Heavy Barrel
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Posts posted by Heavy Barrel
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If thats whats up, my sixth sense tells me to hold off on purchasing a 20 gauge conversion kit.
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When I was out at the dealer a few weeks back.
I passed the same question to a couple of associates working there.
One of them suggested Universal Clays. While the other suggested Long Shot.
When I looked up the data on these two powders......
Universal, appeared to be mediocre. I would have to use approx. 6.5-7grs. more per load than Clays.
Long Shot, to me appeared to be something on steroids. I would have to use at least twice the volume per load.
And what would be the advantages of producing loads that are clocked at over 1400-1500fps?
I presume the shooter would be at the mercy of the recoil produced.
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I know that this is entirely opinionated.
But what would be some good powder choices to start out with when building loads for clays?
I don't what something thats going to leave a mess for me to deal with the way some of the promo loads I have used in the past.
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That is a text book example of cabin fever.
I started out with a LNL AP about ten years ago.
And after fighting with everything from indexing paws going out of adjustment, LNL bushing coming loose from the press, primer feed assembly falling apart, to the retainer ring grooves in the linkage pins breaking.
Every time I would call for replacement parts I would be faced with hassles from Hornady, wanting to charge me for the parts.
Prior to Hornady introducing the expander at the powder station, you had to have a separate expander die, which was one advantage Dillon had. You couldn't monitor your loads for squibs.
After learning that Dillon expands at the powder station (before Hornady introduced that feature), that Dillon "doesn't" interrogate you over replacement parts, and the last episode over replacement parts I had with Hornady.
I ordered a 650 from BE and the LNL AP went in the corner were it still sits today......covered in dust.
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After reading through the manual that came with my 900. This one question is still unanswered.
Is the 900 limited to just 2 3/4" loads?
Or are they flexible enough to be adjusted that 1/4" +/- to handle 3" loads?
Particularly with a 20 gauge.
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Let me know how it works out for you.
I was able to find some 18ga galvanized wire, that was just a tad smaller than the thickness of the e-clip.
I double wrapped the powder die, and after ten rounds it seems to be working okay.
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He's not talking about the standard little "hairpin" clip that holds the powder bellcrank, as on the 1050 - this is the E-clip, part # 17147 and I've never, ever seen one like it in any hardware store [and I've been in a few!].
I went and took a look at mine and the only thing this clip does is hold the expander powder funnel in place inside the powder die. There seems to be enough clearance where you could take a piece of wire close to the diameter of the clip's thickness and wrap that completely around the outside of the powder die so that the wire goes inside the slots where the E-clip goes and holds it in place. There doesn't seem to be much stress as the expander powder funnel's [ part # 16746] function is simply to fit inside the empty hull while powder is dumped. As long as the wire you use is thicker than a bread bag tie wrap and fits inside the slots to prevent it riding up on the downstroke you should be good to go. Let me know how it works out for you. I've had my SL900 since the first production run but just started using it again after many years of cheap factory shells - it rocks! Good luck.
I will give that a try, since this is the only thing stopping me from setting up the press.
Far as missing pieces. Now thats another story, that I will take up with Dillon tomorrow.
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That E-clip is going to be a standard part, that you can match up with one available at most hardware stores.
Thats so very true, I am just interested in a quick fix so that I can finish setting up the press. I figured this weekend would be the perfect time to tackle such a challenge.
Now, on Easter Sunday....I know, I know, no needs to rub it in.
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I picked up my SL900 yesterday from a local dealer.
And as I was seting up the press I noticed that the powder die e-clip was missing (the e-clip that retains the power funnel). I looked inside the sack that dillon wraps around all new presses and found the mising e-clip. Only it was in two pieces.
I know that they won't be able to send me a replacement until this comming Monday, though I am interested in some suggestions for temoprary fixes. So that I can finish seting up the press.
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You will be amazed at how much shorter your old springs are than the new ones [if you've put any number of rounds through them at all].
Will,
I would like to get out to the range (Mother nature permiting) and see if the changes I have already applied will put a stop to the misfires.
If not then the next step will be to change the recoil spring. Considering the fact I have put right around 1000-1200 rounds through it. I will keep your offer in mind, I am eager to try, just that I know what happens when the recoil spring is unleashed. (same as the magazine spring)
Comparing to what you stated above. The original hammer spring was approx 1/8" shorter than its replacement. Just don't know if that is the culprut or not. Though it does sound as if its hitting the snap cap harder.
Be nice it Wolff offered their version(s) as they do for the revo rebound springs.
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Sounds like you have time to try some things out.
If not, then you might be forced to send it in if you haven't replaced the FP or spring?
FP, FP Spring, Extractor, L&R Brace, Hammer, & Hammer Spring. Were all taken care of.
If this don't work Coles thinks it could possibily be the recoil spring. (I don't want to mess with that)
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While it's still snowing, I'd call Cole Gunsmithing and talk to them first.
It may be something very simple...like hammer springs.
My comment about different shells and primers worked for me, "way back when". It was easy to try a different primer and I shot quite a bit. Buying different shells at anywhere from $6.00-$8.00 and shooting enough to determine probably is not cost-efficient for you. And may only delay or mask weak springs, FP, etc in your Beretta. I'm not sure of the frequency of your problem or how much you shoot with it.
Back when I was discussing this matter with EricW. I had ordered a replacement hammer spring, along with some other parts.
The hammer spring I recieved was roughly 3/16" to 1/4" longer than the original spring. Yet it still had the same number of coils.
Could this create such a problem?
I pass this information on to Wolff to see if they have something similar on hand.
As I explained to Coles, with out knowing what the cause is. It bits me in the rear at times having to pay $20-30 or more to ship something out only to find out it was something like a $2.00 spring that was causing the problem.
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All Beretta semi-auto shotgun gas systems (including the A390 Standard) requires the use of standard velocity (1.8 oz Target loads or higher) to allow them to work reliably.
Ha, what nonsense! If that were true, they would be out of business with their auto.
I've shot and "seen" many thousands of 7/8oz fired through the Beretta autos reliably.
Plus, only in this country are many shotgun sports using 1 1/8, most everywhere else, it's 1oz or 7/8oz and they are an "international" company.
As a "caustic" side note: This is typical of Beretta, they have "earned" their reputation.
What "ammo" are you using, or what primers if you reload?
I ask that, since I've had a shotgun that wouldn't reliably "set-off" a particular primer, and no problem with another brand. Maybe you try that before you go "mechanical"...so to speak.
The ammo I used was Federal value pack. Typically sold in quanities of 100. I don't know which other retailers sold it but I made my purchases at Wal-mart due to the convience.
I ask that, since I've had a shotgun that wouldn't reliably "set-off" a particular primer, and no problem with another brand. Maybe you try that before you go "mechanical"...so to speak.I just got to get it to quit snowing first
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The Professional's Response courtesy of Beretta.....
Light (7/8 oz. or 1 oz.) Trap loads are typically used to reduce recoil in over/under shotguns and do not cycle semi-auto actions of Beretta A390 Standard shotguns reliably because of the insufficient amount of powder charge used in them. Light primer strikes are typically the result of using Light Trap loads as well. All Beretta semi-auto shotgun gas systems (including the A390 Standard) requires the use of standard velocity (1.8 oz Target loads or higher) to allow them to work reliably.
Please. Could some one here offer a better explination on how light target loads could generate light primer strikes in which in my case "misfires"
My understanding has always been that no matter what the load is, it will fire. It just won't have the energy to cycle the next round in to the chamber. (correct me if I am wrong)
BTW, I have shot nothing lighter than 1-1/8oz #8 at 3 dram equiv.
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It may be that your spring just didn't get heat treated well. Why not just order a replacement spring & firing pin from Beretta and see if the problem goes away for $25 or so? If that doesn't work, it's time to see the Dr.
Did that.
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As I mentioned previously, I have stripped this gun down before.
Though one thing I noticed is that the right brace seemed to me as if it could use a shim or two between it the hammer and the trigger plate. Not that a "loose" brace would create misfires. But it has a looser fit than the left.
Really all the brace is doing is creating a linkage between the hammer spring and the hammer.
Another thing I noticed is that IMO the hammer spring is somewhat on the weak side in comparison to what I have seen Wolff produce in their aftermarket springs for S&W Revo's.
The springs in my Revo's and O/U's are stronger than what Beretta put in this gun.
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I have this Beretta 390 that I have owned for a good ten years.
It isn't something I would trust my life to but for any "leasure" shoot (blue rock) at a public range it works great.
The only catch to this is that it has a tendency to misfire. But the rounds that misfire I can take from the 390 and place in either my 687 or 682 and they will discharge with no problems.
Every round shot from my 390 appears as if the firing pin is bearly striking the primer while the 680's have good penetration to the primer.
I have stripped this gun down to see if there was any fowling or excessive wear. Only to find nothing.
I have looked for litrature on various chamber and firing pin specs to see if either of two were the culprit.
Though it seems that such information is Classified.
And I would hate to spend $350 on a new barrel only to find out that the new barrel didn't correct the issue.
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You do need live rounds to be "extracted" a bit so you can easily lift them out of the gun...if they remained flush with the chamber...it would be tough.
I assume you guns are not ejecting live shells?
No
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After lying in bed past few nights drawing this out on the ceiling.
What I think would be a nice option IMO is that when opening the action.
If a round has been discharged in either of the two chambers, it extracts the hull.
But if there is a that round hasn't been discharged when the action is opened the extractors don't extract the live round.
Still work on the concept of extraction/ejection only don't eject the discharged rounds, and don't extract the live rounds.
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Try: http://www.bobscustomgunshop.com
or
http://www.joeletchenguns.com/
Cole's is pretty much the U.S. authority on Beretta O/U work, so if it's practical, they will tell you one way or another with no BS. If you really need selective ejectors, you may need to get a Perazzi or Krieghoff or drop down to a lower-tech shotgun like a SxS.
There may be a problem with grinding off the ejectors, such as whatever hits them beating itself to pieces over time.
I haven't got a response back from Bob's yet though I got one from Cole's today. By the way Rich Cole briefly explained the procedure it sounds as if anyone could do it......Though I don't have the nerve quite yet.
He stated this is a very simple alteration to the forend iron levers. One simply grinds a radius on the top of the levers so that they do not retain the ejector timing hooks, therefore the ejectors lift the cartridges under spring tenison, and cam closed on the dolls head cams as usual. If the shooter chooses to have ejector function again, all that is required is the replacement of these parts, a parts cost of somewhere about $25-30.
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But I am about to bust for asking...WHY do you want an extractor gun instead of ejectors?
Your not alone.....
Everyone of the three local smiths I inquired asked me the same question.
Simple answer.
I like reloading, but I hate picking up hulls.
And when using public ranges, it can be a little crowded. Just before hunting seasons.
Which there has been past times I have hit people standing behind me with ejected hulls.
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Try: http://www.bobscustomgunshop.com
or
http://www.joeletchenguns.com/
Cole's is pretty much the U.S. authority on Beretta O/U work, so if it's practical, they will tell you one way or another with no BS. If you really need selective ejectors, you may need to get a Perazzi or Krieghoff or drop down to a lower-tech shotgun like a SxS.
There may be a problem with grinding off the ejectors, such as whatever hits them beating itself to pieces over time.
I will contact both Bobs Custom Gunshop and Cole Gun to get their input.
I asked Etchen back in the last week if December if they could alter the ejectors. And they were another one that stated that they couldn't do it, Them doing it would likely void my warranty, if any one it would be Beretta.
I am not too interested in having "selective ejectors" If I was I would look into either a Perazzi or Krieghoff. Or settle for a Beretta 471 Silver Hawk.
Hard to emphasize in "writing", but doooon't touch the ejectors by grinding or altering them in any form or fashion.How'd I do
They are the most expensive and important part in the "system" and must be "fitted".
I'd call Cole and ask them.
Also, go to www.shotgunworld.com and search. You'll read some "stuff" on that.
The Beretta system is similar to many O/U's, basically. The sear or lever in the forend is the part to "modify" if needed...but I'd ask Cole on how effective it really is. They do have to extract enough so you can pick them out.
Cutting the ejector "springs" is probably the easiest way of reducing the "ejection" force, but it's not exactly like "extraction"...you might be disappointed.
I do wish, like you, there were more "options" on ejection or extraction like Browning now has on one of their models.
When I initially contacted Beretta I also asked them if for any reason. I were to request that the extractors be changed back to their normal condition. What would that cost me?
Beretta does, however, convert extractors to ejectors by installing new ejector plungers (@$2.00 ea.), springs (@$2.00 ea.) and ejectors (@$49.00 ea.). Labor is based on $60.00 per hour.
And the quote that they threw at me really didn't seem any worse than what Smith & Wesson charges. Just that Beretta is ways ahead of Smith & Wesson for turn around time.
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What do you want to alter on your ejectors? Do you want the ejectors to not "eject" the empty hulls but only lift the empty hulls out of the chambers?
Exactly, I don't want the ejectors to eject, only extract. Your one step ahead of me...
Years ago, some where I read that all they do is grind off the hooks that are on the ejectors. Though I can't find that information any more.
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Owning a pair of Beretta O/U's for the past few years one thing that I have always been curious about and that is Ejector alterations.
So I checked with the "only" three gunsmith's here locally. The response I got from them were that since the O/U's bared the name Beretta they won't alter the ejectors. Since in their words "It would void the warranty".
So I asked all three if they had any references to offer. In which the only references they offered was the call Beretta.
After sending a inquire to Beretta's Customer service. Asking if they could alter the ejectors. The response I got was "Beretta does not alter over/under shotgun ejectors from their factory configuration (for liability reasons)."
Would any of you gentlemen have any recommendations/suggestions?
I have looked into a few gunsmiths that are a longways from home, though by the information that they provided none of them clearly advertised that they can alter the ejectors.
Powder Selection
in Clays
Posted · Edited by Heavy Barrel
While beating the drum of this subject....
I finally broke down and purchased four lbs of Clays.
Though after doing so a question come to thought. How well does clays perform with 20ga loads.