motorcycle_dan Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 (edited) Initially I was thinking to compete with the G34 but I think it better for me to stick with a revolver. I do not have any gear for this revolver. It is a Ruger GP100 6" Stainless. I can shoot it quite accurate at 50yd so feel that is the way to go. Since I don't currently have any sort of holster, belt, etc. I will need to purchase a complete rig. I have a CR speed rig used for USPSA but realize that is not for production. My question, What is the best, fastest, and key word LEGAL for production holster. I don't want to show up at the cup and be told I'm in Metalic class due to xxxxxx. Looking for brand name gear that will work well with the revolver. Next, is a CR Speed type hi-torq velcro belt legal for production? Having failed my diet program I have a little extra love handle flab between the belt and the little extra distance helps. Does Blade tech make a DOH holster for 6" revolvers? Would that be legal? What will I need as far as speed loader and storage of extra rounds? Can I carry a shooting gear box with me (Like coach Sweeny does for steel plate at circleville) when on the line? I do not expect to win my first time out but I would like to know I shot my best possible. Edited December 22, 2009 by motorcycle_dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan550 Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I'm sure others will chime in on the holster part of your question, but as for the "shooting box" on the line part, YES! Most revolver shooters carry a loading tray/box on the line from which to reload. The belt is OK to use as well, and there are Kydex-type holsters that work fine. I've seen several for the 686 S&W revolvers and they even lube the inside for a faster draw! Alan~^~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Not sure about the CR rig, they may be considered not daily carry. DOH holster I think is out as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADR Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 The Blade Tech "Dropped and Offset" holster is OK. I used it last year at the cup and its a popular holster among other Production Division competitors. The revolver holster design is similar to old Jordan or Threepersons style leather holsters except the DOH covers the trigger and instead of a retention strap it uses adjustable tension screws to dial in a lower or higher level of handgun security. On some episodes of the old TV series "Adam-12" LAPD officers Molloy and Reed carried S&W K-38's in holsters of similar design (along with the lamented "clamshell" design). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 DOH in, is good. Good holsters and they are a reasonable price. Learn something everyday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorcycle_dan Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 DOH is good. Okay, right after the holidays, I'll be ordering some gear. Someone recommend a supplier of... Blade Tech, The Belt rig, I'd like to get the "best price" but don't mind spending a little extra to support things like Brian's forums or other supporters. Send me a PM or post here with recommendations. Still not sure about the removing of the Single action notch in my revolver. I shoot it only DA but have issues with removing it. Just put an RCBS trigger scale on my Rooger. The GP100 DA is over 8lb (8 is max on my scale and that didn't even start the hammer coming back) Single action however is just under 3 lbs. I got to say I don't think the rule is very fair but then again I didn't write them. My revolver still has the tape on it from the DR and Harry Reeves match this summer at Camp Perry. I did speak with my gunsmith and ask if he could increase the SA pull. He said I'm the only person to EVER ask for such work. I'm still tossing the idea of DAO mod which would allow a much lighter DA but is that in the spirit of the rules? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Action Pistolero Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I would suggest just buying another hammer but I just checked Brownells and they don't show it. If it was a 686 a new hammer would be $44. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWFAN Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 For your gear, I would check with Speed Shooter Specialties, Freedom Guns Works or some of the other places listed in the Vendor area. Freedom has what I need in stock so I wont have to wait 2+ weeks for Blade-Tech to ship. A DOH for your Ruger might be a special order from BT though. They probably have it for your Glock if you go that route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griz Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 My understanding is if you need new fire control parts in a Ruger, you have to send the gun back to Ruger... And they are going to undo any work you have done and charge you for it. That is a major reason that you don't see many competitive shooters using Rugers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted December 25, 2009 Share Posted December 25, 2009 My understanding is if you need new fire control parts in a Ruger, you have to send the gun back to Ruger... And they are going to undo any work you have done and charge you for it. That is a major reason that you don't see many competitive shooters using Rugers. Ah! the advantage of being 9000Miles from AZ. I just call the local Ruger distributor and they get what I want, my gunsmith does the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorcycle_dan Posted January 23, 2010 Author Share Posted January 23, 2010 I've decided to go with the Glock. The main reason is I am able to shoot it much better weak hand than I can DA revolver. Need to get the holster and mag pouches. Any suggestion gear wise? I was thinking Blade Tech double mag pouch but didn't know if there was a better system. On my IPSC rig I use Safariland speed pouches. Not sure that is necessary or legal in production class? I think there is only one stage where you must reload under the clock, correct? What are the rules for mag pouches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Action Pistolero Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 The rules in production only concern the gun and the holster. You can do anything you want with the mags. There are no reloads in any of the 4 Cup events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorcycle_dan Posted January 23, 2010 Author Share Posted January 23, 2010 There are no reloads in any of the 4 Cup events. I must be stoned, I thought the Practical had a section where it was 3 + 3 mandatory reload and another 3 + 3. Pin shoot tonight at a local indoor range. Stoopid hostage pin anyway... If you hit the top of the target pin, it spins on it's center of gravity. The bottom of the pin going forward promptly kicking the hostage forward off the board. Glock shoot tomorrow same range. Aim-Hi New Albany Shooting Range. I need some trigger time with the Glock. The load seems to work great. Montana Gold 124 CMJ over 3.8gr of IMR 700X, chrono's at 1050, locks the slide back each time no problem. Need to print the groups on paper at 50yd yet but other than that, pretty happy with the load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorcycle_dan Posted January 23, 2010 Author Share Posted January 23, 2010 Last question, I have some Glock Magazines with the Aredondo +4 base. Can I use them in production class? If not I need to get some more mags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan550 Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Dan, That would be a "visible external change" so those mags would be out for Production. Alan~^~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Action Pistolero Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Those mags would be in the "gray" area. If you are going to go prone then there would be a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWFAN Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 I hate to bring this up again, but since I have DOH and I see others suggesting it I will. The guys local to me swear up and down that this rule makes the DOH illegal for production. "(I) Holsters must be designed for carry and suitable for everyday use." I know that they dont want to have a list of approved equipment or not, but wouldnt it be prudent to get a ruling from someone before its left up to a rules judge at the Cup? Is there anyone that would confirm the legality? Tom ? My Drop Offset attachment can be removed and the holster worn in a normal high(er) ride fashion. Im pretty sure that most Blade-Tech's are the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Drop Offset and anything that could be even remotely construed as a Competition Holster should be left at home. I suspect anything that would have any clever infinite of micro adjustments for rake, angle and or height would be considered not allowed and therefore OUT. Something that has adjustments for angle where the holster would have to be removed of the belt unscrewed and reaasembled to adjust for comfort would most probably be in. What they are trying to exclude is the easily adjustable position holsters so that you can adjust the crap out of it to suit that particular course of fire, or drop it so far off the belt line that only RoboCop would recognise it. Again this is a work in progress. If you think the idea will give you a significant advantage if you adjusted the whatsit by 1.5degreess then it is out. Just holster up and shoot. So if the Drop Offset attachments are able to be removed do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allgoodhits Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Drop Offset and anything that could be even remotely construed as a Competition Holster should be left at home. I suspect anything that would have any clever infinite of micro adjustments for rake, angle and or height would be considered not allowed and therefore OUT. Something that has adjustments for angle where the holster would have to be removed of the belt unscrewed and reaasembled to adjust for comfort would most probably be in. What they are trying to exclude is the easily adjustable position holsters so that you can adjust the crap out of it to suit that particular course of fire, or drop it so far off the belt line that only RoboCop would recognise it. Again this is a work in progress. If you think the idea will give you a significant advantage if you adjusted the whatsit by 1.5degreess then it is out. Just holster up and shoot. So if the Drop Offset attachments are able to be removed do so. Here we go again. We should not have to speculate, guess or hope that our equipment may or may not be within the spirit of the rules. I, perhaps wrongly, was under the impression that the major holster issue in production were holsters similar to the Safariland Cup Challenge as not being "approved". But the Drop Offset certainly "shouldn't" be a problem. My gosh it resembles a plastic paint bucket, and drawing any 6" gun from a non-open front design is certainly enough of a challenge anyway. The modifying the mags was another interesting question. My guess, would be that no extewrnal mods to the mags would be the rule, but I'm not in charge on that one either. Hey, either way come on out, enjoy the match, it'll all work out. MJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Martin I think the actual holster (paint bucket) is fine, the attachment that drops it X? inches off the belt line is the issue. The holster can be had with a carry type (waist line) belt loop. Therefore that is OK. Damn shame about Kevin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahab Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 A note on holsters - at the '09 Cup, there were shooters using Dropped and Offset holsters in Production class. If I were being a rules lawyer, I'd say that the rule "Holsters must be designed for carry and suitable for everyday use" would eliminate them from consideration. I definitely agree that we shouldn't have to speculate about this sort of thing. The rules did have an addition this year clearly stating that no open front holsters were allowed for Production division. As far as the basepads go, last year I shot The Cup with a Para 18.9 LDA (madness, I know) and a couple of my mags were 21 round mags with a +3 extension. The extension was factory though. If I had to do it again, I would have played it safe and used only standard 18 round magazines. This year I'm shooting with a wheelgun; like many my issue is the with the trigger pull weight. The SA mode on my 627 breaks at 3 lbs from the factory, so I'm not really sure what kinds of modifications are legal to keep this gun in the production division. If I'm reading the rules correctly, I can't bob and polish the hammer spur because that's "visible external", so it's sort of a conundrum on what to do to the gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan550 Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 A note on holsters - at the '09 Cup, there were shooters using Dropped and Offset holsters in Production class. If I were being a rules lawyer, I'd say that the rule "Holsters must be designed for carry and suitable for everyday use" would eliminate them from consideration. I definitely agree that we shouldn't have to speculate about this sort of thing. The rules did have an addition this year clearly stating that no open front holsters were allowed for Production division. As far as the basepads go, last year I shot The Cup with a Para 18.9 LDA (madness, I know) and a couple of my mags were 21 round mags with a +3 extension. The extension was factory though. If I had to do it again, I would have played it safe and used only standard 18 round magazines. This year I'm shooting with a wheelgun; like many my issue is the with the trigger pull weight. The SA mode on my 627 breaks at 3 lbs from the factory, so I'm not really sure what kinds of modifications are legal to keep this gun in the production division. If I'm reading the rules correctly, I can't bob and polish the hammer spur because that's "visible external", so it's sort of a conundrum on what to do to the gun. If you'll go back to some earlier posts, you can remove the single-action notch from the hammer and that's legal since it's not an "external" modification. Alan~^~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahab Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Alan - yeah, that was my plan after reviewing the rules. I could get started on why I should have a production gun worked on to be eligible for this division, but that's already been beaten to death. Back to holsters. Last year's Production division winner, Dave Sevigny used a pretty normal Blade Tech/Comp-Tac/Kydex holster, but not in a dropped and offset rig. Pic here. I used a similar holster then, and plan on using a Blade-Tech for the 627 this year. Ammo carriers are a free for all. I used Blackhawk double stack pouches, because that's what I happened to have. A lot of the wheelgun shooters didn't use any sort of ammo carrier, and just reloaded from their bag. Also, for new shooters: this is a lost brass match. If you're running a wheelgun and would like to keep your brass, I'd strongly recommend some kind of dump pouch. Either that or shoot a moonclip gun so that all your little friends come out into your hand at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allgoodhits Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) Martin I think the actual holster (paint bucket) is fine, the attachment that drops it X? inches off the belt line is the issue. The holster can be had with a carry type (waist line) belt loop. Therefore that is OK. Damn shame about Kevin. Kevin will be there. BHO has a plan to cover those situations too! MJ Edited January 25, 2010 by Allgoodhits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Another double! Sandman, That double is just bad Karma for selling stuff in the open forum. (Send Dan a PM.) I'll erase the posts. - Admin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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