Learning to call your shot?

[Alan Adamson]

I searched and could never figure out the right set of strings to find a good batch of discussion on this topic.

I'm a C Limited and soon to be a C open shooter. While different sight views, I have the problem with either.

I've never learned to call my shot. I know what it means, but now I'm figuring I'll never make it to B until I master this skill. So, with that said.

There must be some good drills that can help master this?

I've done the self analysis and know that I'm not flinching, I probably have a bit of recoil control push, but it's not a flinch. Groups stay close together on relatively fast splits (I'm a C class shooter remember). Both eyes are open and watching the sights lift and fall, but I simply don't attach the break to the point of aim with the brain enough to register *what* I just hit.

I'm not looking for instant results, I'm sure I'll have to put some effort, time, etc into this, but it's time to break this habit before it becomes too ingrained.

As one other piece of info, I only shot for about 8 months total and all of that was limited, I just picked up an open gun a at the end of the year and have only shot it in 2 outdoor matches.

Ok, now you know me, basically, so care to help me understand what I can do to learn this skill?

Thanks,

Alan

[Jman]

Start here. Good stuff.

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14025

Jim

[G-ManBart]

I've done the self analysis and know that I'm not flinching, I probably have a bit of recoil control push, but it's not a flinch. Groups stay close together on relatively fast splits (I'm a C class shooter remember). Both eyes are open and watching the sights lift and fall, but I simply don't attach the break to the point of aim with the brain enough to register *what* I just hit.

I'm certainly not the world's expert here, but are you absolutely 100% sure you're not blinking? I had a boss who was an instructor and one day one of the other instructors told him he was blinking on every shot (and shooting well). He was the one telling me about this and he said "I told them they were crazy...until they pulled out the video camera".

I'm assuming you're getting some misses that you can't quite explain, or D's that you didn't realize were out there. Is there a pattern to those shots (again, assuming that's the case) like on targets at certain distances, or closely spaced targets, the second shot on a target before a long transition to another target???

When I start to feel my timing, dot/front sight tracking, shot calling are getting sloppy I like to run some bill drills and really focus on shooting a tight group of A's. I'll do them at progressively longer ranges so it's not just straight blasting. R,

[Jadeslade]

+1 to what G-man says. I found out over the last couple of months that if I do not shoot every day, the seeing of shots gets less precise. So on days I do not shoot at the range, I am making sure that I get some dry fire in of calling shots, moving my eyes back and forth from target to target. To me, it is really like shooting foul shots or a jump shots in basketball. Some guys look at front rim, some guys look at back rim, some guys don't know what they look at, but the really good shooters know exactly what they are looking at and what they want to see. It will come. A lot of repetitions.

[Alan Adamson]

I'm certainly not the world's expert here, but are you absolutely 100% sure you're not blinking? I had a boss who was an instructor and one day one of the other instructors told him he was blinking on every shot (and shooting well). He was the one telling me about this and he said "I told them they were crazy...until they pulled out the video camera".

To be honest, not 100% sure... With that said, tho, I know that I shoot fairly consistently with both eyes open and staying open thru the shot(s) - I watch the sights lift and fall, and or the dot move around. The odd thing is, and I hope this is a first indication that shot call is kinda working... After I Shoot a stage, I know exactly where I had a mike or a delta, but my brain doesn't register it quick enough to make it up while in the instant of shooting that target.

Yesterday for example. I was shooting open at an outdoor match. It was the classifier (I had shot a completely clean match to that point and this was the last stage). Unfortunately, I was up to go first, is was CM08-03 (six). I shot 4A 1C 1M in 3.91 and as soon as I was done, I said, there is a Mike on that first target, it flew over the upper right shoulder. Had I not made that mistake, that time would have been a high B classifier, as it will turn out, it won't count. And to make matters worse, it was a comstock classifier because of the steel.

So, I've got to acquire this learned skill. Its becoming very apparent that it's 100% necessary to any progress. I suppose on the good news side of this conversation, as soon as it comes to me, I'll probably reach a new level of shooting (thereby looking for the next challenge to overcome - quickening the pace I'm sure).

Lastly to the question of eyes open, or not... I do know there are times when shooting open in a confined area, that the percussion will cause me to blink... It doesn't happen every time, but I do know there are times when it happens. I work on that by RO'ing as many open shooters as I can, and forcing myself to keep my eyes open while they are shooting in those same confined areas. It seems concentrating on their gun, etc, while acting as RO, helps me drill with a similar concentration level as when I'm shooting that area.

I appreciate the comments so far... I'm still pouring over them and at first blush it sounds like I need to do 2 things.

a) practice that drill that Brian mentions around par time on n shots and drawing where the shots hit, then determining if thats really where they hit from the actual target - all this while working the par time down

target transition practice - this seems it can be done in dry fire, working to break the first shot at the appropriate location on the target.

c) and this hasn't been discussed yet.... I shot limited for almost a year and my focus there was on the front sight, now with open, I need to focus on the target, not the dot and let the dot come to the point of impact. That's a little different that the way I shot limited. And there are times that I find myself pushing the dot as opposed to leading the dot to where I want it to go.

Thanks again,

Alan

Edited January 18, 2010 by Alan Adamson

[jkatz44]

I'm certainly not the world's expert here, but are you absolutely 100% sure you're not blinking? I had a boss who was an instructor and one day one of the other instructors told him he was blinking on every shot (and shooting well). He was the one telling me about this and he said "I told them they were crazy...until they pulled out the video camera".

To be honest, not 100% sure... With that said, tho, I know that I shoot fairly consistently with both eyes open and staying open thru the shot(s) - I watch the sights lift and fall, and or the dot move around. The odd thing is, and I hope this is a first indication that shot call is kinda working... After I Shoot a stage, I know exactly where I had a mike or a delta, but my brain doesn't register it quick enough to make it up while in the instant of shooting that target.

Yesterday for example. I was shooting open at an outdoor match. It was the classifier (I had shot a completely clean match to that point and this was the last stage). Unfortunately, I was up to go first, is was CM08-03 (six). I shot 4A 1C 1M in 3.91 and as soon as I was done, I said, there is a Mike on that first target, it flew over the upper right shoulder. Had I not made that mistake, that time would have been a high B classifier, as it will turn out, it won't count. And to make matters worse, it was a comstock classifier because of the steel.

So, I've got to acquire this learned skill. Its becoming very apparent that it's 100% necessary to any progress. I suppose on the good news side of this conversation, as soon as it comes to me, I'll probably reach a new level of shooting (thereby looking for the next challenge to overcome - quickening the pace I'm sure).

Lastly to the question of eyes open, or not... I do know there are times when shooting open in a confined area, that the percussion will cause me to blink... It doesn't happen every time, but I do know there are times when it happens. I work on that by RO'ing as many open shooters as I can, and forcing myself to keep my eyes open while they are shooting in those same confined areas. It seems concentrating on their gun, etc, while acting as RO, helps me drill with a similar concentration level as when I'm shooting that area.

I appreciate the comments so far... I'm still pouring over them and at first blush it sounds like I need to do 2 things.

a) practice that drill that Brian mentions around par time on n shots and drawing where the shots hit, then determining if thats really where they hit from the actual target - all this while working the par time down

target transition practice - this seems it can be done in dry fire, working to break the first shot at the appropriate location on the target.

c) and this hasn't been discussed yet.... I shot limited for almost a year and my focus there was on the front sight, now with open, I need to focus on the target, not the dot and let the dot come to the point of impact. That's a little different that the way I shot limited. And there are times that I find myself pushing the dot as opposed to leading the dot to where I want it to go.

Thanks again,

Alan

I too am trying to learn the ability to call my shots. I think I am starting to learn it because I know when I shoot a "bad" shot. My problem is I am not focusing on the front sight enough but I am focusing on the targets. Any ideas for me?

[Morgan]

When you're dry fire practicing (you do dry-fire practice, right?), after each run try to REMEMBER where those hits on target would have been. If you don't know, you're not even trying to call the shot.

[lugnut]

I'm a strong B level shooter (at least wrt classifiers) and I can say I don't think it's all white and black. I too am convinced shot calling is a skill that is necessary to advance in this sport but it's not just doing it well or not doing it at all as you learn. I think it's a skill that develops (hopefully for me) over time. I can call shots but NOT the way a higher level shooter probably does- I can call most shots during slow fire, and do it during a COF... BUT I'm not calling it to the degree I need. On further shots I can't always discern between an A or C, and movers are much harder. I always watch the sights but can't always match that up with where on the target the shot was when the gun went bang with the accuracy I want. The higher the HF the harder to do it well. I've seen vids of myself and can't see me blinking... but I'm sure I do on occasion. I'm just trying to being honest with myself here... I wish it was really that easy... I think most of it is mental!

If it was easy everyone would be Masters!

[Sam]

I've never learned to call my shot. I know what it means, but now I'm figuring I'll never make it to B until I master this skill. So, with that said.

Alan, I salute you for your commitment to this elusive quest!

It helps me to learn if the problem can be broken down into the lowest common denominator. In this case, that denominator is attention. Where exactly, is my attention at the instant the shot fires.? I put that question in bold type because it is very simple, but also very important to fully understand. Very few people have trained their attention to "be" where it is directed.

G-Man Bart has made a very simple and very important point also. If your eyes aren't open at the moment, you can't see what you need to see.

For example, in order to know where my attention is, I may need to decide where it is not. "Gee? Did I blink?" (I hope it ain't there) "Where is the bullet hole?" (I hope it isn't there either)

OK, where should it be then? If my eyes were open, they were seeing. What happens, happens really fast, so my brain may not comprehend what I saw, and therefore classify it as being of no importance. It is of extreme importance.

This is exactly where my attention needs to be: What did my eyes see at the exact moment the shot broke? It may start as just a hint of movement, the recoil impulse is pretty quick, as most people would count quickness. But, it dang sure happened! My eyes were open, so they dang sure saw what happened!

With full attention, you mind can gradually begin to decode the blur of movement. Eventually, it may even become quite clear. Just hold to the fact that you saw it happen. It was right there, just as certainly as if it was captured on high-speed video. The eyes see everything. The brain has to learn to de-code what the eyes see. The hand is never quicker than the eye, as we have been told. But the hand is always quicker than the untrained mind.

To call the shot. Train the mind.

[Singlestack]

Shot calling begins with seeing what you need to see before you break the shot. You must see the FS/dot clearly before the shot breaks. After you learn to do this, shot calling will come. All the information you need to call the shot has been recorded in your mind. It takes a little time to allow this information to be processed and utilized. When it starts happening, you will start carrying baggage with you as you shoot if you don't see what you need to see on every shot. What I mean by that is, for instance, lets say you have a target array and you don't call every shot. When you move to the next array that uncalled shot will be haunting you and interfering with what you are doing. As BE says, it is faster to know.

I recently made A Limited. I need one more good classifier to make A SS. I was shooting Color Blind (CM99-43) yesterday and I knew I needed a sub 15 second run with all the points to get a +75% score. IIRC, I shot 85 points in 13.96 seconds. It felt slow as hell. I made myself see every shot. I was thinking the whole time I was going to slow. I was shocked when I heard the time. The classifier calculator puts that run at 84.6665%. The reason I am telling you this is the secret to moving up is in that story. See your FS/dot on every shot. Whether or not you remember it at the time you break the shot is not nearly as important as seeing it before the shot breaks, IMO. Processing what you see and correcting it at speed will come, but it will never come if it is not there to process.

[Corey]

i remember seeing Travis tomasie show an exercise on a tv show (shooting usa maybe, idk). put a target out a distance where you cant immediately see the holes. 15, 20, 25 whatever your skil set is. take 2 shots -dbl tap, controlled pair, again whatver you call them. then look away from the target before you see the holes. have a 2nd ipsc target next to you and put two pasters on the target where you think your shots landed. then go check to see how close you were. This should be able to help you see whether your calling them properly or not. if you are getting them pretty regularly, you are calling them, you just need to figure out a way to get urself to call them in the stress of a match and correct any misses on the fly.

hope it helps

[BSeevers]

I think you can make M and not call your shots. Classifiers can be somewhat muscle memoried if that makes sense.

I know you can't win consistantly or shoot at high levels in any class, without shot calling.

G. David Tubb can call a rifle hit at 600 yds in competition, I mean like if its an inch to the right.

That's the level to strive for. For me shot calling had to be a progression. You are striving to allow your brain to process information based on a "picture" that is probably happening in like what a ten thousanth of a second?(since its light maybe faster? I dont know/care, how fast are neurons?)

I think its a process like driving. First you learn how to brake, shift etc. Then later you can drift through a unknown corner at 9/10ths. But he is an important point. Your body needs to keep up so there's no shortcuts. Ya gotta do the drills, dryfire, livefire, matches, etc.

I guess remember the final goal and work towards it. Practice eye drills. start paying attention. Do you see the fire in front of the gun? Do you see the brass? Thats not the goal but sometimes it "wakes up" people to how little they see or input.

Awareness can be a B$%@. If you start letting it become part of your everyday life you can get a little frustrated with people bumping into you at the store, people around you that take 10 seconds to see an "alligator" and the like.

[pjb45]

There are a couple of different approaches to get you where you need to be. A few years ago, Don Golembieski told me "know where your front sight is when your break your shot."

So a couple times last week, I used those 3X5 yellow post it notes on a target to shoot some groups. I did this at a couple of different distances. I started to notice/feel as the shot was breaking exactly where the shot was going to be. The one thing that helped more than anything was getting a very sharp focus on the front sight. The yellow post it was blurry but the front sight was sharp.

Background: There reason I brought this up is I am right handed and shoot with both eyes open with my left eye being dominant. To make matters worse, see in mono-vision, with the dominant eye usually for distance. I have to use a lower power contact in the dominant eye to get a decent focus on the front sight. So I thought I would try closing my left eye and use my non-dominant near focus eye for shooting.

To make a long story even longer, I did not have to see the holes in the post it to know where the bullet went. The sharp focus on the front sight as the shot broke told me exactly where the bullet went.

Calling your shot begins with trigger control. BE was kind enough to work on a Tips from the GM article in Frontsight whose theme was align the sights and breaking the shot with disturbing the sight alignment.

I would recommend putting multiple post it notes on a target and try shooting some groups. Pay attention to the sight picture as each shot breaks. Start at a close distance and move out. Try doing 3 or 4 shots per draw. Repeat 1,000 times.

[el pres]

It helps me to learn if the problem can be broken down into the lowest common denominator. In this case, that denominator is attention. Where exactly, is my attention at the instant the shot fires.? I put that question in bold type because it is very simple, but also very important to fully understand. Very few people have trained their attention to "be" where it is directed.

I am by far no Master shot caller but this is exactly what I wanted to say. Of coarse the best explanation, as usual, already came from Sam.

Aside from the obvious like open eyes, it's not what you see but what you have registered in your brain as happened. It's still difficult to describe but you cant just stare hard at the front sight. That is actualy taking away from paying attention to what is happening.

Edited January 18, 2010 by P.Pres

[jkatz44]

Shot calling begins with seeing what you need to see before you break the shot. You must see the FS/dot clearly before the shot breaks. After you learn to do this, shot calling will come. All the information you need to call the shot has been recorded in your mind. It takes a little time to allow this information to be processed and utilized. When it starts happening, you will start carrying baggage with you as you shoot if you don't see what you need to see on every shot. What I mean by that is, for instance, lets say you have a target array and you don't call every shot. When you move to the next array that uncalled shot will be haunting you and interfering with what you are doing. As BE says, it is faster to know.

I recently made A Limited. I need one more good classifier to make A SS. I was shooting Color Blind (CM99-43) yesterday and I knew I needed a sub 15 second run with all the points to get a +75% score. IIRC, I shot 85 points in 13.96 seconds. It felt slow as hell. I made myself see every shot. I was thinking the whole time I was going to slow. I was shocked when I heard the time. The classifier calculator puts that run at 84.6665%. The reason I am telling you this is the secret to moving up is in that story. See your FS/dot on every shot. Whether or not you remember it at the time you break the shot is not nearly as important as seeing it before the shot breaks, IMO. Processing what you see and correcting it at speed will come, but it will never come if it is not there to process.

Good point. Thanks! :cheers:

[benos]

An "all forums" thread title only search for "call shot" turned up these threads:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...te=%2Bcall+shot

be

[Alan Adamson]

The reason this forum is so great - it's all the great people that contribute... Thanks everyone and especially Brian for all the words of wisdom and help.

Great job, now I have lots to think, apply, ponder, probably scratch my head about, but mostly have fun with.

Be safe all,

Alan

Edited January 19, 2010 by Alan Adamson

[Allgoodhits]

We use the term "learn to call shots" but I am not sure that is what we actually mean, or maybe more accurately what we are really trying to do. In perhaps better words I don't think we learn to call our shots. I think we "discover that now we are able to call our shots". Thus a discovered ability, not exactly a learned skill.

Maybe too deep for our own good, but I believe that calling shots is merely a by product of learning to do others things then recalling that which you saw, then comparing what you recall seeing with that which actually happened. If the outcome, does not match the call, then either the call was bad, or the fiream or ammo failed.

Thirty plus years ago a comment comes to mind pertaining to improving one's shooting. If all else fails, camp out on the front sight and (then the term was) s q w e e z e the t r i g g e r. In time with proper attention, focus and recall the positioning of the front-rear sight or dot and relationship with target will be remembered as the shot fires and the muzzle lifts. When recall of the image matches the outcome at the target, you have called the shot.

I can not tell you when the first time I actually called a shot - properly. But vividly remember one of the first times. This was shooting one day late and it was almost dark. Probably too dark to be doing what I was trying to do, that being shooting a Model 10 S&W (horrible fixed sights) at an NRA B27 (black silhouette) target. On a good day this is difficult, since the sights are black and the target is black, so alignment light space is minimal. To that add near darkness, almost impossible. To get to the point, when the shot fired the muzzle flash completely illuminated my image of the sights and the target, almost like flash photography. I had that picture of the sights, pretty well aligned just under the X in the X ring. When I went down to examine the target, that is where the bullet hole was. From that day on, I was totally aware of the DISCOVERY of calling my shots. I don't think I learned to do this, I discovered it as a by product of fundamentals and follow through.

..that's my story as I call it!

Good Luck in the quest,

Martin

[Flyin40]

I think you can make M and not call your shots. Classifiers can be somewhat muscle memoried if that makes sense.

I know you can't win consistantly or shoot at high levels in any class, without shot calling.

Bill is right on the money. I'm living proof of the above quote. Without getting into too much here I looked at shooting differently than most. I worked on all the other skils sets first and when I felt I was a good around shooter I started working on accuracy which was last yr. I did pretty well doing it this way. I tried working on accuracy but I never really decided to make it a priority. All my range time had been spent practicing shooting on the move, position work and everything else except accuracy. Don't get me wrong, I was trying to shoot A's and did pretty good job most of the time. Then a stage will come up and noshoot-mike then a couple of stages later, mike-mike.

Just like the above quote my point is that you can do well without calling your shots but at some point you must learn to call your shots. If you don't you'll be inconsistant. You will have a good match or stage then the next one you'll tank.

Learn to call your shots

Flyin

[jkatz44]

I think you can make M and not call your shots. Classifiers can be somewhat muscle memoried if that makes sense.

I know you can't win consistantly or shoot at high levels in any class, without shot calling.

Bill is right on the money. I'm living proof of the above quote. Without getting into too much here I looked at shooting differently than most. I worked on all the other skils sets first and when I felt I was a good around shooter I started working on accuracy which was last yr. I did pretty well doing it this way. I tried working on accuracy but I never really decided to make it a priority. All my range time had been spent practicing shooting on the move, position work and everything else except accuracy. Don't get me wrong, I was trying to shoot A's and did pretty good job most of the time. Then a stage will come up and noshoot-mike then a couple of stages later, mike-mike.

Just like the above quote my point is that you can do well without calling your shots but at some point you must learn to call your shots. If you don't you'll be inconsistant. You will have a good match or stage then the next one you'll tank.

Learn to call your shots

Flyin

Here is just my $.02. I think that in order to "call your shots" you have to have a precise sight picture and really focus on the front sight. Really notice how the front sight tracks; up and back down. If you are very focused on that front sight, you will "see" in a split second where the front sight was when the shot broke. What also helped me is by not really focusing on the rear sight. Only if I think the shot is pretty hard, I will then consider the rear sight in my sight picture.

P.S. Sorry if I confused you. I don't explain these things to good. lol.

[BSeevers]

I think you can make M and not call your shots. Classifiers can be somewhat muscle memoried if that makes sense.

I know you can't win consistantly or shoot at high levels in any class, without shot calling.

Bill is right on the money. I'm living proof of the above quote. Without getting into too much here I looked at shooting differently than most. I worked on all the other skils sets first and when I felt I was a good around shooter I started working on accuracy which was last yr. I did pretty well doing it this way. I tried working on accuracy but I never really decided to make it a priority. All my range time had been spent practicing shooting on the move, position work and everything else except accuracy. Don't get me wrong, I was trying to shoot A's and did pretty good job most of the time. Then a stage will come up and noshoot-mike then a couple of stages later, mike-mike.

Just like the above quote my point is that you can do well without calling your shots but at some point you must learn to call your shots. If you don't you'll be inconsistant. You will have a good match or stage then the next one you'll tank.

Learn to call your shots

Flyin

Here is just my $.02. I think that in order to "call your shots" you have to have a precise sight picture and really focus on the front sight. Really notice how the front sight tracks; up and back down. If you are very focused on that front sight, you will "see" in a split second where the front sight was when the shot broke. What also helped me is by not really focusing on the rear sight. Only if I think the shot is pretty hard, I will then consider the rear sight in my sight picture.

P.S. Sorry if I confused you. I don't explain these things to good. lol.

I have disagree wholeheartly. Shot calling is knowing where your shot impacts at that exact moment it breaks. Even if your sights are misaligned you call the shot. That's why you see a good shot caller makeup a miss in .15 second.

Now you are doing a good thing. You are aiming on every shot which is the prelude to becoming a great shooter. There is more.

The more is you can shoot faster with less of a precise focused sight picture if you are calling your shots. As you open your awareness you see more and shoot faster. Nothing personal just trying to help. I believe you are in a great position to make a leap forward. You are way ahead of the local SPEED demon. He's fast. You know him. Sometimes wins stages over the M's, might even be a M but "crashes and burns" so often it becomes a way of life. Oh that's another different problem but to the point he won't even listen, learn or much less change. He doesn't have accuracy as one of his skills.

The issue that John talks about is if you are not calling your shot then you start to shoot faster but start to miss. Shot calling is a skill and needs to be developed, no shortcuts.

Edited January 24, 2010 by BSeevers

[MTBfarms]

Shot calling is a skill and needs to be developed, no shortcuts.

Amen.

+1

Right on.

Now if I can just learn to do it.

[jkatz44]

I think you can make M and not call your shots. Classifiers can be somewhat muscle memoried if that makes sense.

I know you can't win consistantly or shoot at high levels in any class, without shot calling.

Bill is right on the money. I'm living proof of the above quote. Without getting into too much here I looked at shooting differently than most. I worked on all the other skils sets first and when I felt I was a good around shooter I started working on accuracy which was last yr. I did pretty well doing it this way. I tried working on accuracy but I never really decided to make it a priority. All my range time had been spent practicing shooting on the move, position work and everything else except accuracy. Don't get me wrong, I was trying to shoot A's and did pretty good job most of the time. Then a stage will come up and noshoot-mike then a couple of stages later, mike-mike.

Just like the above quote my point is that you can do well without calling your shots but at some point you must learn to call your shots. If you don't you'll be inconsistant. You will have a good match or stage then the next one you'll tank.

Learn to call your shots

Flyin

Here is just my $.02. I think that in order to "call your shots" you have to have a precise sight picture and really focus on the front sight. Really notice how the front sight tracks; up and back down. If you are very focused on that front sight, you will "see" in a split second where the front sight was when the shot broke. What also helped me is by not really focusing on the rear sight. Only if I think the shot is pretty hard, I will then consider the rear sight in my sight picture.

P.S. Sorry if I confused you. I don't explain these things to good. lol.

I have disagree wholeheartly. Shot calling is knowing where your shot impacts at that exact moment it breaks. Even if your sights are misaligned you call the shot. That's why you see a good shot caller makeup a miss in .15 second.

Now you are doing a good thing. You are aiming on every shot which is the prelude to becoming a great shooter. There is more.

The more is you can shoot faster with less of a precise focused sight picture if you are calling your shots. As you open your awareness you see more and shoot faster. Nothing personal just trying to help. I believe you are in a great position to make a leap forward. You are way ahead of the local SPEED demon. He's fast. You know him. Sometimes wins stages over the M's, might even be a M but "crashes and burns" so often it becomes a way of life. Oh that's another different problem but to the point he won't even listen, learn or much less change. He doesn't have accuracy as one of his skills.

The issue that John talks about is if you are not calling your shot then you start to shoot faster but start to miss. Shot calling is a skill and needs to be developed, no shortcuts.

Thanks Bill! I appreciate all of the information you are giving me. The above bolded sentence is what my problem is. I need to learn to call my shots to be successful in the long term.

P.S. Bill, what exactly do you mean by opening my awareness?

Edited January 25, 2010 by jkatz44

[BSeevers]

I think you can make M and not call your shots. Classifiers can be somewhat muscle memoried if that makes sense.

I know you can't win consistantly or shoot at high levels in any class, without shot calling.

Bill is right on the money. I'm living proof of the above quote. Without getting into too much here I looked at shooting differently than most. I worked on all the other skils sets first and when I felt I was a good around shooter I started working on accuracy which was last yr. I did pretty well doing it this way. I tried working on accuracy but I never really decided to make it a priority. All my range time had been spent practicing shooting on the move, position work and everything else except accuracy. Don't get me wrong, I was trying to shoot A's and did pretty good job most of the time. Then a stage will come up and noshoot-mike then a couple of stages later, mike-mike.

Just like the above quote my point is that you can do well without calling your shots but at some point you must learn to call your shots. If you don't you'll be inconsistant. You will have a good match or stage then the next one you'll tank.

Learn to call your shots

Flyin

Here is just my $.02. I think that in order to "call your shots" you have to have a precise sight picture and really focus on the front sight. Really notice how the front sight tracks; up and back down. If you are very focused on that front sight, you will "see" in a split second where the front sight was when the shot broke. What also helped me is by not really focusing on the rear sight. Only if I think the shot is pretty hard, I will then consider the rear sight in my sight picture.

P.S. Sorry if I confused you. I don't explain these things to good. lol.

I have disagree wholeheartly. Shot calling is knowing where your shot impacts at that exact moment it breaks. Even if your sights are misaligned you call the shot. That's why you see a good shot caller makeup a miss in .15 second.

Now you are doing a good thing. You are aiming on every shot which is the prelude to becoming a great shooter. There is more.

The more is you can shoot faster with less of a precise focused sight picture if you are calling your shots. As you open your awareness you see more and shoot faster. Nothing personal just trying to help. I believe you are in a great position to make a leap forward. You are way ahead of the local SPEED demon. He's fast. You know him. Sometimes wins stages over the M's, might even be a M but "crashes and burns" so often it becomes a way of life. Oh that's another different problem but to the point he won't even listen, learn or much less change. He doesn't have accuracy as one of his skills.

The issue that John talks about is if you are not calling your shot then you start to shoot faster but start to miss. Shot calling is a skill and needs to be developed, no shortcuts.

Thanks Bill! I appreciate all of the information you are giving me. The above bolded sentence is what my problem is. I need to learn to call my shots to be successful in the long term.

P.S. Bill, what exactly do you mean by opening my awareness?

Ok here we go. For most people they need to see "more" to have the ability to call your shots. Awareness is what this is. Its more than just seeing the sight. You need to be "aware" of more to shoot better. Don't take this literal but seeing is like reading the script of a movie and awareness is like watching/listening to the movie.

Some of the simplest things are so hard to verbalize.

To get the awareness you need to train yourself.

[Chris iliff]

I am in Flyin40's camp. I have done just about what he is saying in his posts, the only thing I will add is that Bill Drills really helped me on my shot calling. Not that I have it down 100% of the time. Sometimes I think it helps me to do something just as fast as I possibly can, eventhough I may not see everything,...... with enough repititions I start too.

As an aside: I use to run a lot and the following conversation among runners I heard hundreds of times, it goes....."I just can't seem to run fast what can I do to increase my speed?" Answer: Practice running fast!