jh9

Thanks guys. Doesn't look like Apex is taking new work right now. Will definitely follow up with Ford and Glenn.

Can anyone recommend a smith in the phoenix/tempe area taking new revolver work? Barrel swaps / refinishing / etc. IOW more than just spring swapping and action work.

The "Pro" series guns are shipping with the older Wolff type 2 "competition" mainspring and the longer (square butt, I think?) strain screw. In my 627 pro this would pop anything but CCI 550s. From memory the regular CCI 500s were fine. For a 10-11 adding the Apex 'tactical' firing pin + spring should be plenty reliable with .38s. I wouldn't trust it with magnum primers though. I have a Wilson mainspring somewhere. Like the Miculek, it's a bent OEM spring. The only way to know if it'll work with whatever primers you're using is to give it a go.

The 4" 627pro comes chamfered from the factory. If you had it chamfered more aggressively then you should definitely test it if you plan on shooting without moonclips...

Nevermind. I just saw the part in "authorized modifications" that specifically mentions tri-topping. I swear I actually do read things before I post.

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=95041&hl=+1911%20+tri%20+top&page=5 That's the only thread I found, and the last post is in 2009 with no real definitive answer. Two questions: Here and now, in 2016 is tri-topping a slide and/or hi-power cuts permissible in SSTK? Is there any additional info/ruling/etc on what constitutes 'slide lightening for a competitive advantage' vs something that's just decorative?

From the ad: That's why I just bend the stock spring until I gerte exactly what I need. Otherwise you end up with a bagfull of various spring weights. These are probably OK, chances are they will work... if not, you can always bend them. There are many weight rebound springs available, simpler just to buy stock ones and cut the length. That way you know exactly what weight they are by measuring the length and you don't have to keep five different kinds around. Aren't the rimfire guns notorious for being sensitive to lighter mainsprings? I kinda chalked the 617 issue up to being a .22 At any rate, I tried it out yesterday with a Wolff type 1 (which didn't work before with the short strain screw) and a longer strain screw. AFAIK they make 3 of these? A short (round butt?), medium (square butt?) and a longer version that I have no clue what it's used for. With the longer strain screw it popped off 50 Fiocchi primers and left a deep mark, but was nearly as heavy as the stock spring with the shorter strain screw. The lighter (13,14 pound) rebound springs made for a way too sluggish reset. I went back to the 15 pound Wolff rebound spring and stock mainspring. Since it's not a dedicated game gun and I've gone as far as I can with rebound springs and a fine stone I'll probably just send this one off and let someone who knows what they're doing do a proper "carry" action job.

Thanks for the input guys. I've already polished the interior of the frame where the rebound moves and gone down to a 15lb Wolff spring for the rebound. I was hoping to find a mainspring that would still be reliable regardless of primer (this is a carry/nightstand gun, not a game gun) but maybe knock another pound or two off the DA weight. Not going for super light, just hoping for some improvement without compromising reliability. I've got 3 Wolff Type-I / "factory" mainsprings in my parts box that don't work with either this gun or my older IDPA 686. In this gun with the factory strain screw tightened down all the way there's not enough preload on the spring to clear the rebound. When working the action the rebound hits the mainspring. In the other 686 it works with federal primers, but isn't even 100% with winchesters much less CCIs. These are Type I, not Type II. Already have Apex carry/duty firing pins in both guns. I went ahead and ordered the wilson kit and will try it out and see with some Magtech ammo since the european primers have a rep for being pretty hard. Don't currently have any CCI primers on hand. Figure if it doesn't work I'm only out like $13. Just wanted to ping the hive mind first and see if anybody else had tried this getup.

Anybody used one of these? http://shopwilsoncombat.com/Custom-Tune-Spring-Kit-SW-K_L_N-Frame-Revolvers/productinfo/178/ If so, how was reliability with primers other than Federals?

The only reservations I have are factory ammo making major (4" barrel in the 627pro) and factory bullets' (.355") accuracy at longish distance. Reloads would be using proper size lead, but part of the appeal is using factory ammo when it's available and I'm too lazy to put the press back together (live in an apartment) for loading up another batch. Anybody got rough chrono numbers for factory ball? I'd be plenty happy with girphoto's accuracy if those are .355" bullets.

I'm thinking about having my 627 pro converted to 9mm. Mostly out of annoyance of having to transmogrify my 9mm and .38spl 550 toolheads every time I want to load it. That and I never did buy a *lot* of .38 short colt brass while I'm otherwise swimming in 9 and .38. Is there any reason to believe that having a shop like TK Custom do the conversion will get around some of the factory 929 issues (extraction issues specifically)? Is this a stupid idea that I should feel bad about saying in public?

D'OH. Yeah. I forgot to do that. So even left handed it will behave with empties in it. Now I feel like an idiot...

Good to know. I wonder if the factory does extractors like hands, in that some are intentionally *way* oversized (like they used to be) and others aren't.

Hm. Was it a new post CNC / post MIM gun?

Based on what toolguy said in post 8 this may be worth a shot. I should probably consider this hand toast anyway, so not much to lose.

More details about this please. The extractors are fit to the gun at the factory. For a long time it was a factory only part. Was the extractor factory new or used? What was your process of installing it? It should have been too tight to work with a standard hand if new. Did you narrow up the hand until it worked? The correct process is to cut each tooth until it fits a standard hand. The factory uses a hardened cutting hand for this. So far as I know this doesn't apply to the square (non-pinned) extractors from the early 90s (post Tomkins-era CNC) onward? My understanding is the old, round, pinned extractors were labor-intensive to fit. The newer ones not so much. From memory I dropped the new extractor in first and it still wouldn't carry up with the old (worn) hand. The bearing surfaces on it definitely weren't way oversize. edit: it was a new part, purchased from midway

The ejector rod is straight. I don't have the tools to do the yoke.

When I put the new hand in, I also put a new extractor. It's a 686-5 so it's got the new(er) square extractor without the pins. I didn't do anything to it in terms of fitting. I re-read my OP and left that out. Sorry. The carryup is the same on all 6. Like, identical. Just *barely* not enough rotation to get the cylinder stop to click into place before the hammer falls. Works as expected when pulling the trigger with the right hand (cylinder stop clicks into place, then just a bit more hammer movement to the rear before it falls.) It's almost textbook perfect right handed. Left handed, though, it's just a shade like barely really alllmost right but no. Grr.

Hm. So should I try this in lieu of using my only spare or just go ahead install the (not oversize) spare and follow the directions in the video to the letter? The part about filing the window in the frame is new to me. I'm starting to get the impression that the oversize parts are not just "a bit more metal" but part of more extensive work. Did I just use the wrong part to start with? If I'm not going for an extreme action/lockup job then the regular not-oversize part is the one I should have used to begin with?

Thanks for the input guys. This will be the 2nd hand I've put in this gun. I was hoping maybe the slop in the trigger would be a magic bullet and I wouldn't have to do the "take apart, stone, put back together, rinse repeat" dance. I checked my parts box and I've got a 686 hand (not the oversize). Not this one: http://www.midwayusa.com/product/888914/smith-and-wesson-hand-s-and-w-581-3-586-3-681-686-oversize This one: http://www.midwayusa.com/product/745011/smith-and-wesson-hand-s-and-w-242-331-332-386-386pd-581-3-586-3-619-620-686-581-586 The one that's in there now I'm pretty sure was oversize and just hitting the bevel like in the midway video on youtube wasn't going to cut it. I had to take metal off like the top quarter inch of the hand's body (making it thinner side to side not shorter) to keep it from sticking to the ratchet when the trigger was pulled. I guess I took too much off since I only got like 3k of warmish .38s before I'm back to square one? This is the video I was talking about:

So I've got a 686 that I've had for years. Haven't shot it in awhile and when I started looking at it I noticed that it doesn't carry up in slow DA when pulling the trigger with my left hand. Right handed everything's fine. Left handed the hammer drops before the stop clicks into place. Problem is I'm a lefty. I ordered a set of Power Custom trigger shims (.002) since I noticed there's some wear on the left of the trigger (through the case hardening). I put two of them in (between the frame and trigger) and still get some slop and it has the same timing problem. Kind of wanted to post as a sanity check before trying 3. Is there something else I should be doing? The Kuhnhausen manual doesn't have anything (actually the only thing it has on timing is "hand width is important"). I vaguely recall this being referred to as "singing" but a google search doesn't seem to match what I remember. Thoughts?

In addition to the lowered 155 PF this means the 625 not only survived, it just took over SSR. This is ESR plus "people that want to dip their toes in the water can shoot .38s". I guess it makes sense. S&W sells 627s and 929s to USPSA shooters and keeps the 625 lines open for IDPA shooters. They really should call "revolver" division the "Revolver: Brought to you by Smith and Wesson" division. ...Which wouldn't actually annoy me that much if they could be bothered to turn out more than kit guns that need immediate gunsmith attention. Y'know, to fill the bespoke divisions made just for S&W. In. Both. Games.

Thanks. Stupid question: Russians are harder than CCIs, right? (I've only ever used Fed, Win and CCI.)

Fortunately, I haven't shot IDPA in years.

IDPA's SSR division has always been structured such that you can be competitive with a surplus S&W model 10 (or any other 6-shot .38) so long as you had Comp-IIIs to feed it with. Those could be found for $15 a pop. Even with the barrier to entry so low there hasn't been a real active "revolver division" in IDPA since the AWB sunset in `04. It's not the price of the guns keeping people out in droves...though I have no doubt at least a few people have thought about trying it only to be disuaded by the cost. It might be that if existing revolver shooters all sold off their 625s at fire-sale prices that could stir up some interest... I will start the bidding for a Carmonized 625 at $30 and a pack of bubble gum.