selecw Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 (edited) I just started loading RMR 115 JHPs in my Rafferty open gun. The max OAL I can get is 1.135 - after that there is not enough gripping surface left in the case to hold the bullet. Is this normal? The bullets have an unusual profile. Normally I load to 1.165 with Montana Gold and Everglades bullet. Thanks for the help. Edited September 8, 2020 by selecw Update Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhyrum Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I usually load them to 1.125. They do have a different profile that makes them need to be seated shorterSent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I’ve been loading them at 1.165Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iflyskyhigh Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I load for a Glock Open gun, so I’m limited by mag length.I think if you use the formula for bullet seating depth I think you come up with about 1.130ish?That being said I seat them to 1.150” to allow for variation in a magazine limited to 1.160ish. I use a stout dose of the Lee Factory crimp die and have no issues with setback. And yes I’ve pulley a few to check for deformation.These and the Everglades 115JHP both performed much better for me at the longer COAL. I tried them at 1.130” and they sprayed all over the place. At 1.150” 10 shot cloverleaf. COAL made a big difference.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 hour ago, kujo929 said: I’ve been loading them at 1.165 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk what crimp do you use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 52 minutes ago, iflyskyhigh said: I load for a Glock Open gun, so I’m limited by mag length. I think if you use the formula for bullet seating depth I think you come up with about 1.130ish? That being said I seat them to 1.150” to allow for variation in a magazine limited to 1.160ish. I use a stout dose of the Lee Factory crimp die and have no issues with setback. And yes I’ve pulley a few to check for deformation. These and the Everglades 115JHP both performed much better for me at the longer COAL. I tried them at 1.130” and they sprayed all over the place. At 1.150” 10 shot cloverleaf. COAL made a big difference. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk how “stout” is your crimp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iflyskyhigh Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 how “stout” is your crimp? I can measure a couple when I get home and let you know. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 minute ago, iflyskyhigh said: I can measure a couple when I get home and let you know. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 what crimp do you use? About .002 under bullet in case dimensions. I use an undersize sizer so the case neck tension is doing the bulk of the holding of the bullet. Crimp probably isn’t doing a lot. I’m not saying anything I do is correct. Just what I am doing... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Seeing how short you guys are going makes me think I should shorten a little. May try 1.155 and check accuracy again. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 My latest test batch is 1.140 oal with a .378 crimp. The bullet is still stable in the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iflyskyhigh Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Sorry. I should have mentioned I too am using a Lee U Die. Okay. Just remeasured. I actually made them 1.155”. I was kind of surprised how consistent they were for using mixed brass. I pulled a random dozen and they all measured 1.155”Crimp at the meaty part of is .375” and .376” right at the mouth of the case. I think the undersize of the U Die is probably helping with neck tension with as little of actual bullet is seated. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 I tried 1.157 oal with a .378 crimp. The bullets were not gripped enough by the case walls. I could twist them an pull them out. From this, I conclude a tighter crimp - like iflyskyhigh is using - is needed at that length. I am also using the Lee U die and roll sized brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 I tried 1.157 oal with a .378 crimp. The bullets were not gripped enough by the case walls. I could twist them an pull them out. From this, I conclude a tighter crimp - like iflyskyhigh is using - is needed at that length. I am also using the Lee U die and roll sized brass.I can’t twist the Bullets on any of mine. Even out to 1.170. Roll sized brass also. Was using lee undersize die. Recently switched to a Redding ultimate which is also an undersize die. Can you twist one prior to the crimp station after seating? I would check that first and see what your neck tension looks like prior to crimp. I expand with an expander die only and do not expand on the powder die. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 6 minutes ago, kujo929 said: I can’t twist the Bullets on any of mine. Even out to 1.170. Roll sized brass also. Was using lee undersize die. Recently switched to a Redding ultimate which is also an undersize die. Can you twist one prior to the crimp station after seating? I would check that first and see what your neck tension looks like prior to crimp. I expand with an expander die only and do not expand on the powder die. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I will check the twist in the seating station. I imagine I can twist it. Can you measure your outside neck diameter at the crimp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 I will check the twist in the seating station. I imagine I can twist it. Can you measure your outside neck diameter at the crimp? On a random round I just pulled it measured 1.165 oal On part of case where bullet is inside of case measured .378 Crimp .376 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 15 minutes ago, kujo929 said: On a random round I just pulled it measured 1.165 oal On part of case where bullet is inside of case measured .378 Crimp .376 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk .376 isn’t super tight but maybe it’s enough - and you are using 115 JHPs not 124s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 .376 isn’t super tight but maybe it’s enough - and you are using 115 JHPs not 124s?Yes 115 RMR’s currently Used 115 PD’s and 124PD’s with same measurements before I ran out of them. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 5 minutes ago, kujo929 said: Yes 115 RMR’s currently Used 115 PD’s and 124PD’s with same measurements before I ran out of them. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I was using MGs And Everglades, but tested PDs. The RMR has a much fatter shorter profile with a longer load bearing surface than the pointier profile bullets. I am surprised you can load it that long. I will clearly need to do more experimentation. Can you post a pic of one of your rounds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 I was using MGs And Everglades, but tested PDs. The RMR has a much fatter shorter profile with a longer load bearing surface than the pointier profile bullets. I am surprised you can load it that long. I will clearly need to do more experimentation. Can you post a pic of one of your rounds? 115 PD and a 115 RMR. Both at 1.165Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selecw Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 46 minutes ago, kujo929 said: 115 PD and a 115 RMR. Both at 1.165 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Excellent. Given the different profiles, does the PD have a much longer jump to the rifling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kujo929 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Excellent. Given the different profiles, does the PD have a much longer jump to the rifling?I would assume so. But I don’t remember what the change was on the micrometer seating die when switching between them. It wasn’t a large adjustment. It’s not something I pay much attention to when loading for pistols. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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