9.9.3 - Activation of moving targets.

[Poppa Bear]

Only with a level I exemption. Level II and up you cannot place those type of restrictions into the WSB. You have to compel through design.

I must have missed something. What rule?

Basically, I'm in a quandry as to why in a level II match, I can say in the WSB: "the competitor must carry the bucket from point A to point B before the last shot is fired", but I can't say "the competitor must activate T5 by using pressure pad before the last shot is fired"?

Yes, I agree that it would be infinitely better if the stage designed compelled the shooter so that there would be less stuff in the WSB... eg. what is required of the shooter is self evident, but I thought there was enough leeway in the rules to have a "before last shot is fired" restriction.

The answer is a failure to read 1.1.5 and 1.1.5.1 before making that statement. There is no level I exemption related to activation.

1.1.5 Freestyle – USPSA matches are freestyle. Competitors must be permitted

to solve the challenge presented in a freestyle manner, and to shoot

targets on an “as and when visible” basis. Courses of fire must not

require mandatory reloads nor dictate a shooting position, location or

stance, except as specified below. However, conditions may be created,

and barriers or other physical limitations may be constructed, to compel

a competitor into shooting positions, locations or stances.

1.1.5.1 Level I matches may use shooting boxes and specify where or

when specific target arrays may be engaged, and may specify

mandatory reloads in short and medium courses only (not in a

long course).

1.1.5 says nothing about making you activate a target. Design can compel you to that location and 1.1.5.1 can use the WSB to force you to that location in a level I short or medium COF. Neither can compel you to actually activate the target. 9.9.3 addresses the penalties if you fail to activate the target, and 10.2.2 addresses penalties for failure to follow the WSB.

[Skydiver]

Only with a level I exemption. Level II and up you cannot place those type of restrictions into the WSB. You have to compel through design.

I must have missed something. What rule?

Basically, I'm in a quandry as to why in a level II match, I can say in the WSB: "the competitor must carry the bucket from point A to point B before the last shot is fired", but I can't say "the competitor must activate T5 by using pressure pad before the last shot is fired"?

Yes, I agree that it would be infinitely better if the stage designed compelled the shooter so that there would be less stuff in the WSB... eg. what is required of the shooter is self evident, but I thought there was enough leeway in the rules to have a "before last shot is fired" restriction.

The answer is a failure to read 1.1.5 and 1.1.5.1 before making that statement. There is no level I exemption related to activation.

1.1.5 Freestyle – USPSA matches are freestyle. Competitors must be permitted

to solve the challenge presented in a freestyle manner, and to shoot

targets on an "as and when visible" basis. Courses of fire must not

require mandatory reloads nor dictate a shooting position, location or

stance, except as specified below. However, conditions may be created,

and barriers or other physical limitations may be constructed, to compel

a competitor into shooting positions, locations or stances.

1.1.5.1 Level I matches may use shooting boxes and specify where or

when specific target arrays may be engaged, and may specify

mandatory reloads in short and medium courses only (not in a

long course).

1.1.5 says nothing about making you activate a target. Design can compel you to that location and 1.1.5.1 can use the WSB to force you to that location in a level I short or medium COF. Neither can compel you to actually activate the target. 9.9.3 addresses the penalties if you fail to activate the target, and 10.2.2 addresses penalties for failure to follow the WSB.

So the the "condition" created in the WSB under 1.1.5 that a target must be activated "before the last shot is fired" is illegal?

If it is illegal to specify that an action must be done "before the last shot is fired", then why did John Amidon approve these two stages for Level II for a level II match:

http://northwestsect...0Bad%20Guys.pdf

http://northwestsect...he%20Moolah.pdf

Or actions "before the last shot fired" maybe specified by the WSB as long as the action is not activating a target?

I do agree that if a stage designer fails to specify that an action has to be done on the clock, a shooter is free to go activate it after they are done shooting, but before "Range Is Clear" is declared.

Edited August 28, 2011 by Skydiver

[Poppa Bear]

Only with a level I exemption. Level II and up you cannot place those type of restrictions into the WSB. You have to compel through design.

I must have missed something. What rule?

Basically, I'm in a quandry as to why in a level II match, I can say in the WSB: "the competitor must carry the bucket from point A to point B before the last shot is fired", but I can't say "the competitor must activate T5 by using pressure pad before the last shot is fired"?

Yes, I agree that it would be infinitely better if the stage designed compelled the shooter so that there would be less stuff in the WSB... eg. what is required of the shooter is self evident, but I thought there was enough leeway in the rules to have a "before last shot is fired" restriction.

The answer is a failure to read 1.1.5 and 1.1.5.1 before making that statement. There is no level I exemption related to activation.

1.1.5 Freestyle – USPSA matches are freestyle. Competitors must be permitted

to solve the challenge presented in a freestyle manner, and to shoot

targets on an "as and when visible" basis. Courses of fire must not

require mandatory reloads nor dictate a shooting position, location or

stance, except as specified below. However, conditions may be created,

and barriers or other physical limitations may be constructed, to compel

a competitor into shooting positions, locations or stances.

1.1.5.1 Level I matches may use shooting boxes and specify where or

when specific target arrays may be engaged, and may specify

mandatory reloads in short and medium courses only (not in a

long course).

1.1.5 says nothing about making you activate a target. Design can compel you to that location and 1.1.5.1 can use the WSB to force you to that location in a level I short or medium COF. Neither can compel you to actually activate the target. 9.9.3 addresses the penalties if you fail to activate the target, and 10.2.2 addresses penalties for failure to follow the WSB.

So the the "condition" created in the WSB under 1.1.5 that a target must be activated "before the last shot is fired" is illegal?

If it is illegal to specify that an action must be done "before the last shot is fired", then why did John Amidon approve these two stages for Level II for a level II match:

http://northwestsect...0Bad%20Guys.pdf

http://northwestsect...he%20Moolah.pdf

Or actions "before the last shot fired" maybe specified by the WSB as long as the action is not activating a target?

I do agree that if a stage designer fails to specify that an action has to be done on the clock, a shooter is free to go activate it after they are done shooting, but before "Range Is Clear" is declared.

I am NOW saying it is legal to compel activation at all levels of matches through the WSB. The shooter has to decide if the penalty can be overcome quick enough to make it pay when 10.2.2 comes into play. The trick here is dotting the I's and crossing the T's in the WSB so that it is DRL proof. I think just the phrase "Target X must be activated prior to the last shot" should take care of that.

I too prefer that activation be compelled by design rather than WSB if at all possible.