reducing powder charges in 45 ACP

[Ohioguy]

I would like to load some spoft shooting loads for the 45 ACP for the wife. I have W231, 800X, and HP-38 (same as 231?)

My Lyman manual states a load of 4.3gr of 231 w/230gr LRN bullets. Velocity is listed at 699fps. I would like to get them down to 600fps or so. Can I drop the starting load to 4.0 without any problems? Been loading on and off for 20 years, but have never gone below a minimum.

[Matt Cheely]

Load lighter bullets.

[Cy Soto]

It is doable although I am sure that you are aware that your accuracy will suffer. You may also want to consider using a lighter recoil spring.

[Ohioguy]

not really concerned with accuracy right now. I have a whole slew of recoil spings, from 9#-16#, so I'll be changing springs.

I'll be loading lighter bullets in the near future. While I was busy getting everything togther, I neglected getting bullets. I thought I could get some locally, but I found that to be impossible.

[JThompson]

not really concerned with accuracy right now. I have a whole slew of recoil spings, from 9#-16#, so I'll be changing springs.

I'll be loading lighter bullets in the near future. While I was busy getting everything togther, I neglected getting bullets. I thought I could get some locally, but I found that to be impossible.

"Not really concerned with accuracy"

That's the wrong approach.........................................

JT

[G-ManBart]

It is doable although I am sure that you are aware that your accuracy will suffer. You may also want to consider using a lighter recoil spring.

Not necessarily. Until it gets so slow that it won't stabilize it's not really a problem. Consider that many black powder loads stabilized a longer, heavier bullet at about that velocity with good accuracy and it may not be an issue at all. It'll really just depend on the individual gun.

I doubt you'll hurt anything by going to 4.0gr, but I'd see how she reacts to 4.3gr since it's unlikely that it's really going to produce 699fps....the books are frequently optimistic.

If not, Matt's idea of dropping down in bullet weight is a good idea. R,

[G-ManBart]

not really concerned with accuracy right now. I have a whole slew of recoil spings, from 9#-16#, so I'll be changing springs.

I'll be loading lighter bullets in the near future. While I was busy getting everything togther, I neglected getting bullets. I thought I could get some locally, but I found that to be impossible.

"Not really concerned with accuracy"

That's the wrong approach.........................................

JT

I'm guessing here, but I think he means he's not concerned with ultimate accuracy. Obviously, it's got to be acceptably accurate for the task at hand....which isn't exactly bullseye 25-50yd duty for a brand new shooter (I know you know that). R,

[Ohioguy]

My wife isn't shooting Bullseye or AP. She is simply getting used to the gun. So no, accuracy at 30' doesn't matter as long as bullets aren't keyholing or missing paper all together. It wouldn't matter if 5" groups were occuring at this point.

I know the velocities will not match the book. I just mentioned them for reference.

[JThompson]

My wife isn't shooting Bullseye or AP. She is simply getting used to the gun. So no, accuracy at 30' doesn't matter as long as bullets aren't keyholing or missing paper all together. It wouldn't matter if 5" groups were occuring at this point.

I know the velocities will not match the book. I just mentioned them for reference.

What I mean is that I would find a load that, runs the gun, is accurate and shoots soft. That way you don't have to go through it all again down the road, plus having her get used to new timing. When I work up a load that's the way I go about it. Ultimately it needs to be accurate or it's of little use and I don't want to have to "relearn" how the gun feels or acts.

Just an FYI

Best,

JT

[briansea2]

I would like to load some spoft shooting loads for the 45 ACP for the wife. I have W231, 800X, and HP-38 (same as 231?)

My Lyman manual states a load of 4.3gr of 231 w/230gr LRN bullets. Velocity is listed at 699fps. I would like to get them down to 600fps or so. Can I drop the starting load to 4.0 without any problems? Been loading on and off for 20 years, but have never gone below a minimum.

I have help a few ladies get into shooting and it seems like it is always the surprise of the "bang" they dislike the most. If you are looking to lessen that, I would try Clays powder. I think I have read that is a good powder for 45. It sure is the softest shooting powder I have ever used by far.

B

[Ohioguy]

4.0gr of 231 was an interesting experiment.

It was a light load, but functioned with a 10# variable rate recoil spring. Ejected cases were consistently thrown to 4 o'clock-distance was hindered by the stall wall, but they were very clear of the gun. It was extremely dirty though. I had a white long sleeve T-Shirt on, and my strong side arm was covered in what looked like soot and unburnt powder.

I had a few failures to go into battery. They stopped about 1/8" from chambering, and a slight push on the rear of the slide sent it home. I changed to grease for lube, changed the recoil spring, added a shok buff, plus the new reloads. I am guessing it might be do to a issue with the reloads?

I shot it in the match that followed, and didn't experience anymore failure to feeds in 70+ rounds, so I am a bit stumped.

lighter bullets will be ordered this week, and a new powder will be picked up as well.

[Chris Keen]

4.0gr of 231 was an interesting experiment.

I had a few failures to go into battery. They stopped about 1/8" from chambering, and a slight push on the rear of the slide sent it home. I changed to grease for lube, changed the recoil spring, added a shok buff, plus the new reloads. I am guessing it might be do to a issue with the reloads?

That's alot of things to change all at one time, then trying to diagnose an issue. Could it have been the grease? It was cold outside today, wasnt it?

[G-ManBart]

I had a few failures to go into battery. They stopped about 1/8" from chambering, and a slight push on the rear of the slide sent it home. I changed to grease for lube, changed the recoil spring, added a shok buff, plus the new reloads. I am guessing it might be do to a issue with the reloads?

I shot it in the match that followed, and didn't experience anymore failure to feeds in 70+ rounds, so I am a bit stumped.

That could be a couple of things. With the lighter recoil spring the slide isn't pushed forward quite as hard. If the extractor is a little snug, or isn't smooth the slide may not close that last little bit with a light spring. Also, make sure the extractor tunnel is clean....a Q-tip soaked in bore solvent will clean it out nicely and there's no need to lube the extractor when you put it back in. Check to see if it's smooth or has any rough spots/burrs on it.

Adding ths shok buff increased the spring rate, so it made the slide close harder....which could be why it ran after that, but it could just be hiding the problem.

It's also possible that the ammo was the issue. Make sure that the bullets aren't touching the rifing at all when you chamber a round. Check to see that your resizing die is cranked all the way down so that it touches the shell plate/holder when the ram is fully raised. Depending on where the brass is coming from, it could have been shot through a gun with a larger chamber and your dies won't quite get that last little bit....various solutions to that, but don't worry until you've checked all the other stuff first. R,

[Ohioguy]

In hindsight, it was alot to change all at once.

The grease I am using is Wilson's, and we were shooting indoors. It was 65 degrees+ so temp i don't think was an issue, though I could be wrong. Its the first time I have used grease on any gun.

I think I'll pull out the shok buff and try just the spring alone. I'll recheck my reloads as well.

Honestly, I haven't stripped it down to the bones yet, so it might have something to do with that as well. It will get stripped down, cleaned, looked over as well as my skills will allow, and we'll try it again.

[Matt Cheely]

Shock buff removal should be #1. I hate those things.

Next is the barrel and chamber were probably VERY dirty with unburnt powder. The other problem with downloading is that you get poor & inconsistent ignition. There is always a point at which the pressure is too low to combust all of the powder.