brentm

not sure about where a 40cal will come from as not any 'distributer' in nz though i know of one selling the govt. model. they did come from the Australian distr. but not now in anything above 38cal since their law change. will have to find out, the Aussie guy did have bull barrel as ipsc option

funny you should mention that... hey are well priced here too so im leaning heavily that way best choce would be the 40cal ipsc model, with the addition of tungsten guide rod

flex, thanks same boat here, just starting out in in NZ your'e up for double he US cost so that baseline Sti edge at $1800 odd springs to $4000 landed in NZ, just a lot first up Enterprise seemded to fill that gap between para and sti....shame kimber doesnt do a double (well bigger than 10r) decisions decisions

can anyone coment on Entréprise Arms 'medalist' pistol (or tsm, boxer) or has anyone used a EA hi-cap frame? just looking for basic package for limited class, its not going to be my main discipline for some time but you need something with the 'bits' to play and this seems like good mix. i liked the coments on this package over a para or single stack.

thanks guys thats what i thought too... i asked the guy again and he was looking in the 2001 rule book appendix E 'load max 6 rounds' but youre right , i'll play next time

ok so i got this sweet 686+ 357 moonclipped we play action pistol and service match lots in NZ but then i thought about IPSC too... so help me out here i'm gettn told only to load 6 rounds...bugger i dont mind shooting 6 but loading 6 seems dumb. any comments guys appreciated

from someone who shoots mostly bianchi matches where the perception is speed isn't required... but really it is initial speed in target acquisition buys you valuable time for comfortable splits in that series later in the shootoffs like plates its sudden death- no misses and decreasing time you're actually forced to speed up more and more - puts a lot outside their comformt zone i certainly never forced myself to shoot faster it just doesn't work - but pushing a little does and it allows you to maintain confidence in making hits as you actually speed up, but it takes time. my speed comes only from the confidence in my own ability to consistently make hits - thats a mental construct so its a mental limitation...to be beaten menatlly.... i find visulisation prematch provides more gains than anything , i know my ability and i use visualisation like watching a movie of myself before i shoot...i made those hits in 4 sec so i could push a little more... i struggled when i started to hit those 6 plates in 6 sec some 10yrs on I'm whacking them in under 3sec with a revolver - Brentm

anyone shooting in IPSC/USPSA Limited or Limited 10 would slip right in, work up a sweet 120 power factor load and away you go. the Stock class rules currently create a level playing field, all shoot standing except 50y thats freestyle, and non-contact on the barricades. but the rules did restrict a lot of pistols who'd had minor alterations so the changes will let a lot more pistols classifiy - bascially they are creating 'Metallic Sight Firearm' class. hey really Metallic Sights and no compensator's are the big factors, what else you do to doesnt add up to that much of an advantage brentm its below.... MOTION - change rule 3.2 to read as follows: Rule 3.2 Metallic Sight Firearm - Minimum caliber is 9x19mm (9mm). A Semi Automatic firearm with no more than a 6 1/4" barrel in length. The front sight not to extend past the front of the slide and the rear sight not past the rear of the slide by a ¼". Revolvers with no more than a 8 5/8" barrel in length. The front sight not to extend past the front of the barrel and the rear sight not past the rear of the frame. The following items are prohibited. a. Wings b. Peep, ghost, optical or electronic sights. c. Wraparound grips - No part of the grip may encircle the hand. d. Thumb rests. e. Compensators or ported barrels.

this is the letter i fowarded Thursday, 23 October 2003 Action NRA Action Pistol Committee C/O Rudy Dufour Action Pistol coordinator RDufour@nrahq.org Re: Proposed rule change – open class- limiting prone shooting. I would like to express my condemnation of the proposed rule changes to the open class rules of the Action Pistol Bianchi cup match. I would have preferred not to write such a letter without some understanding of the committee’s reasoning leading to the proposed changes, but I have yet to discovered any official press statement, even direct contact via the NRA AP Program Coordinator received a limited reply. Therefore you will find the points I will make are limited to the information I have gathered, mostly second hand. I have competed for over ten years of in this match at both Nation & International events, I hold 3 national titles and have represented my NZ in 7 events, I have at times lived and breathed this match, but I feel extremely dismayed the committee has created the unfortunate and unnecessary situation leaving thousands of competitors worldwide awaiting the committees sole judgment on rule changes so significant as to alter the current Bianchi match into an entirely different event. I ask you how can the committee seriously expect competitors to continue to participate in an event, which after 25 years alters the rules without any consultation. Thousands of shooters have made the event what it is today; they have created its history and invested hundreds of thousands of hours and dollars into John Bianchi’s vision match. I actually struggle to understand what issues could have initiated such drastic changes to the open class rules, and my concerns revolve purely around the effect these changes will have on the participation at Bianchi cup matches, because these changes will see less people competing. New Zealand has seen a steady decline in numbers attending Bianchi matches since I first started competing some 10 years ago, when these where the premier events. I honestly believe any rules changes need to be aimed at increasing numbers, the proposed stock gun rule is a great example of this happening. So far as I know the proposed change to open class is to limit prone shooting to 50 yards only. This is a significant change which I believe will damage the match seriously. I know from personal experience this change would create a large void between top scoring competitors and the balance of the grades. A Highmaster will hardly be affected, I know this myself I score regularly 1914 plus using a revolver, yes you will make it more difficult but I will still have very similar results. I know prone shooting allows far more consistent scores (not just higher scores) and this is why we will see such a large gap, the lower graded shooters will be penalized far more because they are inconsistent than they are currently. New shooters will struggle for much longer before shooting what they perceive as reasonable scores, this one of the major factors in new competitors being scared off before they even start. Revolvers will almost certainly be pushed further out of the match, I can compete x for x throughout the current match but standing is far more demanding at top level. I would expect most shooters to move straight to semi-auto’s or to move away from competing at all. Currently the revolver in open class can compete in at much less cost than with an semi-auto, for many this is a big issue. The prone element itself is a technique not demanded in any other Action match, it is an art and it will be lost. I remember the mention at the cup this year of the Nz’er 70 old years old who still ‘went prone at 15y’, well that’s to what you’ll lose. I received one comment from the program coordinator that these changes would involve more shooters in the Bianchi match, not so, you still need a gun with barricade wings to seriously compete, that one element alone separates the Bianchi pistol from others. I honestly believe open class should be distinctly different than stock class. What makes the Bianchi Cup the match is the pressure generated at the elite level. The shooting is not significantly demanding to a Highmaster but it is the pressure that makes it difficult and you will change this drastically. The fact that not one shot may slip from the 10 ring because you can never catch. Well this type of rule change will see such a large spread of scores this pressure element will disappear. You will by now I’m sure have plenty of suggestions on how to improve the match. I believe hearing many of these there is several very simple subtle changes which would separate the top scorers and still not disadvantage the average shooter. Any rules adopted we would need them to ensure the average shooter still wants to shoot, these are the people which actually support the event by participating. Brent M Member New Zealand Pistol Association

i agree that you'd have to give up too much of the essence of ipsc to get it into the games....well at the moment probably Bianchi cup match is more the thing you could slip right in B

Shooting plenty of movers is a great way to get comfortable with the match but if you've no mover, like the guys said - off hand practice is what you need. when i can't get to a mover range i shoot i practice two things to help set up three 8" plates on a 50yard range one each side, one centre, timer on 5 sec, you can get the feel for those longer ranage shots with the timing... the other simple one is to shoot a plates match standing, 1 sec quicker enjoy

It's certainly no surprise this topic has dragged up more issues than the rule changes… New Zealand has for seen a steady decline in AP shooters from when I started over 10 years ago, AP was then the matches to be at on the calendar...not so now, we have a regular committed base of shooters but only 20-30% of what it was. It was obvious from the start there is far more in the reason to change these rules than the fact two shooters tied at the US nationals....it smacks of a lot more - I've yet to hear anything that sounds like truth, certainly the reason being bantered around are really very lame. There is several really easy solutions to separating the top scorers without affecting the average graded shooter, and it is really important since they make up the majority. I asked RudyD a few questions and one thing he said was they wanted more shooters from other disciplines to shoot, now that's just a slack answer. The rule that actually stops any open class pistol shooting AP is a barricade shroud otherwise any scoped & comped gun would be fine, and are they changing that? nope. The changes from stock to metallic sights will see plenty of opportunity for more shooters, so they got that one right....strange though that rule change was actually officially submitted by a NZer at the cup this year. and that's really my point.....where did they get this idea about reducing the prone aspect, as a revolver shooter who can produce regular 1914+s and the odd 1920 I'm not really going to be see my scores change drastically but the average shooter is, plenty more 8's & 5's. It's certainly a big enough change though to look into an auto. That's no knee jerk reaction, plenty of prone is ok with the revolver I can compete x of x with anyone, but standing its a lot of work...and changing from one standing match to three will introduce so much more effort. So how many shooters are like me and perceive they need a new pistol or an auto? plenty I bet. I'm game for some improvements to the match but this is altering the match too much, and we will see a lot of shooters NOT competing because of it. The interesting thing what is really driving the change? is it some mislead idea less prone shooting will change the top scores? or that we'll see more shooters from other disciplines? I'm dying to find out...