IPSC Production Division

[Even]

Vince,

What, if any, modifications are allowed to do to magazines?

I have here a hypothetical scenario: The case being that have some reliability issues with my magazines, and to deal with this issue I have to alter some OEM internal parts. After this modification they work flawlessly, but the now they will hold one more round… How would this be dealt with?

even

[rtr]

IIRC it does not matter if your magazines can hold more than 10 rounds, just that you only put 10 rounds in them.

[Even]

It's IPSC Production Division, not USPSA.

even

[lynn jones]

rtr,

even is correct, ipsc can use standard capacity mag.

even,

as long as you don't change the basepad you'll be ok.

lynn

[Vince Pinto]

Hi Even,

Today must be "Magazine Day" because I received an almost identical question by email earlier today, and here is the exact answer I gave them:

The Production Division rules deal with OFM products and After Market Products ("AMP") quite separately.

Under Point 19 (OFM), you cannot modify original components (nor use +2 basepads) however, say, squeezing 18 rounds in a magazine intended to hold 17 rounds is not a modification, unless the competitor cuts springs or trims a follower or modifies a basepad.

Under Point 20 (AMP), you're entitled to use aftermarket magazines which have the same external dimensions as the OFM standard, however if such magazines offer you extra capacity, good luck to you.

Bottom line: If a guy with a Glock 17 wants to use "XYZ Brand" magazines, which are externally identical in size (but not necessarily made of the same material) as the Glock standard, there's no problem if the internal capacity is higher. The rules deal with external dimensions.

I hope this answers your question.

[Even]

Thanks Vince,

This question is regarding Sphinx magazines. They hold 16 rnds, but Tanfoglio mags will hold 17 rnds. The thing is of course that I also would like to have 17 rnds. It's only one rnd, but it makes a difference.

To be on the safe side, here is couple more:

I assume that I can not mix parts from my OEM magazine and my aftermarket magazine, right?

Is it OK to use CZ and Tanfoglio mags in the Sphinx? It's not really aftermarket, but they look the same.

even

[Vince Pinto]

I assume that I can not mix parts from my OEM magazine and my aftermarket magazine, right?

It would be better to say "I cannot change anything on my OFM magazines".

Is it OK to use CZ and Tanfoglio mags in the Sphinx? It's not really aftermarket, but they look the same.

Yes. If the external dimensions of the CZ or Tanfoglio magazines are identical to the standard magazines issued by Sphinx, but the former provide you with more internal capacity, no problem.

(Thinking aloud: Boy, there sure are a tonne of questions coming out of Europe this week. I guess there must be a big match somewhere.)

[Even]

Yeah, it's a good thing that I'm shooting in standard with my ported slide

Vince, will you be at the Europeans?

even

[Vince Pinto]

Ha! Ported slides in Standard. I think I've had 9 emails just on that subject

Sadly I can't make it to the European Championships due to a long-standing clash with another important event related to my business, but I will definitely be at the AustralAsian Championships in Bali in November.

Good luck in the Czech Republic, and try to behave yourself, at least during the match

[mai]

Hi, Vince

This topic has somewhat related to what I asked you before. I asked you that may I use Glock 17 mag in Glock 19 gun. I know that the meaning by the rule-writer is NO MODIFICATION, but it seems like the rule lead shooter to use some specific model and brand.

In case, someone own Glock 19, he has only 15 rounds, so if he want to have more chance, he should buy another gun let's say Glock 17 or may better be PARA LDA(18-19 rounds). I believe this is not what you want. Your reply was the man who hold the gun is matter, not the gun. But by the wording in rule book actually mean "not just the man, the gun also have big matters.

My idea is the production division should encourage people to shoot whatever guns they have and use in real life. May be easier to fix number of rounds that shooter be able to load in one mag, for example, 10 or 12 rounds, or they may put as much rounds as they want but have to reload after 10 rounds shooted.

Regard

Mai

[Vince Pinto]

My idea is the production division should encourage people to shoot whatever guns they have and use in real life.

What if I use a single-action-only STI or Kimber in real life?

....  but it seems like the rule lead shooter to use some specific model and brand. In case, someone own Glock 19, he has only 15 rounds, so if he want to have more chance, he should buy another gun let's say Glock 17 or may better be PARA LDA(18-19 rounds).

The facts do not support your assertations. Do you know why the approved gun list is so big now? Over 50% of the guns on the list are there because competitors requested that we add them. The original list was only half it's current size.

And I practice what I preach. Although I personally own 6 Glocks, in Production Division I always shoot a Glock 21 which only holds 13 rounds of 45ACP. I could just as easily use my G17 with 17 rounds of 9mm, but I don't think a higher magazine capacity makes me a better shooter.

[mai]

Vince, the STI & KIMBER guys already have the standard division for them, so no concern for that groups. And yes, I agree that a higher magazine capacity makes nobody a better shooter but don’t you agree that the high-cap mag can give him or her more advantage in competition.

I shoot PARA for standard and STI for open and no intention to shoot production. I will attend the Bali-game too, and looking forward to see you there.

[Vince Pinto]

Mai,

I think we lost something in the translation, but let's not worry about it here. I look forward to seeing you in Bali, and having a Cuba Libre or three with you and Ray Chonlatit.

[mai]

OK