my grip and trigger pull.

I never did get an opportunity to practice Glock'M again due to the conditions on my range. I think this will be OK as 7 and 15 yard targets do not seem to be a problem with regard to holding the A zone. My inconsistencies have been on the 25 yard target. Interestingly enough I am typically clean on the 20 yard target however at one point I was running clean on the 25 yard target and the C's moved over to the 20 yard target. Go figure.

The match is tomorrow so it is now time to see what we really have. No matter how this goes I will likely continue to shoot GSSF in the future as I have enjoyed the journey.

you have discovered why 'slowing down is never the right answer ..."

it usually just results in the same crappy hits, just with a slower time ...

it's one of the first things Ben taught me. you'll never learn to shoot fast by shooting slow ....

good luck at the match ....

Edited July 19, 2015 by Nimitz

[ToddKS]

The 5 to Glock that was set had the number 1 and 5 targets at 20 yards with a wide spread, the 2 and 4 targets at 10 yards, also fairly wide and the number 3 target at 5.

The real issue with all of this was that I had not practiced anything that involved a first shot on a long target. That is on me for not being prepared for that skill. I will definitely work on that in the future.

That is exactly how they had it set up when I learned for the first time that they could be set up differently. I shot it 3, 2,1, 5, 4 which seemed to work fairly well.

Double check the rules on shooting more than two entries back to back. Unless they have an "express bay" set up you might not be able to.

I have found the best way to get in and out of a match is to be there 30-45 minutes before the stated registration time on Sunday morning.

Thanks for the advice. The information you and others have provided definitely helped.

They did have the express bays. I may try Sunday next time as well. I had thought about shooting Sunday this time but it just wouldn't work out.

I thought about shooting 5 to Glock 3,2,1,5,4 but I watched several guys tank doing that and decided left to right was the right choice for me. I am going to practice this set up some more in the future.

Edited July 19, 2015 by ToddKS

[ToddKS]

I had my last practice last night. It was not the full display of awesomeness that I was hoping for but that is the way it goes. I am running the pace that I want but my accuracy was spotty at times. Slowing down did not resolve the problem. I was simply not being consistent with my grip and trigger pull.

I never did get an opportunity to practice Glock'M again due to the conditions on my range. I think this will be OK as 7 and 15 yard targets do not seem to be a problem with regard to holding the A zone. My inconsistencies have been on the 25 yard target. Interestingly enough I am typically clean on the 20 yard target however at one point I was running clean on the 25 yard target and the C's moved over to the 20 yard target. Go figure.

The match is tomorrow so it is now time to see what we really have. No matter how this goes I will likely continue to shoot GSSF in the future as I have enjoyed the journey.

you have discovered why 'slowing down is never the right answer ..."

it usually just results in the same crappy hits, just with a slower time ...

it's one of the first things Ben taught me. you'll never learn to shoot fast by shooting slow ....

good luck at the match ....

You are 100% correct about slowing down. I proved it again yesterday on my last run through 5 to Glock. Slowing down resulted in uncalled deltas. I would have been better off just shooting my practiced pace.

[Pasley]

I thought about shooting 5 to Glock 3,2,1,5,4 but I watched several guys tank doing that and decided left to right was the right choice for me. I am going to practice this set up some more in the future.

When I walked up to that stage and saw it I probably should have walked away and pondered it for a bit longer. My first thought was "this is jacked up", and didn't really see a better way to go.

I have also seen the same V type set up where the open end of the v was towards the shooting box with two close targets, two middle, and one far. That I shot left to right and it was much more comfortable and faster.

[b1gcountry]

Those were really good times on the plate rack. My first gssf match was a few months ago, and I didn't come close to 15.8sec.

[ToddKS]

The preliminary results from last weekend's GSSF match are in. So close and yet so far...

Civilian: Second out of 92 shooters. Missed the win (and the gun) by 1.53 seconds. Needed 1 delta to have been a Charlie.

Heavy Metal: 8/31 overall, second place amateur. I was 5 seconds off the pace for the win. This is a division that I will practice for next year. I am already planning to trade one of my existing pistols for a G21.

Competition: 10/60 overall, 3rd place amateur. I was .27 seconds out of second.

I did not achieve my goal of winning a gun but I am pleased with the result given that until a few weeks earlier I had never really shot a Glock. I have already purchased the loaner gun from the guy who let me borrow it. I offered him his choice of the gun back, a new G17 (I was going to use the GSSF discount cert to buy him a new one), or cash equal to what I would have paid with tax, etc. for a new G17 with the discount cert. He chose the cash and I am happy to get to keep the gun I shot.

I am still considering asking Dawson to exchange the .285 front sight for a .300 but I haven't decided yet.

I got back to the gym this week and am feeling good with the exception of my right elbow. I really wore it out getting ready for the GSSF shoot and have been icing and resting it this week but I am ready to get back to some dry fire with my steel gun.

[ToddKS]

I now have another issue to consider. I spent about half an hour dry firing my XDm tonight and after shooting the Glock it feels wrong. I switched out the back strap for the large and that seemed to help some, but my grip with the G17 with the 2mm back strap still feels better. The issue is the area around the grip safety on the XDm. There is an inward swoop there that I have never cared for.

Truth be told the 5.25 9mm XDm that I am shooting currently has never been my favorite pistol. The pistol I preferred to shoot was my XDm 4.5 45ACP. That gun fit my hand much better. I got the 9mm because 45 ACP did not make any sense for the games I was shooting. I determined that the savings on the bullets alone would pay for the gun in a year and I have access to all the 9mm brass I could ever need.

The reason I had historically stayed away from Glocks was because when I tried shooting one the slide chewed up my hand (I have large, fairly thick hands). The Gen 4 back strap resolves this problem for me.

Given my intention to continue with GSSF the question I ask myself is do I continue to shoot the XDm or trade it off and go all Glock so that I am not switching back and forth between platforms when I go to shoot GSSF? Going to have to think about this some more.

[Pasley]

That guy ahead of you could get a bump to master class.

[Pasley]

I am already planning to trade one of my existing pistols for a G21.

You should look at a G30 also. You could shoot heavy metal and major subcompact with it. Several of the top guys around here do that and I don't really think you give up much over the G21. That said, I'm using my prize pistol certificate for a G21.

[ToddKS]

The G30 idea is interesting but I have shot other subcompact guns and I have typically been less successful with them, possibly due to my large hands.

I have decided on a path forward for my XDm vs. Glock dilemma. In dry fire the Glock still feels better in my hands but I do not have a holster for it. I ordered a Glock insert for my Racemaster to see if I still like the Glock better from the draw. Unless I really hate the Glock from the holster I will likely shoot Limited at the August Steel Challenge match as a test run. This way the investment is small (and I can probably sell the Glock insert if I hate it) and I have some time to see how it really works before I start selling guns.

[ToddKS]

Shot my usual monthly Steel Challenge match yesterday. In an effort to gather data regarding Glock v. XDm I shot my G17 in Limited. I also shot my rimfire rifle. Results were mixed but as Steve Anderson would say they were equal to my current level of participation. My approach to this match clearly shows that I need to work on a repeatable strategy for success.

Here are some of the issues:

1. Draw with the G17 is not consistent. This is not surprising given the limited amount of time I have working on this. It was just last week that I got the insert fitted. I was still trying to get my holster adjusted Friday night and will probably need to refine the holster position further.

2. Dot vs. Iron sights. Last month when I shot the G17 I did not shoot the rifle so this was not an issue. This month I was shooting the rifle and thus switching back and forth between the dot and iron sights. This seemed to cause an issue with maintaining my front sight focus. I found myself drifting back to a target focus at times when shooting the G17. I need to spend some time practicing going back and forth from the dot to the irons. Because I was previously dot/dot this is something I did not have to deal with previously.

3. Physical training: I need to adjust my physical training schedule on match weeks to allow more time for recovery. I had put in a really solid week at the gym (I had gained a couple lbs) and did not give myself enough time to recover. I only did light lifting on Thursday but I did some serious cardio. I took Friday off but that was not enough to recover. I felt physically slow. My mind wanted to go my normal pace but my body was not capable of delivering consistently. The result was slower than normal transitions which hurt my time.

4. Lack of live fire practice: I had fired zero rounds since GSSF. I have been working some dry fire, but the swamp like conditions at my personal range have prevented any live fire work (and we just had another storm roll through). This has never been a problem in years past. Always a little water in the spring, but we were always dry in the summer. I either have to fix this or find an alternate practice site. I believe I can solve the drainage issue but it has to dry out for me to get the equipment in there to do it (which is not happening right now).

5. Showdown did not go well. The transitions seems very wide. This may have been a case of the stage layout being off but I am not for sure. I need to set this up in practice (if I am able to get past issue 4.)

There were some positive notes:

1. Smoke and hope: Pistol time suffered because I could not come up with a 4th run but I had a sub 3 second run. With the rifle I was sub 8 seconds for the first time ever. I was able to do this by delivering 4 solid runs in a row which gave me the change to hero up on the last run. My last run was a 1.85 fueled by a fast first shot and then a faster than usual shot on the stop plate. It worked but that speed is not consistently repeatable. I very nearly missed the stop plate and am confident that I would not make that shot on the stop plate 4 times in a row with my current skill level.

2. Overall I was generally faster with the G17 than I had been with the XDm when the XDm had iron sights.

Will detail out times, etc later if I have the chance.

[ZackJones]

Glock FTW - except for Production Nationals, that is . I'm going to give my Glock 34 a run this coming weekend and see what I can do with it. I need to go back and look at my production times and see what I was running and come up with some realistic goals for the match.

8 second run on S&H is damned impressive! I'm still trying break 10 with either RFPO or RFRO.