chauncey
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Posts posted by chauncey
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Well I got the Viper
Liked it, so I bought a second
Illumination doesnt work
I will not be buying a 3rd Vortex
Back to reading forums and reviews
I want tried and tested products, not tried and tested warranty departments
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On 2/28/2020 at 2:13 PM, farinx said:
I'd definitely recommend the Vortex PST 1-6. The value is amazing with this scope. The razor "disappears" a bit better, but the glass in both scopes is excellent.
My second Viper had broken illumination out of the box
Pass
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My second Viper, illuminator didnt work out of the box. Now I dont trust the first.
2 and done
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On 4/18/2020 at 2:24 AM, Frankly said:
$600 Vortex Viper II or Steiner
$1200 Vortex 1-6 Razor or close competitor for less
$1800 Vortex 1-10 Razor
$3000 Kahles
Isn't it that simple? Decide how much money you can budget and get the best value at each price point.
Skip the Viper
I bought 2, on the 2nd the illumination doesnt work, right out of the box.
When a company is known for their warranty, there is a hidden message here...
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I bought the light load kit (spring and carrier) from them and it solved my reliability problems.
When I called there was a terse message along the lines that they were building guns not returning calls.
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Due to injuries and risk of re-injury I don't go more than 75%, but I try (and usually) lift 7 days a week. I intentionally skip on the days I shoot 3gun but not IDPA.
Not recommending lifting every.day, just saying what works for me - to be in motion daily.
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I have been exercising consistently most of my life and lifting for the last 23 years. I am consistently lazy about cardio.
Lifting helps me with Heavy Metal 3gun and for recoil control with heavier caliber handguns such as 45acp and 10mm. Not for speed apparently, I am slow as s...
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13 hours ago, B585 said:
Never patch a young kid’s eye unless prescribed by optometrist/ophthalmologist!!!! You are risking creating amblyopia which is an eye that is not capable of reading 20/20, a strabismus (eye turn), reduced depth perception, etc. You don’t have to believe me, but at least Google it. There is a reason vision screenings are recommended at 6 months old and that is trying to catch amblyopia before it becomes permanent. Patching a good eye on a young child can cause amblyopia and/or the other problems I just mentioned.
Ok so I googled amblyopia. It talks about eye patches as a treatment, not a cause. It defines the condition as dissimilar eye muscle strength.
She wasn't cross-eyed and didn't have a lazy eye.
She needed reading glasses for a few years and now grew out of them, and has 20/20 vision with annual eye exams.
She wore an eye patch 1 hour a week during archery for a few years. Now she shuts one eye during shooting.
I'm not getting your point. Please elaborate.
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I am not telling you what to do
I am telling you what I did
I caught this at 6 when my daughter started archery. Left eye, right hand. She wore an eye patch on her left eye for years.
She now (12) shoots everything with her right eye, closing her left, and with a pistol uses almost exclusively an Isosceles position.
ymmv
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Spoke to SLR and placed the order. Eyeballed it vs. a friend's Stealth/Geissele build.
The SLR adjustable gas block is actually dimensionally SMALLER than the low profile gas block provided by Geissele.
My adjustable SLR is the screw version. SLR has a model specific for the Larue Stealth barrel.
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I have a Vortex magnifier that flips to the left.
It did service on a (7.62×51) G3 clone for a while and held up well. Can't get much more abuse than that.
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I have had success with SWFA mounts. They run maybe a little on the heavy side, but are durable
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Thank.you, great post
Thank you to all of you that contributed
In the long run I am looking at wanting/needing 2-3 scopes.
I would like to put "hands on" a Triji 1-8. If a good enough sale comes up on this, I am thinking I will go for it. If not, I will probably get a Viper now, and the Triji 1-8 later.
I am prioritizing 2 new uppers, with a mind toward 2020 being an election year, and all the possible legal and market ramifications that go with it. That will probably NOT affect optics purchases.
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On 10/13/2019 at 1:03 AM, emjbe said:
I have the SWFA 1-4 and a Razor HD Gen II-E 1-6x.
In my opinion the Strike Eagle 1-6 or 1-8 is a step down from the SWFA 1-4. I have a strike 1-6 and I prefer the SWFA 1-4 for 3 gun due to the glass being more clear, much less distorted, and the SWFA has a better eyebox. I can see 535 yard targets better in the 1-4 than I can with the strike 1-6.
The Razor is definitely a step up from the SWFA 1-4.
I've used a PST and I found the scope to be nearly as good at the Razor ... so much so that I regretted spending the extra $$ for the Razor. To compare I put the PST and the Razor side-by-side and compared what matters most to me for 3gun: eyebox size. The PST was 100% equal to the Razor. I'm not a glass expert at all, but the only place I could tell a difference between the PST and Razor glass clarity was after the sun set and it was getting dark. So, if I were buying a hunting optic and I know that my 400+ elk will only come out in the last 30 seconds of legal hunting time, I'd get the Razor. For 3gun, if I had to do it over again, I'd get the PST.
Having said that, I normally use a Leupold VX-6 HD 1-6x. I find the eyebox slightly better and the weight being exactly 7oz better with the only negative being lack of daylight-bright dot in the reticle.
Of the other scopes mentioned by others above, I'd give a +1 to the Trijicon 1-8 and the CMORE C3 (with the enos discount). In my opinion the clarity of glass on each of those is on par with the Razor. If you really want 1-8x - that Trijicon is nice and comes VERY highly endorsed by several people I know who consider it an upgrade from the Razor. The Accupower I looked at didn't have any issue with thick reticle ... the center cross is pretty thick at .75 MOA ... but you'd never hold on the center cross at anything > 250 yards ... you'd be down in the .25 MOA stadia lines which would cover ~1 inch at 400 yards. I'm looking at it on Strelok and it looks pretty nice at distance ... I'll attach a snapshot of an AC plate at 480 yards with both an Accupower and a Razor MOA. Based on what I'm seeing and the subtensions, the Vortex Razor has thicker reticle (.5 MOA) than the Accupower, so you may want to confirm what you read about the Trijicon being ridiculously thick since it's half the thickness of the Razor.
btw, if you are comparing scopes, I'd highly recommend Strelok pro - you can visualize the reticle before you buy and get your holds based on various bullets and external ballistics.
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In my experience from Least repeatable accuracy to Most repeatable accuracy:
1. FAL
2. G3
3. M14
4. quality AR10
I dont like the AR platform but I have to admit from an accuracy and competition standpoint the AR's are hard to beat.
The problem comes down to hot barrel behavior.
My FAL's (STG58 types) tend to get hot faster and string up and to the left or right. FAL accuracy can also be affected by which side of the magazine it is stripping the round off of.
My 12" G3K clones typically perform with the same or better accuracy than my 18" FAL's out to 200 yards. They have a thicker and more rigid barrel profile. After 200 its a shotgun blast. The 18" G3's are more accurate and can hit well out to 300 but I prefer a M14 for distances over 200.
If you can find a PTR with AW serial number under maybe 2500 it may have a Wilson barrel, which has closer to a medium profile, and in my experience has the best combination of accuracy and the ability to run surplus ammo. AW2500 to AW8000 were made with a tighter chamber and fewer, shallower flutes which was an attempt to improve accuracy, but also required the use of Tula or American Eagle, and no surplus.
I can typically shoot the M14's out 400 yds with consistent effect. I used a standard weight Criterion 22" barrel or a medium profile 19" Bula barrel. 168 gr FGMM, an adjustible Schuster gas plug and Sadlak tin coated piston are all inexpensive upgrades that can help your accuracy.
Nothing can come close to keeping up with my shooting buddy's LaRue OBR
Sadly Heavy Metal matches are going away in my region so its become irrelevant for me.
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I shoot a G29 in IDPA and at times have shot a G20 in 3gun. I have a significant amount of factory and reloaded rounds through two G29's.
I shoot a G30 in GSSF and (now) only occasionally in IDPA. I previously shot a G30 almost exclusively, in IDPA. I shoot a G41 in 3gun. I have a significant amount of factory and reloaded rounds through two G30's.
All my 10mm and 45acp Glocks are Gen 4 guns.
My daughter shoots a Gen5 G17 in IDPA, 3gun and GSSF.
I have several Glocks and bought KKM barrels for some of my 10mm and 45acp Glocks.
I have experienced problems with factory loaded, plated bullets tumbling and keyholing out of my 10mm Glocks. I have not experienced these problems in any caliber other than 10mm, or using KKM barrels, or using jacketed bullets.
I also experienced problems with factory 10mm brass splitting, with a much higher frequency using OEM barrels but on a limited basis with the KKM barrels. I believe this was a brass problem.
I use only KKM barrels with factory or reloaded jacketed bullets in my 10mm Glocks.
In my other Glocks I use OEM barrels and jacketed or plated ammunition, with no problems.
This is relevant especially because the OP is asking about 40S&W in a G35. 40 and 10 use the same bullets and probably the same barrel ID.
YMMV
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If training for USPSA at an IDPA match is your goal:
1. As much as your local IDPA club will tolerate, shoot the IDPA match like you would USPSA
2. take the PE's
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Bought a LaRue Stealth barrel and a SLR adjustable gas block.
Will a Geissele MK4 or MK8 rail fit over the gas block with enough clearance to reliably avoid contact?
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I play the IDPA game because it is better training and practice than Not playing the IDPA game
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I had a Trijicon RMR on a G29 for a few thousand rounds of 10mm SigAmmo. Had another RMR on a G20. Same ammo, fewer rounds.
As semi-auto recoil goes, that's pretty stout.
One of the RMR's got repurposed to a G3K clone that I use for short range HM 3gun matches. Not a ton of rounds through this setup (not a lot of HM match availability) but again this is a rifle that is pretty tough on optics. Not just for recoil but also for that big hunk of BCG metal slamming forward, too.
No issues with the RMRs
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I am not a competition god
Actually I am not that good at all
From watching and participating in a lot of IDPA and 3gun competitions it is My Opinion that beginner and intermediate shooters benefit more from spending time and money on training and practice.
Advanced and expert shooters benefit more from gear upgrades and improved techniques.
The trick is knowing when it is time to make the transition.
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5 hours ago, SeattleDude said:
To each its own, but for the game of 3 gun anything over 6x is an overkill. I would say save a little bit and buy a used Razor (you can find them used for around 1k)
IMO Clarity of the glass is much more important then magnification.
8x over 6x will not make you more accurate or faster or win you matches.
The problem is that the targets keep getting smaller it seems.
The greater magnification makes it faster to find the target and easier to "aim small".
I used to shoot HM with irons and I switched to optics not because of missing but because of not being able to locate the target quickly between shots.
I shot last Saturday using my 4x and then with a friend's 20x. Guess which scope allowed me to register bullseye hits faster and with greater consistency.
I agree at some point magnification (especially in competition) does "fall off a cliff". But I don't think it's between 6x and 8x.
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16 minutes ago, gerritm said:
You will be fine with the Viper. My granddaughter has shot it for over a year and loves it. I have shot it, so has my son. We have gone out to 600 yards with it. Not an issue or problem.
Now not to change your mind, but take a look at the Burris XTR 1x8. I have been shooting mine for 3 years with not a single change in zero. Glass is as good or better than the Viper. Capped or uncapped turrets. I have the ballistic dot reticle which is very close to the Razor. Dot is super bright 2MOA. Midway has them on sale for $563.Lifetime warranty.
Just a thought. https://ads.midwayusa.com/product/1017280975?pid=867539
gerritm
Thank you for your response.
I did check out the Burris a few times and it does appeal to me from the standpoint that it is a 1-8.
I typically check optics reviews on both Midway and Optics Planet and I got a little scared off by the higher percentage of negative reviews for the XTR vs. the Viper.
I absolutely believe yours has worked well for you but considering that this scope will spend its life getting dumped into barrels I would feel better taking the pessimistic approach, and going with the Viper.
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I shoot a lot of my IDPA club matches with my carry rig and carry gun. The 2 main exceptions are that I almost always substitute a 2 mag pouch (typically belt pouch vs. IWB for carry), and I remove my weaponlight.
Occassionally I will keep the light installed and shoot NFC.
Considering that I carry and shoot most Tier 1 matches with a G29 in CCP, with reloads to SigAmmo carry spec (to match my carry ammo) no one is worried about me winning!
Vortex Viper ?? vs. Strike Eagle vs. Razor
in Rifle - Technical
Posted · Edited by chauncey
Thanks, now I am even more pissed
What are you on the payroll? It was 3 threads. There are multiple positive reviews, and I have a negative one. It's a free country (well, maybe not, these days) but reader's still have the opportunity to draw their own conclusions.
If you feel my input is excessive or unfair, then pull my posts or cancel my privileges.
I get pissed being a beta tester. And I came on the pre-eminent 3gun forum to get purchasing advise and when the product sucked right out of the box, to complain about it.
I ordered a Steiner P4xi and if that sucks too, I'll post about it in several threads where the product is discussed, unless my privileges are revoked by then.
On second thought, please delete all my posts and nuke my forum membership.
Have a nice day.