Accuracy with a 625 v 610? Is there a differenece?

[Classic_jon]

I looked around for this question before I posted so If I missed it I apologize.

I am looking at a revolver for IDPA and am torn between the 625 and the 610 and thought I would ask about the accuracy of both as a bit of a deciding factor, if it is even a factor at all.

I have both the .45 and .40 dies for my Dillon 550 and I mostly shoot .40 out of my Springfield XD but I like the appeal of a revolver as well. I was looking at the 610 since I could load and shoot almost the exact same ammo for both guns but the moonclips for the 610 look like they are definitely more expensive.

I am not looking to purchase one immediately but I would like to plan for the future and start saving up $$ for one. Any assistance in helping to make the decision would be appreciated!

[UW Mitch]

I don't know about inherent accuracy difference, but I've got both. If you're already shooting and loading 40 and not shooting any 45, it would be probably more cost efficent to get the 610. Same bullets and powder, just get some federal small pistol instead of whatever you're using. I've got my same Limited load out of my 4" 610 just switch the primer type. That being said, I think the 45 feels softer for the same power factor. It also provides a bigger target for reloads (the 45 cylinder holes seem HUGE compared to my 610).

~Mitch

[Boats]

It's all but impossible to find the Mechanical accuracy of any handgun without a mechanical rest. So many variables hand held they mask what the potential of the gun is. I do have a couple of accurate Smiths. Old M 1905 6 inch Target shooting Wadcutters is a tight shooter slow fire. Shoot the same target freestyle with my 625 I shoot better scores. I don't know if the 625 is more accurate but I see the sights a whole lot better and that makes all the difference.

My take is there is little difference between the 610 and 625. Moonclips are a real big advantage to me. 625's work real good and are economical to shoot.

Boats

[Viggen]

Accuracy between a 625 and a 610 is a non-issue, both are 4" guns.

If you run a 625 the reloads will drop smoother and you will be more consistent and likely faster.

If you get a 610 you get to reload 45's - same cost as the 40's.

It just boils down to a coin toss.

[357454]

CJ: I started shooting IDPA with a 4" 610 that had the unfluted cylinder, after just a few thousand rounds I noticed peening of the bolt stop notches on the cylinder. I switched to a 625 and found much less peening. As far as accuracy is concerned the normal range IDPA is shot pretty much negates the necessity for a super accurate gun. I did find reloads were much smoother and quicker with the 625 and my scores improved. I have since sold my 610 and now own several 625s.

[Classic_jon]

CJ: I started shooting IDPA with a 4" 610 that had the unfluted cylinder, after just a few thousand rounds I noticed peening of the bolt stop notches on the cylinder. I switched to a 625 and found much less peening. As far as accuracy is concerned the normal range IDPA is shot pretty much negates the necessity for a super accurate gun. I did find reloads were much smoother and quicker with the 625 and my scores improved. I have since sold my 610 and now own several 625s.

I am trying to learn here so a couple of questions

Do you think that the peening was the pressure of 10mm loads, just that particular batch of revolvers, or indicative of that model revolver as a whole? I am asking because I thought they were based on the same/similar frame.

I know the 45 is a lower pressure cartrige than the 40/10mm but I figured the N frame would be able to handle it seeing as how, if I remember correctly, that it is used for the 44mag as well.

I also never really thought about the 45 round being that much larger in the cylinder and making a reload easier....hmmmm...

Does it make that much difference in the speed of reload between the two calibers?

[Viggen]

I also never really thought about the 45 round being that much larger in the cylinder and making a reload easier....hmmmm...

Does it make that much difference in the speed of reload between the two calibers?

The speed of the reload can be the same between the 625 and 610. The difference is going to be in consistency. The 610 has a lot more real estate between the holes than a 625 and that makes a great landing spot for the inbound ammo - not all the time but it does happen.

As to the peening mentioned by CJ - chalk it up as S&W. That's the way it's going to be. Shooting matches and going fast will eventually wear revolvers parts. You just have to pay attention to what is happening and changing, and stay on top of them. S&W doesn't put any more quality into a gun than it has to, but they do provide a basic platform to work with. If you get a new one, start by deburring and knocking off the sharp edges, chamfer the charge holes, the basics. Do a search in the revolver forum, there is a lot of good information to be gained. Look at the things Bubber, Carmoney, and others have written over the years.

For your stated purpose, IDPA, my preference would be the 625 although the 610 might be considered sexier by some folks.

[Classic_jon]

I also never really thought about the 45 round being that much larger in the cylinder and making a reload easier....hmmmm...

Does it make that much difference in the speed of reload between the two calibers?

The speed of the reload can be the same between the 625 and 610. The difference is going to be in consistency. The 610 has a lot more real estate between the holes than a 625 and that makes a great landing spot for the inbound ammo - not all the time but it does happen.

As to the peening mentioned by CJ - chalk it up as S&W. That's the way it's going to be. Shooting matches and going fast will eventually wear revolvers parts. You just have to pay attention to what is happening and changing, and stay on top of them. S&W doesn't put any more quality into a gun than it has to, but they do provide a basic platform to work with. If you get a new one, start by deburring and knocking off the sharp edges, chamfer the charge holes, the basics. Do a search in the revolver forum, there is a lot of good information to be gained. Look at the things Bubber, Carmoney, and others have written over the years.

For your stated purpose, IDPA, my preference would be the 625 although the 610 might be considered sexier by some folks.

The only reason I even considered the 610 was because I already load a lot of .40 and it would simplify logistics in that I could bring both guns and use the same ammo. the small pistol primers for the .40 also make life easier as well in that I would not have to flip back and forth as much on my press.

The flip side though is that there are a LOT more 625's out there than there are 610's and a ton of load info on a tried and true round in the .45

[Viggen]

I also never really thought about the 45 round being that much larger in the cylinder and making a reload easier....hmmmm...

Does it make that much difference in the speed of reload between the two calibers?

The speed of the reload can be the same between the 625 and 610. The difference is going to be in consistency. The 610 has a lot more real estate between the holes than a 625 and that makes a great landing spot for the inbound ammo - not all the time but it does happen.

As to the peening mentioned by CJ - chalk it up as S&W. That's the way it's going to be. Shooting matches and going fast will eventually wear revolvers parts. You just have to pay attention to what is happening and changing, and stay on top of them. S&W doesn't put any more quality into a gun than it has to, but they do provide a basic platform to work with. If you get a new one, start by deburring and knocking off the sharp edges, chamfer the charge holes, the basics. Do a search in the revolver forum, there is a lot of good information to be gained. Look at the things Bubber, Carmoney, and others have written over the years.

For your stated purpose, IDPA, my preference would be the 625 although the 610 might be considered sexier by some folks.

The only reason I even considered the 610 was because I already load a lot of .40 and it would simplify logistics in that I could bring both guns and use the same ammo. the small pistol primers for the .40 also make life easier as well in that I would not have to flip back and forth as much on my press.

The flip side though is that there are a LOT more 625's out there than there are 610's and a ton of load info on a tried and true round in the .45

I know this doesn't help but either way you are making a fine choice.

With regard to primers. What runs in your 40 pistol may not run in your 40 revolver - depends on how heavy you run the trigger. If you use Federal primers you can run a lighter trigger on the revolver. Also your power factor may vary between the pistol and revolver, be sure to chorno if you go that route.

Edited September 15, 2009 by Viggen

[Boats]

Two things more. Friend of mine that got me started with a 625 sold it and now shoots a 610 says he loves the gun. And from what I see he shoots it better than he did the 45. Who knows why. Other thing is I figured when starting with a 625 I would use the same loads as with my 1911's. Not so they share almost nothing with the automatic loads. Case is about the only thing thats the same.

Boats

[Joe4d]

how about a 646 ?

[CRDB]

I would not go with a 646 in IDPA at 165+PF they kinda thump, I would go with the 625.

Regards,

DB

[Classic_jon]

I know this doesn't help but either way you are making a fine choice.

With regard to primers. What runs in your 40 pistol may not run in your 40 revolver - depends on how heavy you run the trigger. If you use Federal primers you can run a lighter trigger on the revolver. Also your power factor may vary between the pistol and revolver, be sure to chorno if you go that route.

I have both some CCI and Federal primers and definitely can see that the federals are much softer. I had our local 625 revolver shooter tell me that Federals were the way to go with a revolver.

The friend that showed me how to reload knows how to do a very nice and smooth trigger job on the S&W revolvers. He has done his own and a couple for some of the other club members and is is butter smooth.

[Classic_jon]

I would not go with a 646 in IDPA at 165+PF they kinda thump, I would go with the 625.

Regards,

DB

Thanks for the suggestion and info to you both.

I looked around at the 646 and I like the ability to shoot the 10mm in the 610 as well as the different frame style that is similar to the 625. I also noticed that it seems that S&W is no longer offering the 646 either whereas the 610 is back in limited production.

[DougCarden]

Having had both and competed with both under stress and on the clock, here goes.......The 625 is easier to reload to under stress. If you reload your ammo, both guns will shoot X-ring accuracy out to 50yds.

100yards and out the 610 will kick ass, period. If you are going to shoot pins or kill deer or the like, 610.

If you are going to buy ammo off the shelf, 625.

Both are great guns, and either will be fine for competition.....

Sorry if I didnt make it clear as mud......

DougC

[357454]

CJ: I started shooting IDPA with a 4" 610 that had the unfluted cylinder, after just a few thousand rounds I noticed peening of the bolt stop notches on the cylinder. I switched to a 625 and found much less peening. As far as accuracy is concerned the normal range IDPA is shot pretty much negates the necessity for a super accurate gun. I did find reloads were much smoother and quicker with the 625 and my scores improved. I have since sold my 610 and now own several 625s.

I am trying to learn here so a couple of questions

Do you think that the peening was the pressure of 10mm loads, just that particular batch of revolvers, or indicative of that model revolver as a whole? I am asking because I thought they were based on the same/similar frame.

I know the 45 is a lower pressure cartrige than the 40/10mm but I figured the N frame would be able to handle it seeing as how, if I remember correctly, that it is used for the 44mag as well.

I also never really thought about the 45 round being that much larger in the cylinder and making a reload easier....hmmmm...

Does it make that much difference in the speed of reload between the two calibers?

CJ: I believe the peening on the 610 was due to the extra weight of the unfluted cylinder, plus the smaller holes. The extra inertia generated puts more stress on the notches when the cylinder stop pops up and suddenly stops it from spinning

[Classic_jon]

CJ: I believe the peening on the 610 was due to the extra weight of the unfluted cylinder, plus the smaller holes. The extra inertia generated puts more stress on the notches when the cylinder stop pops up and suddenly stops it from spinning

Thanks for the explanation, that makes a lot of sense.

[Classic_jon]

Having had both and competed with both under stress and on the clock, here goes.......The 625 is easier to reload to under stress. If you reload your ammo, both guns will shoot X-ring accuracy out to 50yds.

100yards and out the 610 will kick ass, period. If you are going to shoot pins or kill deer or the like, 610.

If you are going to buy ammo off the shelf, 625.

Both are great guns, and either will be fine for competition.....

Sorry if I didnt make it clear as mud......

DougC

Thanks, I do plan to get into steel shoots if possible so the longer range might come up but that is a ways away as I am trying to just get the skill level up to do so in IDPA. I do reload my own ammo and never really thought about hunting with it but that is a definite possibility now that you mention it.

[snertley]

I shoot a 610 and even bought a second one last year just for USPSA shooting and had Carmoney work it over. Mine are both 6.5 inch barrels, one fluted and one unfluted. You can put a pretty heavy chamfer on the holes which really helped with the stress reloads, but that being said you still have to "see" them into the holes to do a good reload.

Steve and Gary stay the hell away from my unfluted gun!

[ChrisC]

round bullets also help... both billy bullets and berry's make a 180 grain round nose 40....

i have a 4 inch 610-3 that Carmoney worked over... I seariously doubt I'll shoot well enough to know the difference between a 625 and a 610.....

currently im shooting the 170 precisions seated at 1.130 i tried sticking them out a bit further but found that my reloads were faster at the shorter depth, thinkin g about going back to 1.125 OAL, those seemed to be the best....

and nothing improves reloads like practice

[Bones]

The overwhelming majority of people that are winning in ESR at major IDPA matches (Nationals, Regionals, etc.) are using 625s. Prior to the establishment of ESR, that same gun was winning the most matches in SSR.

At any given user's skill level, no revolver reloads faster than a 625 loaded with RN bullets held in moonclips.

The gun/ammunition combination's inherent precision beyond 50 yd is irrelevant in IDPA. There is no inherent precision difference between the 2 guns that matters in IDPA.

You may have other variables to consider.

Good Luck no matter what your choice, the 610 is a fine gun as well.

Craig

Edited September 16, 2009 by Bones

[Classic_jon]

The overwhelming majority of people that are winning in ESR at major IDPA matches (Nationals, Regionals, etc.) are using 625s. Prior to the establishment of ESR, that same gun was winning the most matches in SSR.

At any given user's skill level, no revolver reloads faster than a 625 loaded with RN bullets held in moonclips.

The gun/ammunition combination's inherent precision beyond 50 yd is irrelevant in IDPA. There is no inherent precision difference between the 2 guns that matters in IDPA.

You may have other variables to consider.

Good Luck no matter what your choice, the 610 is a fine gun as well.

Craig

Thanks for all the suggestions and advice:

Looking at it overall it seems that the consensus is that the 625 reloads faster but, a lot of it is practice and skill.

Looks like what I will need to do is "beg or borrow" someones 625 and shoot it a bit and then find a 610 and do the same. I know of several people that I can borrow a 625 from but the 610 might be a bit more difficult to find

[TonyT]

I looked around for this question before I posted so If I missed it I apologize.

I am looking at a revolver for IDPA and am torn between the 625 and the 610 and thought I would ask about the accuracy of both as a bit of a deciding factor, if it is even a factor at all.

I have both the .45 and .40 dies for my Dillon 550 and I mostly shoot .40 out of my Springfield XD but I like the appeal of a revolver as well. I was looking at the 610 since I could load and shoot almost the exact same ammo for both guns but the moonclips for the 610 look like they are definitely more expensive.

I am not looking to purchase one immediately but I would like to plan for the future and start saving up $$ for one. Any assistance in helping to make the decision would be appreciated!

I haven't noticed any difference in accuracy between the 610 and 625. I use the Ranch Products moonclips inmmy 610 for ca $75 perr 100.

[Gregg K]

Thanks for all the suggestions and advice:

Looking at it overall it seems that the consensus is that the 625 reloads faster but, a lot of it is practice and skill.

Looks like what I will need to do is "beg or borrow" someones 625 and shoot it a bit and then find a 610 and do the same. I know of several people that I can borrow a 625 from but the 610 might be a bit more difficult to find

Once you try the 625 you will be in love and won't look at the 610.

The 625 is so much more forgiving on a bad reload. I have seen some awful pitches of a loaded moon hit the cylinder, rotate and suck on in. The 610 won't be as forgiving. They are both N frames so they should both fit your hand about the same depending on grip choice.

[m610]

I'm pretty much novice level with 610/625 experience, but here is what I have noticed in a couple years local matches (at which I'm well down the list):

on PINS, 40 doesn't work nearly as well as 10 getting them off the table...while 45ACP is perfect;

on speed steel, either/any is fine as long as reloads are part of the stage;

The 625 seems to just SUCK the entire moon clip in while the 610 is a bit more demanding;

I prefer the 3 7/16" 610 in how it balances in MY hand, YMMV. the 625 5" works very well too;

Prefer the 627/V8 PC on speed steel and ICORE anyway....

Hard to go wrong with any of them....PRACTICE seems to make the difference.