More questions about the Dillon RT1200

[Boxerglocker]

Ive processed a ton of brass using a FL die FIRST to both size and de-cap, its fine, nothing wrong with it.

The biggest issue is the RT1200 die has the tight neck so you need the neck expander at a minimum after it.

Your setup will be just fine IMO, but if you wanted you COULD run the full length sizer with expander first as your means to punch primers, nothing at all wrong with that.

The only thing doing that AND expanding the mouth after trimming(which again IMO is required with the RT1200 dies) is that you are potentially working the brass at the case mouth double what you need to and could cause pre-mature split necks or what not.

It is often recommended in accuracy circles not to reduce the neck diameter by more than 0.005" in a single step, otherwise the neck reduces by more than you intend and runout can be introduced. Consequently I run a bushing neck die before the RT1200 to do the first 0.004 or 0.005 of neck-down (Redding comp neck die with TIN bushing). The Dillon trim die then does the body, shoulder and final few thousandths of neck sizing, but it still requires an expander afterwards due to the tight neck dimensions of the Dillon die. A new trim die from CH4D is headed my way today. The CH4D dies are compatible with the RT1200 but have more normal neck dimensions. I still plan to expand a little, but by 0.001 or 0.002, rather than 0.004 or 0.005. Curious if anyone else has experience of these dies. Also, while I understand reasons to neck down in two steps, I'm not sure why to FL size twice.

I don't necessarily disagree with recommendations but, the proof of the pudding is what your gear can actually do have and the load you develop. This load group at 100 yards is a Nosler 55 Ballistic tip with H335 and Wolf SRM primers. That's 5 shots with a called flyer. The brass was all once fire LC sorted by year and processed as described with a Dillon FL sizer and RT1200 Trimmer. Rifle Remington 700 SPS 1-9 twist 20 inch barrel benched and sandbagged.

Edited December 17, 2013 by Boxerglocker

[SWThomas]

It says right in the instructions to run the sizing die after the trimmer. It says to screw it down until it makes contact with the case and then back it off a 1/2 turn. That way the expander ball can do its thing and the shoulder is not touched.

I think doing this on the second tool head after tumbling off the lube. That way I can also clean out the flash hole with the decapping pin.

[rjacobs]

I think doing this on the second tool head after tumbling off the lube. That way I can also clean out the flash hole with the decapping pin.

potential for stuck case city. Dont ask me how I know.

AND since you are going to run the VERY nice and precise mandrel expander in station 8 on your prep tool head there is no need to run an arguably LESS precise expander ball through the neck and possibly cause new issues and ruin your nice concentric cases with perfect neck tension.

Having a second universal de-cap die in station 2 of your loading tool head to clean out flash holes is a great idea though.

Edited December 18, 2013 by rjacobs

[SWThomas]

I think doing this on the second tool head after tumbling off the lube. That way I can also clean out the flash hole with the decapping pin.

potential for stuck case city. Dont ask me how I know.

AND since you are going to run the VERY nice and precise mandrel expander in station 8 on your prep tool head there is no need to run an arguably LESS precise expander ball through the neck and possibly cause new issues and ruin your nice concentric cases with perfect neck tension.

Having a second universal de-cap die in station 2 of your loading tool head to clean out flash holes is a great idea though.

I was planning on using one or the other. Based on your recommendation and some from other folks, I think I'll use the expander mandrel to open up the case mouth after trimming.

I see your point on the stuck case issue. I just figured it wouldn't be an issue since the brass has already been sized and wouldn't be going all the way into the die. I really don't want to buy another universal decapper though. How about backing the sizing die way off and bottoming out the decapping assembly with the ball removed? That ought to serve to clean out the primer hole with the case barely entering the die...

[rjacobs]

a lee universal de-capper is what, $12? In the grand scheme of a $600 tool head setup, your going to balk at $12?

I mean you could try it with getting the sizing die to work with expander ball removed, but I personally feel thats trying to rig it up and to get the right $12 tool for the job.

[SWThomas]

a lee universal de-capper is what, $12? In the grand scheme of a $600 tool head setup, your going to balk at $12?

I mean you could try it with getting the sizing die to work with expander ball removed, but I personally feel thats trying to rig it up and to get the right $12 tool for the job.

I'm not balking at $12, I'm balking at spending $20 (don't forget shipping) when I already have something that works. But I'm about to place another order with Sinclair anyway so I'll just throw another one in the cart.

[rjacobs]

you dont have a cabela's nearby or any other shop that sells supplies? I have bought all of my Lee universal de-cap dies(I think I have 6 now) from Cabela's locally. They dont sell the replacement de-capping pins though so I buy those by the 10(one thing that sucks about having an auto drive is you cant feel anything and their pins are definitely break able).

[SWThomas]

No Cabelas locally and Green Top doesn't have them. Neither does BPS. The range I go to sells mainly RCBS and Hornady dies. I'll be going to Utah for a week on Sunday and there's a Cabelas right around the corner from where I'll be staying. I'll see if they have one.

[rjacobs]

I broke WAY to many RCBS decapping pins and bent the rods. $12 for a replacement rod was ridiculous. At least with the Lee unit the replacement rods are only $2. Lee just sent me 10 new pins on warranty replacement today. Ive got 20 pins ready to swap out if needed(and I am SURE they will be needed).

[SWThomas]

Is it really that poorly made?

[rjacobs]

Is it really that poorly made?

I dont know about poorly made, but without the collet in the top like the Lee dies or the spring assembly like Dillon uses there is nowhere for the force to go.

Now take what I say with a grain of salt, because I run a 1050 auto drive at 1200 rounds per hour with no hand feel. I have also bent an RCBS rod in my 550b, not sure how it happened, but it happened. I am sure on a press you were running by hand much slower you would feel a de-prime pin jam up and not put so much force on it. I have bent the lee pins when the brass isnt quite in the shell plate 100% and the pin goes outside the case, destroys the case, and generally the tip then hits the shell plate and bends. The actual shaft of the lee pin didnt bend, just the tip. I am 100% sure if this happened with the RCBS setup that you would completely bend the shaft that holds the pin too.

I would be interested to try the Dillon universal de-prime setup, but not sure I want to put 55 bucks into it plus a handful of replacement pins when the Lee unit works well(much less issues than the RCBS) and is WAY cheap to both buy as well as the replacement rod/pin setups.

[RDA]

Crimped primers can really do a number on typical depriming pins. I never had an issue depriming until I ran into crimped primers which were way harder on my Forster sizing/depriming die. So, I invested in the universal Lee depriming die as the pin was much more robust, cheaper to replace and more readily available locally if needed.

[SWThomas]

Got it all set up and it works like a charm! I had to SERIOUSLY modify the vacuum manifold though to make it fit with the decapper in station 1 and the expander mandrel die in station 4.

Thanks for all the help fellas!

[roxfo]

Got it all set up and it works like a charm! I had to SERIOUSLY modify the vacuum manifold though to make it fit with the decapper in station 1 and the expander mandrel die in station 4.

Thanks for all the help fellas!

So did you manage to fit a die in an adjacent station to the RT1200? That would be interesting to see - can you post a photo of the modification?

..

[SWThomas]

Yeah, I got the universal depriming die in station 1, the trimmer in station 3, and the mandrel die in station 4. The modified mandrel is pointed out to where station 2 is.

I'll post a picture when I get back home from vacation.

[454redhawk]

On the XL650 for .223 I do it like this

Station 1. Dillon Full Length Resize/Decap

Station 2. Empty

Station 3. RT1200

Station 4. Empty

Station 5. Lyman M-Die (Ever so slightly open the neck)

I whipped up a snugly fit 90 deg bent nail for the toolhead pin.

YMMV

[ScottyPotty]

I opened up the neck on the 223 trim die. Works great and no need to double size the neck.

[G29SF]

I use a Dillon sizer/decapper/ball-expander raised a bit so it does not fully size, but does fix the neck.... before the trim die which is set to fully size. Once the trim dies has sized the case (and has been trimmed), I don't touch the neck again. I simply seat the bullet (in a separate step with another toolhead). I find the neck tension perfect after the trim die.

[Doc Hunter]

Use the Sinclair Expanding Mandrel or the Lyman "M" die. The "M" die can be set to flare if you want it. The Sinclair cannot. Either is way better than doing a expander ball.