How Do You Do Reshoots?

[BillD]

We run our matches on 5 or 6 bays with one COF per bay. We divide up into squads and start on all bays at the same time. The squad and the SO move together. I have been thinking about introducing a 2nd gun shoot. Someone could shoot it in revolver and CDP for instance. My question is, how would this work? If I have them shoot one gun early in the squad, then they are going to a safe zone and switching guns every squad.

If you do this sort of thing, do the one gunners share any animosity on waiting while a guy shoots twice on each COF? I can't do it at the end because all my teardown help would leave.

How does it work at your matches?

Thanks

[DogmaDog]

I've done it before, shooting CDP and SSP.

When I did it, I had holsters I could remove without taking off my belt, so I could pull the gun off and put a new one on without much trouble. At the time I did it behind the line without SO supervision. Probably not a kosher practice, but I got away with it. I would think going to the safety area, quickly changing, and coming back, would be the best procedure.

I swapped guns every stage in order to shoot twice. Several people did it, and the match director counted those people twice for squadding purposes, and spread them evenly among the squads.

I avoided hostility by 1) volunteering to go first every stage (for some reason, most shooters don't seem to want to go first), and 2) busting my butt to paste/reset targets, keep score, help out wherever possible.

If shooters pay to shoot twice, I don't see why it should cause discontent among the rest of the shooters.

If you have a shooter switch squads in order to shoot through all the stages quickly, then come through again, it looks like he's skating out of having to help paste targets and keep score, so that might not be the best way to do it, though it does allow said shooter to avoid switching guns all the time.

DogmaDog

[Flexmoney]

BillD, you have identified the major challenge with doing reshoots.

One of the clubs we do reshoots at (Rayner's Range) is on the family's large farm. They take care of the setup and tear-down (they often leave the stages setup...great for practice later in the week). So, having enough "crew" left to do the tear-down is not an issue.

At another club, we do reshoot by the sheer will of the match director (Steve Anderson). This is at a more traditional "club", however. So, if you can't get enough of your "crew" to stick around to tear the stages down, then you are in the hurt-box.

I know for a fact that the other shooters in a squad will get upset if there are people in the squad that are shooting more than one gun their first time through. These shooters just don't want to spend the whole day at the range (for whatever reason). It's just not fair to them time-wise, or work/reset-wise. Pissing these guys off and they won't come back. It's likely not worth losing them to give the two-gun guys a bonus.

Now, on the second time through, when you just have a half-dozen or so of the hard-core shooters left, then a guy can get away with shooting two guns...if you squad buddies are cool with that. (With our group...the guys that are left are seasoned, and can run & reset a stage in no time at all...everybody sees the work that needs done and just does it.)

[vincent]

Just some thoughts:

Have you tried open squading?

Basically shoot the SO's through the whole match first. Then the SO's pick a bay and stay at that bay for the match. The shooters just go bay to bay and shoot in whatever order they want. They turn in thier score sheets to the scorekeeper as they arrive at the bay and are shot in that order.

In this setup, the two gun shooter has two options. Option #1, shoot the entire match with gun A, and then go back through with gun B - switching gear once. Option #2, turn in the scoresheet for gun A and gun B with 4-6 shooters in between and switch gear each bay. Your range rules would have to dictate how the shooter is allowed to switch gear safely.

Another option for two gun shooters who are SO's is to shoot the match with gun A with the SO's, then SO for awhile. When another shooter/SO has completed the match, have that person take over for the two gun shooter who then shoots the match again with gun B.

It you figure out a good way let us know! I think this is a common problem.

[BillD]

Here is how it works at our range. The match starts at 10 AM. Most of the time we have enough people by 8AM to start setting up the match. We are usually done setting up 5-6 stages by 9:30. We use a lot of props.

We start a walkthrough at 9:30 or so for the SO's and scorekeepers and it usually takes 20 minutes or so. I grab my range bag, put on my gun and give the safety talk to all contestants.

I don't know how I could get SO's to shoot through first. We just couldn't get enough help to set the night before and the club wouldn't like us taking up 6 bays in the evening.

Still befuddled.

[Mark Perez]

BillD

we only have one fellow who regularly shoots 2 guns in the match .

Both 1911's for CDP and ESP .

Our usual MO is to have 2 squads for the match ,whether we have 2 bays or 4 depending on competing range schedules.

Squad size average is about 12 - so he can be up first with one gun then later on down towards the end with the 2d.

This shooter always pays double the match fee and is there helping out with the tape or scoring as needed.

The safe area to switch guns isn't very far from the bays so away time is kept to a minimum. Wsh we had more like him.

Not if you know of a way to keep the 'shade-queens' helpful - let me know .

Until that day,

MP

[Sludge]

Well, we shoot our SOs through first instead of running squads. The reason for that is uniformity of how a stage is ran. One set of SOs run that stage for the whole day.. everyone gets treated the same on cover, scores, etc. That said, when we run ppl who want to run more than one gun we make em choose one gun for score. They can run the other, but not for score. The one for score they have to go through the stages with first.. Their "cold" pass. This I think is more fair to other competitors. You guys and I both know that the second time through a stage is usually quicker than the first time. Thats why we wont allow the second gun to be ran for score. When your not running squads ya can just have the guy run his score gun through first, then go back to the safe area and switch up and start through again. He goes to the back of the line on the stages and it doesnt seem to piss ppl off. At the clubs that I have visited that ran squads, it was a one gun only rule.

[Steve Moneypenny]

I prefer open squadding, as a shooter especially, i don't mean to be offensive, but switching guns between stages is just lame. I get groved in with ONE gun, it throws everything off to switch guns, and perform my best. so shoot through, go back and pay again, then shoot some 2nd or 3rd time through.

some clubs don't have enough stages to do open squadding. so the have an RO go back and squad again new squad the guys just stick together, no super formal choosing.

this said, a good group of SO's should be able to shoot a match rather quickly. i have seen them say. hey the SO's are shooting, anyone want to help paste targets. i've went to a match before, and pasted/ran timer, etc for RO's shooting first.

one idea of this is after the first shoot through. (presuming some of the guys are certified SO's) is to let them shoot the stages, usually these are pretty serious guys by this point. sometimes it helps to have lot's of so/ro's out there even if they don't want to do so at every match.