Starting over with bolt guns.

[promod1385]

I moved to MN for my college years and took up shotgun deer hunting. I liquidated all of my bolt guns to fund my pistol habit. Long story short I have moved back to my native land of SD and its times to get some bolt guns going again!

I want something in 308 as I already have the dies and brass for this caliber, ammo is easy to get a hold of and it will do all of the hunting I need to do here in SD.

I am looking at Savage rifles as I like the accu trigger set up and it will allow me to build a rifle around the trigger as funds allow. I am torn between two guns:

Savage Model: 12 FVSS 26" stainless varmint barrel

Savage Model: 10 FCP-K 24" blued fluted threaded barrel.

I plan on painting it myself and doing a straight out of the mold stockade stock in the P-dog configuration right away and shooting the barrel until its worn out. At that time I will replace the barrel and add an aftermarket trigger if I feel the need. I can save a few bucks by going with the 12 but I will inevitably turn around and spend that money to have it threaded so I can add a brake and a suppressor in the spring (the suppressor is going to be my wedding gift from my fiance).

What are the pros and cons of these two guns and which would be a better base to start building a rifle off of?

[DWFAN]

Whichever one has the bolt release on the side of the action and not on the front of the trigger guard. (i think the accustock is the one with the bolt release on the trigger guard). I dont think most aftermarket stocks will accomadate the trigger guard bolt release.

Call Kevin Rayhill. He may have some other ideas.

If you know you are doing the stock right away, buy a bare action, Shilen barrel and pdog stock, and have fun.

If you arent set on a .308, look at the 12 LRP. I have it in 6.5 Creedmoor and .243 win. Both are hammers. (also comes in .260)

[redial]

If I may, are you necessarily wedded to the 308? Do you plan to shoot farther than 400 yards? Now, I shoot 308 from a Palma rifle out to 1,000 because the rules dictate the caliber but wouldn't be my first choice, given my druthers.

The 260, 243 and others will beat the pants off the 308 beyond medium distance.

Mark

[promod1385]

@ DW Fan- How does one go about finding a bare action to buy? I have seen them on gun broker but beyond that what is the best option? I am not trying to spend a fortune, I need to keep the base rifle under $1000 so I didnt think building a gun from scratch as you suggested was an option.

@ Redial - I am not overly attached to the 308. It would just make the most sense for me at this time. I have had a .243 and I agree its a great long range caliber. I just dont think it has the knockdown power that a 308 does for Elk hunting (yes we do have elk here in SD and yes I am putting in for tags to hunt them).

I dont know anything about the .260 I know its the bees knees for long range shooting but I would have to do some research to see if it will fill my needs from a hunting standpoint.

[DWFAN]

There are a couple different ways.

1. Buy an action from Jim at Northland Shooters. $350+ $350ish (barrel) + Stock. Close to 1K.

http://www.savageshooters.com/forumdisplay.php?43-Northland-Shooters-Supply

2. Buy any Savage or Stevens cheap rifle (model 10/11 or stevens 200) you can find. I see them in the $350-$450 range around here. Sell the barrel, and stock for about $120 total. So, $400-120 = $280+ barrel + stock.

Doing it this way ensures you have what you want, and probably does it cheaper with a sweet barrel, than buying a built rifle since you want to replace the stock right away anyhow.

[JCH]

Just get the savage in the new 6.5 Creedmoor. It is offered in a factory match load with the 140amax's. Every Creedmoor I owned shot the factory 140's excellent. (I've owned 4 rifles in Creedmoor.)

[Graham Smith]

Savage Model: 12 FVSS 26" stainless varmint barrel

Savage Model: 10 FCP-K 24" blued fluted threaded barrel.

Either of those is OK, but you will find that the stock is the biggest limiting factor.

If you are going for a hunting rifle, then the Model 12 is a very good choice.

If you want a target rifle then the 10 series is a better choice. There's no real advantage to the fluting and unless you plan on getting a can, the threading is not really needed. The 10 FCP with the HSP stock is a better choice and if you can swing it the one with the McMillian is a great rifle.

[promod1385]

I did some clicking around on the interwebs last night. You guys got me all twisted now!

I had my heart set on a 308 and now I am trying to decide between a 6.5Creedmor and a 260! 243 is out as I plan on shooting this rifle quite a bit and the 243 is the worst on barrel life.

I plan on handloading for the rifle so the availability of factory ammo is really a moot point for me. I was clicking around on the SnipersHide forum last night and it seems the Creedmor maybe just a bit cheaper to reload (.15-20 per/round depending on projectile).

Graham - why would you say the 10 is better suited as a target rifle and the 12 as a hunting rifle?

[DWFAN]

My 12 LRP in Creedmoor has been fantastic. The only draw back is I have some Hornady brass that is about toast in the primer pockets after 5 firings. I don't run a very hot load, just the load on the box. 41.5 gr H4350 and the 140 Amax or 142 SMK, they run 2850 (based on Chrono, my dope tells me it's probably a bit slower or someone lied about the BC).

The Hornady/Hodgdon data has been spot on. No playing with seating depth or anything, load and shoot. I'm going to try some Lapua 22-250 brass and see if I can get some more brass life.

The rifle is a pig, and I would not want to be schlepping it around the mountains for Elk.

There are lots of quality 6.5 hunting bullets, and as long as you arent trying to shoot them from a long ways away, the 6.5/.260 would be great.

[promod1385]

Shillen Heavy varmint in stainless/threaded for a break and later for suppressed use is my plan, I like the prairie dog stock from Stockade (my buddy the body man will be laying down some paint on it for me). I am only left to decide if I want the savage single shot action with the target accutrigger or a regular magazine fed configuration. I am leaning toward the mag set up as this will be primarily a hunting rifle and its a lot less money (more for ammo and reloading gear/components)

I was looking at the Redding stuff today and while the bushing style neck sizing dies sound sweet the $34 extra per bushing really drives the price up! I am thinking a set of the Hornady competition dies will be more than enough for me with the addition of a 6.5mm neck sizer.

What dies are you using to reform 22-250 brass for 6.5Creedmoor?

[DWFAN]

Ill probably expand to .243, then to .264 then fireform with cream of wheat.

I use the regular Hornady dies, and have a Hornady 6.5 neck die that Ill use some. I was Full length sizing after every firing, didnt have to trim until after thr 4 load.

Northland may have some LRP actions for sale. Its a repeater target action. The Target trigger is pretty light, not sure if I could adjust it enough to be comfortable wearing gloves and shooting it.

[hounddawg]

I bought a beater Stevens .243 out of a pawn shop last winter then put a Rifle Basix trigger on it, got a Criterion barrel in .204 Ruger from Northland and a Medalist Stock. Made a fine little varmint/practice rifle for less than 800 minus the optics. I was so pleased with the way it shoots I bought another Criterion in .260 to replace the .308 on my 12 F/TR. Both guns shoot better than I can.Sub 1/2 MOA groups when shooting at 100 and 200 are not uncommon with both guns but I still need to work on my technique and wind skills for the LR stuff

Edited October 26, 2012 by hounddawg

[DWFAN]

I bought a beater Stevens .243 out of a pawn shop last winter then put a Rifle Basix trigger on it, got a Criterion barrel in .204 Ruger from Northland and a Medalist Stock. Made a fine little varmint/practice rifle for less than 800 minus the optics. I was so pleased with the way it shoots I bought another Criterion in .260 to replace the .308 on my 12 F/TR. Both guns shoot better than I can.Sub 1/2 MOA groups when shooting at 100 and 200 are not uncommon with both guns but I still need to work on my technique and wind skills for the LR stuff

Still got that .308 barrel?

[hounddawg]

Still got that .308 barrel?

yeah it is sitting in the safe but I am not really interested in selling it at least at the moment, if I change my mind I will let you know though. Soon as I build the gun account back up from my pistol project I will probably get Jim up at Northland to sell me a large shank target action and put it on that. I gave the .243 barrel to a friend who put it on a project gun for his sons first deer rifle. Gotta love Savages they are the Jeep/HD of the gun world for garage gun smiths.

[DWFAN]

Just thought I'd ask. I've got 2 LRP's, looking for a F/TR legal barrel to throw on one for next year and I can't justify a bunch of money for a Shilen.

I don't shoot Fclass very much, when I do it's only 600 yds. I may just go .223 to save some money on boolits.

[hounddawg]

Just thought I'd ask. I've got 2 LRP's, looking for a F/TR legal barrel to throw on one for next year and I can't justify a bunch of money for a Shilen.

I don't shoot Fclass very much, when I do it's only 600 yds. I may just go .223 to save some money on boolits.

Jim at Northland sells stock Savage barrels last time I was there but I am sold on the Criterion's . Just my opinion of course, never owned a Shilen. Monday I shot some sub 1 inch 5 shot groups at 200 that .204 and it does ragged holes at 100. I am sure the 260 will be as good at 600 and 800 after I get my cheek weld consistent and my wind doping improves. I tend to get a lot of horizontal stringing but vertically the groups are sub MOA. Sorry for getting off topic here

[hounddawg]

Just thought I'd ask. I've got 2 LRP's, looking for a F/TR legal barrel to throw on one for next year and I can't justify a bunch of money for a Shilen.

I don't shoot Fclass very much, when I do it's only 600 yds. I may just go .223 to save some money on boolits.

Jim at Northland sells stock Savage barrels last time I was there but I am sold on the Criterion's . Just my opinion of course, never owned a Shilen. Monday I shot some sub 1 inch 5 shot groups at 200 that .204 and it does ragged holes at 100. I am sure the 260 will be as good at 600 and 800 after I get my cheek weld consistent and my wind doping improves. I tend to get a lot of horizontal stringing but vertically the groups are sub MOA. Sorry for getting off topic here

[BlueOvalBandit]

I own the 10-fcp-k the one thing I hate about it is the fact that the bolt release is in the trigger guard compared to other savages which it is on the side of the receiver. Because of that I can't change my bottom metal out for aftermarkets and limits some of my options in stocks. Stocks for Savage 10 with 4.4" bolt spacing will work they just need some filing and there is hole in the side along the receiver for the flag/bolt release. Also there is another bolt lift mod that you can't do because of the through bolt cocking indicator. Otherwise it's a tack driver.

Off topic: Also the muzzle brake and BAS (bolt assembly screw) are King Kong gorilla tight. It took a 2ft breaker bar with a 3 foot cheat bar and me standing on the gun to break the BAS free, and it made a scary loud snap when it did. Thankfully all was good with the rifle. So I'd go with the 12 and get the barrel threaded.

They do make the 10fp-sr, pretty much the 10 fcp-k without the detachable magazine, and fluted barrel, but the barrel pre-threaded and it uses the standard savage side bolt release.

Edited October 31, 2012 by BlueOvalBandit