Zak Smith Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 I am considering buying either a TA31 or a TA11 for shooting 3Gun, and my question is: for each of these, how far forward of the charging handle (rear end of flat-top) must the rear lens be positioned for proper eye relief? I normally shoot "nose to charging handle". Before considering the ACOG, I was using a Leupold 1.5-5X which has between 3.7" (at 5x) and 5.3" (at 1.5x). To get enough eye relief with this scope with my nose to charging handle, I had to mount the rear lens of the scope about 2" in front of the charging handle, which necessitated the use of a Super-Extended ARMS rail (#36S-EX, I think). Based on the rough approximation that in nose-to-chg-handle, my eye is about 1.5" to the rear of the chg handle, I would guess the TA31 should be mounted even with the rear, and the TA11 should be mounted between 0.5 - 0.9" forward of the rail. Does this sound about right? With the rear lens of the TA11 mounted 1" forward of the rear, will the rail mount (TA51?) go too far forward past the front end of the flat-top rail? As a side question, is a TA31 or a TA11 better for 3Gun? I would guess that the TA11 would be better for close shots... thanks Zak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Zak: I don't run my cheek weld that far forward... Back of my TA-11s are right at the ring you can see of the magazine spring tube by the front of the stock, or about 3/8" back from the charging handle. Does it matter....NO!!! set it for what is comfortable to YOU. Set the scope so that when you mount the gun fast you get a full field of view in the scope lens, no ghosting or shadows, but just a full lens of nothing but clear target! I don't think that you will need an extended rail as where mine is mounted I still have 1 1/2" more to move forward! I really recomend the TA-11 with the doughnut reticle. Much faster for everything!!! Long or close!!! You will need a TA51 adapter to mount the scope on to a flat top. I have a spare one that is used, if you are interested I will let it go very reasonably. Welcome to the Trijicon family!!! You wont be disapointed!!! KURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 OOPS!!! I ment recoil spring tube, where the stock attaches. More coffee!!! KURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted June 10, 2003 Author Share Posted June 10, 2003 Kurt, Thanks for the info! Why do you prefer the TA11 over the TA31? thanks Zak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Zak: I guess I should preface this with a quote from a CQT user who shot my TA-11 this last weekend on steel plates. " WOW " I can see why that hollow middle of the dot is sooooo fast on steel!! For all practicle purposes ( if you zero the scope properly) on a 10" plate, if the hollow part of the dot is filled up with the color of the plate you will hit it from 50 - 300 yards. No guess work, no hold over, if the dot is filled it will hit!!! Also the hollow doughnut allows 3 very precise aiming points from 100 out to 300 and past that the B.A.C. is regulated fairly well, depending on ammo selection. It is not a busy reticle like the TA-01, nor does it occlude very much of a target when you start using the B.A.C. Every one that shoots for Trijicon tried all the different variations and ALL decided to use the TA-11 with the doughnut reticle. I could go on but I fear I would only bore Kelly to death, who is sick of me ranting about the TA-11. Good luck!!! KURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted June 10, 2003 Author Share Posted June 10, 2003 Kurt, My question is really about the TA31 vs. the TA11. Both have BAC and the Donut reticle. I am not looking at the TA01's with the crosshair reticle at all. The only difference is the eye relief (1.5" vs. 2.4"), field of view (7deg vs. 5.5deg), length, weight, and magnification (4x vs. 3.5x). thanks Zak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Rant away Kurt, I mean D.R. I have a TA11 and like it very much. it's what I'll be shooting at Raton. Have you shot any other bullets besides the 55s to check compatibility with the reticle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VNGunfighter Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 TA-11 GOOD-Eye relief GOOD-ON AR-10 even GOODER I like the bigger Trijicons-You don't have to crowd them as much as the smaller ones-(TA-01) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted June 10, 2003 Author Share Posted June 10, 2003 Basically, I want to be able to retain my nose-to-charging handle cheek weld and use the TA-11. Alternatively, I would use the TA31 (4x magnification) unless it has some disadvantage for 3Gun. There's a middle ground for eye relief. If the scope requires too much, it will have to be mounted very far forward on rail. My Leupold 1.5-5X was like this. The rear bell was about 2 - 2.5" inches down the rail, and the adjustment turrets were about 1" past the forward end of the receiver. On the other hand, if the scope has too little eye relief, you're going to keep smacking it with your glasses. It is extremely annoying to scratch a $150+ set of prescription lenses. thanks Zal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Kelly, and Zak: Kelly first, I've known him longer. YES it works really good with 69 grainers ( you didn't hear it from me!!) as long as they go about 2875 or quicker. They are only like 1.5 inches lower than "ball" at 400yds, NOT THAT I WOULD EVER HAVE TRIED A HEAVY BULLET....I just heared....yea right! Zak, for some wierd reason I was thinking about that big old triangle reticle that is available in the TA-31. Now that you have set me right again I will now respond in a some what inteligent manor. 31 is good but the field of view is not quite what it should be, also more magnification tends to draw the eye to the reticle more than the 3.5X TA-11. The TA31 is also a "dimmer" scope in low light as the exit pupil is smaller than the TA-11, not by much but it is noticable! Up close The TA-11 is faster just because it is lower power...both are great and if I couldn't find a TA-11, the TA-31 is what I would get, darn close second for me!! By the way the TA51 mount I have looks like new and I only want $40.00 for it. D.R. Millerbrookes...OOPS! KURTM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 I'm going to shoot 75 grain Hornadys at Raton if they track close to the reticle. If not, I'll shoot 69ers at about 2950-3000 fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted June 13, 2003 Author Share Posted June 13, 2003 Thanks for the replies, all, and especially kurtm. I have a TA11 on order (at the "old" price) and should get it in a month or two. Since this upper is going to double 3Gun and IDPA side-matches, I'm going to try the new ARMS #19S mount which will allow easy removal of the ACOG.. then I can just flip up the ARMS #40.. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 29, 2003 Author Share Posted August 29, 2003 I ended up finding a TA11 in stock at a screamin' price just a week before the RM3GM. I'm totally impressed by this scope and it worked very well at RM3G. As for the eye relief, I'm mounting it on a ARMS #19S (single-wide throw-lever), and the front end of the base "rail" of the TA11 is about even with the forward end of my upper receiver. This puts the rear lens of the scope about an inch in front of the charging handle. It could stand to go a little further still, but this works well enough. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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