bret

Yes it was a USPSA 3 gun match, I read the rules for 3 MultiGun since that was the match. The rules are pretty much the same on the issues I mentioned. I was at another match, local club, guy ran in front of the firing line, took 12 shots, ran in front of his loaded AR15, the R.O. was yelling at him to come back to the proper firing line instead of yelling STOP. He ended up getting 1 procedural, instead of 12 and a D.Q. I asked why, since I never shot there before, the guus on the squad said he was the R.O.'s buddy. If I was the R.O. I would have DQ'D the guy, I would not care if he donated a kidney to me or was my best friend, he should be DQ'D for that. I shoot mostly USPSA, but that is because there are 2 to 3 matches a week and there are only 3 maybe 4 3 gun matches per month here.

I wonder if you'll still say after you go through the LI and LII classes. Let us know... What I was talking about are 3 what I consider clear rules. 1. No handling ammo in the safe area. To me this does not allow you to see why ammo that wouldn't function in your AR15 wouldn't feed, by putting several rounds that failed to feed on your previous stage to see what the problem is, Inside the safe area. 2. Abandoning a loaded with a round in the chamber 2011 with the safety off. Guy said he put it on safety when he ditched the gun, when it was checked, it was not on safe. 3. Guy at make ready put a loaded 2011 in his holster without the safety on. All 3 of these are automatic D.Q. from what I read in the rules. None were DQd, only guy in scenario 2 was penalized, 30 seconds. The CRO running the stage also allowed people that abandoned their shotgun and traveled more,way more than 3 feet to come back. Secure the shotgun in the Fitch barrel or even re engage the targets, after yelling barrel. To me that violates the rule of more than 3 feet is an abandoned gun and coaching. But I have not been through the classes yet, but I do read the rules and keep a book in my bag and they are in my phone as a .pdf.

GrumpyOne, That is a very good way to look at it. I had a loaded gun come our of my holster. I screwed up, didn't lick it in, when I was running it fell out. I immediately stopped then the R.O. with the timer realized why, because he didn't see it. I felt bad because I knew I screwed up, the R.O. and the main R.O. we're very nice about it and I told them I was sorry and no need for them to explain it to me, I know you go to Dairy Queen when you drop a gun after the make ready.

Can a 9mm barrel be fitted to a .40 S&W Edge? I have heard of people easily going from a .40 S&W to 9mm in a Glock 35 by swapping the barrel, recoil spring and magazines. I know the Breach face is larger on a .40 S&W than a 9mm, but I have heard if you want to go from 9mm to .40 S&W you have to open the breach face. So I thought it would be nice for 3 gun to have a 9mm Edge but also have it in .40 S&W for USPSA.

STI would take care if it if you send it to them, but with no back up gun, the guy can't shoot. Really not a big deal, STI is great and they will fix it, but they also are aware not everyone has a back up gun. Things happen, this is not a big deal IMO, 5 minutes with a file and a dremel and it is done, takes longer to drive to the Post Office.

If you were keeping score, you were also a range officer. Can you help me with a rule that confirms this? I agree that the scorekeeper assists the RO (Defined at 7.1.1) and the RO would be smart to listen to a scorekeeper, but I don't see where the scorekeeper has equal authority.Interestingly, though, the rules discuss scoring as if the RO is the one doing it. (9.7.1) if you are assisting with getting shooters through a stage you are an RO. Thanks Sarge, I am relatively new to this sport but been shooting over 30 years. I have signed up for the Level 1 R.O. course and have read the rules several times. But was not sure who is the one actually to make these calls. Unfortunately at a major match the CRO on the stage I helped at was not fair and impartial with the way he dealt with people, he was a very nice guy but there were several rules violated that should have been a,DQ. But he let them slide. I am not looking to DQ anyone but the rules are pretty clear.

Yep, and I have seen this situation in real life. If you are having a train wreck of a run and 'decide' to run back and pick up a mag you dropped earlier, I'm not saying you are intentionally running into the RO, but I don't think it's unreasonable to at least take into account whether or not that contact *really* affected your run. It could be very slight contact, for example, and while I'm sure the shooter would love a reshoot, is it fair to all the other shooters to give out a freebie 'get-out-of-trainwreck-free' card. I would rely on the RO's discretion. Does the contact have to negatively affect their run for a reshoot?In this case neither the R.O. nor the shooter said anything about a reshoot, I don't think they knew about the rule. Now that I know what the rule is, if it happens again it can be brought up to the R.O. Here's what the rule says: "In the event that inadvertent contact from the Range Officer or another external influence has interfered with the competitor during a course of fire, the Range Officer may offer the competitor a reshoot of the course of fire." I would tend to say that if the contact has no negative effect, there may not be a need for a re-shoot, but it's definitely one of the real gray areas in the rulebook. The problem is the rule book doesn't say it has to negatively affect the shooter. It says if contact is made and in interfered with the shooter. I guess people could argue about what interfered means. In my opinion the R.O. should not have allowed anyone to follow him into the shooting area especially the shoot house. By allowing the guy to follow him now you have 2 people on the way, the R.O. was blocked by the guy with a video camera, the shooter was blocked by the R.O. and possibly the guy with the video camera. If I was the R.O. I would not have allowed the guy with the camera to follow me, if I didn't know he was going to. Once I saw him in the shoot house, I would stop the shooter and have the guy leave and the shooter reshoot the stage. I am a photographer too, but I stay out of the shooting area, I use a Go Pro to record my stages, if someone asks me to record them I do and I let the R.O. know what I add m doing and I stay way back out of their way.

Yep, and I have seen this situation in real life. If you are having a train wreck of a run and 'decide' to run back and pick up a mag you dropped earlier, I'm not saying you are intentionally running into the RO, but I don't think it's unreasonable to at least take into account whether or not that contact *really* affected your run. It could be very slight contact, for example, and while I'm sure the shooter would love a reshoot, is it fair to all the other shooters to give out a freebie 'get-out-of-trainwreck-free' card. I would rely on the RO's discretion. Does the contact have to negatively affect their run for a reshoot? In this case neither the R.O. nor the shooter said anything about a reshoot, I don't think they knew about the rule. Now that I know what the rule is, if it happens again it can be brought up to the R.O.

In this case I don't think the R.O. knew the rule and neither did the shooter. I am not the R.O. I was helping run the score pad. I thought he should get a reshoot but since I wasn't sure, I didn't bring it up. I keep my rule book on my bag, but not sure where to look. Now I know and I will reread the book, tab and highlight it for future reference. There were 2 people in his way, one was the R.O. the other guy I think was running a video camera and he was behind the R.O. and was in the R.O.'s way. This is one reason why many R.O.'s will not allow people to follow with a camera, because they can get in the way, the R.O. with the timer needs to concentrate on the shooter and mainly be watching his gun, he should not be distracted by anyone else. The squad started advancing to paste because they thought he was finishing up, this speeds things up but no one should advance until the R.O. gives the Range is clear command. I ran the pad, would score the 4 targets he engaged first then get the time and follow the R.O. for the rest of the scores, if there was a Mike or a no shoot , I would call the shooter over to look at it, then they would paste it. I am new and very safety conscious, it seems some people get lax with safety when running shooters to speed things up.

Round Gun Shooter, I don't see on the rule cited where it says if the guy has a bad run and there is contact, no reshoot, but if he had a good run he should get a reshoot. The rules are the rules and should be applied fairly to everyone and not subjected to personal interpretation of the individual R.O.'s. I have seem CRO's at major matches let people slide on issues, yet other CRO's in the same match enforced the rules as written. One was a safety wasn't on when a 2011 was holstered, he was allowed to slide because it had a grip safety. Another was the shooter ditched a 2011 without the safety being on, he said it was on when he ditched it in the box, but it was clearly off when we checked it, he was not DQ'd but given a 30 second penalty. After the match I read the rules again, no where did I see a 30 second penalty instead of a DQ. Yet another guy swept himself and was DQ'd, another guys gun fell out of a holster and was DQ'd, which is the right call. Rules should be enforced across the board to everyone.

The Courts have ruled at the Federal Level you can video record and take pictures in public where there is no expectation of privacy. You don't need anyone's permission. But if someone doesn't want to be video taped or have their video put on YouTube I think the proper thing to do is honor their request. I shot a lot of video and pictures at Area 6 MultiGun, one young looking guy asked me not to publish any of his video or pictures, I hot the impression he was an undercover LEO, he said his bosses did not allow any pictures or video of him to be posted. He asked me in a very polite manner, made a very reasonable request and I honored his request.

It was a USPSA sanctioned match. He had problems with some of his magazines, he was shooting production and his follower got hung up, probably from dirt. He is a good shooter just had issues with magazines, he didn't give up, he made the best of the situation. I am guessing the guy running the timer didn't know he should have gotten a reshoot, I thought he was allowed to, but wasn't certain so I didn't bring it up, I am not an R.O. I was just helping score, I was at the entrance of the shoot house scoring the 1st 4 targets, I stay way back and out if the way and don't touch anything the shooter dropped until after they have showed clear, hammer down and holstered,,in case they do come back for something. I will read the rules again and highlight and tab the rule book so I can find stuff quicker. I like to know where the rule is and not quote something from memory, I want to be able to quickly look it up and present what I think is the applicable rule.

I had a stage where I screwed up and ran past 2 targets, the R.O. had a pretty good idea I would come back to them,,he kept everyone back and stayed out of my way because he anticipated what I was going to do. I had my Go Pro running so when I started moving backwards I saw in the video how he handled it and he did a good job anticipating what I would do. This R.O. didn't realize what was going on until the shooter started moving back and him and another guy blocked him. IMO if the shooter did it on purpose, he would have asked for a reshoot.

KTM, It was obvious that it was not on purpose, plus if it was he would have asked for a reshoot.

At no time was there a safety violation, the R.O. got out of the way, he retrieved his magazine, ended having to retrieve a second one and finish his stage. We scored it and since it was the last stage of the day and he was almost the last shooter,they let him run it again for time only and he did a lot better. I thought he should have had a chance to reshoot, but wasn't sure. Now I know for in the future.

Not sure what his qualifications are as an R.O. but he does give very clear, concise range commands. I notice some C.R.O.'s being lax with rules, if a guy ditches a gun and it is loaded and not on safety or he holsters a 2011 without it being on safe and gives a warning rather than following the rules, it's not fair to the other competitors that may not get the same break. I haven't been through the class yet, but read the rule book a,few times, need to study it more. I thought he should get a reshoot but wasn't sure, so I didn't say anything. Now I will know and I will tab and highlight the rule in my book. Thanks.

I thought he should have gotten a reshoot. I wasn't sure and not sure where in the rule book it was. I need to tab my rule book. I wasn't the R.O. just helping with the tablet to score.

Today a shooter was in a shoot house,,the R.O. and another guy followed him,,he should gave finished in a hallway but he ended up having to go back to retrieve a magazine he dropped during a reload. The R.O. got in his way and he got bumped inot by the shooter, he was able to retrieve his magazines and finish his stage,,although it was a safe run, it was slow and many issues. My question is should he have gotten a reshoot since tge R.O. got in his way? It was a slot series match.

I guess my concern is this was imo a blatant safety violation that should have been dealt with in a proper manner, according to USPSA this is a D.Q. It seems to me that sloppy rule enforcement is a bad idea. If you sweep yourself or drop a gun, it is a no questions asked D.Q. But other violations are ignored. I think loading a gun in a safe area violated more than just the rule of handling ammo in the safe area. He loaded a gun before a make ready command was given, he was not under the supervision of a R.O., he had a loaded gun on a cold range. If it happens again, I will follow up on it more diligently.

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I know you can have ammo on you but you are not allowed to see if your AR15 will chamber ammo that would not feed during a stage. I thought it was an automatic no questions asked D.Q. My question is more how do you handle something like this when the CRO let's people slide on these types of issues?

If you see someone handling ammo at a safe table, and actually checking to see if it will chamber after they had problems, and the CRO is notified and see's it, what are they supposed to do? I was helping at a match and yelled at the guy No Ammo in the safe area is to be handled and had the CRO come over.