mikeone Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Due to the absolute insanity of the reloading market. I have been pondering the idea of procuring a primer manufacturing machine. (if that indeed is what you call it) Ive looked into brass processing machines. But interested to know was is involved with The manufacture of primers. FFL type licence machine cost material cost how much, who, what, and how? I know why. Thanks alot Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasOPM Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Keep in mind, if this is a commercial venture, the shortage might be over by the time you get it online and an individual would have a tough time competing with the big boys when they are back up to speed. As for what hoops need to be jumped through- I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Neill Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Probably better to think of it as a process more than a machine. The chemical aspect requires either manufacturing or mixing the chemicals - and the lead styphnate cannot be acquired, it must be mixed. The machinery will be the punch presses to make the cups and anvils. The assembly process is more through custom built presses than any off the shelf equipment, as far as I know. Lots of in-between stuff, such as methods of cleaning the metal parts before adding the priming mix, the need to handle the priming mix wet, and allow it to dry after assembly into the cups, packaging, DOT approval of the packaging, likely explosive manufacturing licensing, maybe an FFL for ammunition manufacturing (but perhaps not), land, buildings, etc. Overall, not a trivial undertaking. Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apiarian Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 On the home front. I'll bet an enterprising machinist could come up with a punch and a type of forming mandrel for the home reloader. This of course would be personal use items and too slow for manufacture and selling. The compound would be an issue, but I'm sure that could be overcome. Recipes for such things can be found. I wonder how many of these forming kits could be sold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajarrel Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 .....The chemical aspect requires either manufacturing or mixing the chemicals - and the lead styphnate cannot be acquired, it must be mixed.......Overall, not a trivial undertaking. Guy I think Mr. Neill states it well. From Wikipedia: Lead styphnate From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Explosive data Shock sensitivity High Friction sensitivity High Explosive velocity 5200 m/s Lead styphnate (lead 2,4,6-trinitroresorcinate, C6HN3O8Pb ), whose name is derived from styphnic acid, is a toxic explosive used as a component in primer and detonator mixtures for less sensitive secondary explosives. There are two forms of lead styphnate: six-sided monohydrate crystals and small rectangular crystals. Lead styphnate varies in color from yellow to brown. Lead styphnate is particularly sensitive to fire and the discharge of static electricity. When dry, it can be readily detonated by static discharges from the human body. The longer and narrower the crystals, the more susceptible lead styphnate is to static electricity. Lead styphnate does not react with metals and is less sensitive to shock and friction than mercury fulminate or lead azide. Lead styphnate is only slightly soluble in water and methyl alcohol and may be neutralized by a sodium carbonate solution. It is stable in storage, even at elevated temperatures. Like the orange haired girl in "The Fifth Element" said.....Big-Badda-Boom dj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmaass Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Probably better to think of it as a process more than a machine.The chemical aspect requires either manufacturing or mixing the chemicals - and the lead styphnate cannot be acquired, it must be mixed. The machinery will be the punch presses to make the cups and anvils. The assembly process is more through custom built presses than any off the shelf equipment, as far as I know. Lots of in-between stuff, such as methods of cleaning the metal parts before adding the priming mix, the need to handle the priming mix wet, and allow it to dry after assembly into the cups, packaging, DOT approval of the packaging, likely explosive manufacturing licensing, maybe an FFL for ammunition manufacturing (but perhaps not), land, buildings, etc. Overall, not a trivial undertaking. Guy Not to mention that your insurance costs would be incredibly high. In all, not a practical venture for anyone who has to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k_day64 Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Mike, I thought I was brave when I told my fiancee' that I was going to handloading ammunition. You win, hands down, if you have talked this over with your significant other? ~k_day64 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeone Posted May 4, 2009 Author Share Posted May 4, 2009 (edited) It looks quite obvious that the profit margin on this one would take for ever to recoup, with all of the associated costs. I am going to do more research. But the time to get a working, safe, reliable product out the door in the hands of a reloader, all of this frenzy may be over. I have heard the big boys are trying to procure overseas product to ease the current problems. Apiarian, Great idea the low volume precision thing may have a very good market. Benchrest, bullseye, etc. Thanks to all who answered the show ain't over yet , I like the idea of telling my my friends Im gonna go formulate some high velocity primary explosives legally today. This whole thing may be astonishingly expensive and NOT AT ALL FEASIBLE, but I feel it is a very valid question, and it's just plain not right , NOT to be able to go down to your local sporting goods store and buy a box of primers for $2, YA Know. Mike Edited May 4, 2009 by mikeone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Mike, Go for it...... I just have to wonder how many times Mike Dillon was told that he was crazy when he told people about his idea to make progressive reloading machines to load pistol ammo on for his machine guns........ That is the spirit that made this country great, keep at it! DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek45 Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Mike, Go for it......I just have to wonder how many times Mike Dillon was told that he was crazy when he told people about his idea to make progressive reloading machines to load pistol ammo on for his machine guns........ That is the spirit that made this country great, keep at it! DougC Well said Dibs on your first shipment of small pistol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyZip Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Let me know when you are taking back orders! I'll take 5000. JZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikingKraft Posted June 28, 2022 Share Posted June 28, 2022 (edited) I’ve seen people reuse old primers by using a punch to (un)dimple the primers. Then creating a slurry out of match heads. I can’t remember the other component to the slurry, but tannerite might be a good compound concept to implement. Really stretching the memory but I think it was match heads and pot ash but I can’t be 100% sure. It is in one of my survival books. Edited June 28, 2022 by VikingKraft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlmiller1 Posted July 2, 2022 Share Posted July 2, 2022 On 6/28/2022 at 10:07 AM, VikingKraft said: I’ve seen people reuse old primers by using a punch to (un)dimple the primers. Then creating a slurry out of match heads. I can’t remember the other component to the slurry, but tannerite might be a good compound concept to implement. Really stretching the memory but I think it was match heads and pot ash but I can’t be 100% sure. It is in one of my survival books. I shot 2 matches with a couple of brothers that had "reloaded" primers back when primers were still cheap. They said they used match heads. Was working ok at first but before long their guns were soooo filthy they wouldn't run. I have no idea what reloading process they used or what powder but it appeared to me the powder wasn't burning thoroughly so it really gummed up the guns. I mean REALLY gummed them up. Was it the primers? I don't know. They quit showing up & never saw them again. It was interesting though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Posted July 2, 2022 Share Posted July 2, 2022 Don’t know for sure now days but they used to use potassium chlorate in matches which is a strong oxidizer and corrosive. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny_Chimpo Posted July 3, 2022 Share Posted July 3, 2022 This has "hold my beer and watch this" written all over it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlmiller1 Posted July 22, 2022 Share Posted July 22, 2022 Yeah their guns were gummed up so severely it was hard to rack the slide. Was not an effective method of making primers I promise. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dicktater_Pete Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 On 6/28/2022 at 11:07 AM, VikingKraft said: I’ve seen people reuse old primers by using a punch to (un)dimple the primers. Then creating a slurry out of match heads. I can’t remember the other component to the slurry, but tannerite might be a good compound concept to implement. Really stretching the memory but I think it was match heads and pot ash but I can’t be 100% sure. It is in one of my survival books. Tannerite take a high velocity shock to detonate. I don't believe it would be a viable primer compound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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