skeeter Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 that don't make sence as the whole thing is staged aand as much as you would like to think it's real world training it's still a game. some of the stages i've seen they went looking for the bad guys. in the real world i don't go looking for them unless i have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjobart Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 Very true, IDPA is mostly an "Offensive" pistol shooting sport. If IDPA was truly "real world" then the guy who dove out the window to avoid the fight entirely would win the stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Perez Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 Last Airgun thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayonaise Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 I don't see the big beef. Do the squad walk through. Answer questions. Call first shooter to the line and go. No individual walk throughs are allowed per the LGB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeeter Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 No individual walk throughs are allowed per the LGB. if this means you cann't look through a window to look at the targets but the guy picking up brass can then that not fair. and tell lifes not fair this should be a test of skill not who gets lucky and shoots last not first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scandog Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 I still would like for someone to show me where in the rule book the words "AIR GUNNING" are. I have looked through it more times than I care to count, and I have not found it. As I stated before, it does say sight picture and then it goes on to explain what a sight picture is. If it is going to be a rule for a game that is going to be played at more than one club, it has to be in the rule book. If not, we end up with this mess. If HQ doesn't want us to do this, it is simple. Put out a new rule book. I also noticed 2 years ago when I was at the nationals, the rules change. We had a shooter use 3 different guns because his didn't work. I saw mag pouches that were defined in the rule book as not legal. I could go on, but what is the point. If Bill W plans on making money from us he needs to address this. The other option is we band together and dump IDPA and start our own game. That is a good start. Then look at other shooting sports, USPSA has a much better layout that IDPA and they do a better job of defining things. It is just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayonaise Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 No individual walk throughs are allowed per the LGB. if this means you cann't look through a window to look at the targets but the guy picking up brass can then that not fair. and tell lifes not fair this should be a test of skill not who gets lucky and shoots last not first. No that's not what I meant. I don't care if you look at the COF from every angle under the sun during the stage walk through. Once the COF is discribed and questions answered the first shooter steps up and shoots. No sight pictures means no dry rehearsals. Pretty simple concept. I love when people argue that using their finger doesn't constitute a sight picture. Ya Ok! Scandog you've been beating your dead horse for so long that poor animal is no longer fit for the glue factory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scandog Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 But is like the enregizer horse. It just keeps going and going. I wouldn't have to beat it if people would quit adding rules that are not in the rule book. I agree you don't give individual walk throughs. What about the guy or girl that raises a finger during the group walk through. Again, there is nothing in the rules about this. I was actualy helping at the state match last year and was yelled at when I pointed at the targets as I was demonstrating proper cover during the course description. after that I didn't help the SO's with the course description or walk throughs. If people would quit making up rules stating that it is what HQ wants us to do, I could let my horse run free. Like I stated before. Put it in a rule book and release it to the public. Not this I was told by this guy who knows a guy crap. You all can do whatever you want. For those who would like to play by the rules AS THEY ARE WRITTEN, come to Michigan. We might not be perfect, but we are trying to keep all of our clubs the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Perez Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Once again . read rules 2 and 3. While you're at it ,go over the Purpose section too. btw - Michigun IS NOT IN CONFLICT with the rules (re:airgunning) ,as I read them and explained to me by IDPA HQ. if your MD or AC says airgunning is ok - then airgun away . I don't think it is a good practice - but that's just me. The local clubs can set the tone for their customers in regards to how strict they want to be with the interpretation of the rules.Especially those that are in the grey area. Do we need a rule book set-in-stone? No. Sometimes I wonder if the calls for rule book clarification are lost to the whole purpose of the sport - from the PRINCIPLES sectionTo offer a practical shooting sport that allows the competitors to concentrate on the development of their shooting skills and to fellowship with other like-minded shooters. My take MP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullautodave Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Well IMHO I think they should do it like USPSA/IPSC and allow "airgunning". Only not with a gun-part in your hand, a tape-gun or staple-gun, or the butt of a flashlight, but not a magazine ( gun, Front Sight would be ok ). That way both venues would be the same and no one would have to think. ( Sarcasim intended ) Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larrys1911 Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 I personally don't give a tinkers d@mn what they do with "Air gunning" OR "Sight Pictures". I DO however care that people insist that they are one in the same. They are NOT! IF I point my finger at your head, its completely different and should provoke a completely different reaction than if I take a "Sight Picture" on your head. I would think they would incur completely different responses from a person anyway. They would from me. Words and terminology still mean things and a "Sight Picture" is NOT the same as "Air Gunning". Not even in the same ball park. I am not the greatest at getting it all right but these are TOTALLY different things so lets get it right even if IDPA HQ didn't, OK. Like I said I don't care what they do. Larry P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjbever Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Ive seen Scandog's horse....what a fleabag.....even the glue factory rejected it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayonaise Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Ive seen Scandog's horse....what a fleabag.....even the glue factory rejected it! Jeez! Look who the scandog dragged in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjobart Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 It is very logical, natural and rational to argue that a finger pointing/airgunning is NOT a "sight picture" when the rule book itself clearly defines "Sight Picture" as requiring the holding of an actual gun in the hands. Mayo is reading into the rules something that does NOT exist in reality. This will all be a moot case when the new rule book appears and airgunning/finger gunning are forbidden, I hope to God it is soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjbever Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Mayo: See what happens when you leave the door unlocked!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 Somewhere in the last three pages, this stopped being a productive thread. If anyone feels they have something NEW to add to the discussion, feel free to PM me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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