40 S&W and Solo 1000

[mwx40x40]

Here are my results. Looks like I am headed torwards 4.8 or 4.9 to make PF with 180 MG CMJ @ 1.150"

Gun is a stock STI Tactical 5.0 in 40S&W.

4.2 grains S1000

814 FPS @ 146.5 PF

4.5 gr S1000

858 FPS @ 154 PF

4.7 gr S1000

904 FPS 162PF

So far brass and R-P Primers look good. Guess I am going to find out what 4.9 will do.

Anybody else having to run this much to make PF?

4.9gr S1000

930 FPS for 167.4 PF That's cuttin' it a might close for me. Primers and brass looked good , going to add one more tenth of grain. The good news has been the faster I push this bullet the more accurate it gets.

Went to 5.0 grains today with the same 180MG. Things got quirky. Velocity did not go up in Linear fashion. Also got some large spreads (lo 868 hi 954). Brass still looked good ,but I may abort this project and go to a safer more consistent powder. But I may make one more range trip with this load just to be sure it wasn't chrono maddness, as it was cloudy today. I believe with lead or black bullets , 4.7 would have been good.

[SA Friday]

Here are my results. Looks like I am headed torwards 4.8 or 4.9 to make PF with 180 MG CMJ @ 1.150"

Gun is a stock STI Tactical 5.0 in 40S&W.

4.2 grains S1000

814 FPS @ 146.5 PF

4.5 gr S1000

858 FPS @ 154 PF

4.7 gr S1000

904 FPS 162PF

So far brass and R-P Primers look good. Guess I am going to find out what 4.9 will do.

Anybody else having to run this much to make PF?

4.9gr S1000

930 FPS for 167.4 PF That's cuttin' it a might close for me. Primers and brass looked good , going to add one more tenth of grain. The good news has been the faster I push this bullet the more accurate it gets.

Went to 5.0 grains today with the same 180MG. Things got quirky. Velocity did not go up in Linear fashion. Also got some large spreads (lo 868 hi 954). Brass still looked good ,but I may abort this project and go to a safer more consistent powder. But I may make one more range trip with this load just to be sure it wasn't chrono maddness, as it was cloudy today. I believe with lead or black bullets , 4.7 would have been good.

One of the advantages of the STI platform is being able to load longer and giving yourself the ability to load a bit hotter than the charts without pressure problems. 1.15 is short IMO. I loaded mine 1.19 and could have gone longer if I wanted to. I tried a few out at 1.2 and had absolutely no mag or feeding problems. I kept the load at 1.19 simply as a comfortable middle of the road area. If you are going to bump the load a little, you might want to try a longer OAL and give yourself some more buffer zone.

When I try some hotter loads and get to pf, I'll post the results.

[Harmon]

how much better is this powder than TG?

[DougCarden]

Harmon, the reason I like it so much is that it does not burn as hot as TG....(TG has high nitro content) and there is less smoke with lead bullets than TG, at least in my experience......

DougC

[Fire_Medic]

I have loaded almost 1K with Solo for 9mm using lead and the smoke is heavy. I was almost asked to leave the range last time because of the cloud of smoke after each shot. This was at an indoor range. I'm still trying to figure out if it was because of the lead or the powder. There are unburnt flakes of powder is my gun as well when cleaning it, and when I get home from the range I have some half burnt flakes on my forearms. I'm not sure if I just need to up the powder charge or what.

Hopefully my experience with the .40 when I start loading it soon, will be different than the 9mm.

I realized I had provided no load data before for the rounds I was running so here it is:

3.4gr Solo 1,000

Winchester SP Primer

Mixed Head Stamp Range pickup brass

Missouri Bullet Company 124 grain Lead Round Nose Bullet

OAL- 1.115

Out of a Glock 19 with a KKM precision barrel.

Edited May 17, 2009 by Fire_Medic

[SA Friday]

I would be suprised if you are making power factor with that load. 3.2 to 3.3 is what most are running under a 147grain moly or lead bullet loaded a touch longer to make 130 pf.

Build loads, chrono loads to determine velocity and ensure pressure is within tolerance, then reload rounds. You are probably not getting enough pressure to seal the lead bullet off and getting gas shear on the side of the lead bullets causing excessive smoke.

Oh ya, and these loads are typically out of a G17 or 34. With the shorter barrel, it will take even more to make pf.

Edited May 18, 2009 by SA Friday

[TM262]

I would be suprised if you are making power factor with that load. 3.2 to 3.3 is what most are running under a 147grain moly or lead bullet loaded a touch longer to make 130 pf.

Build loads, chrono loads to determine velocity and ensure pressure is within tolerance, then reload rounds. You are probably not getting enough pressure to seal the lead bullet off and getting gas shear on the side of the lead bullets causing excessive smoke.

Oh ya, and these loads are typically out of a G17 or 34. With the shorter barrel, it will take even more to make pf.

I agree, I am running 4.1 - 4.2gr of Solo with 125gr S&S Casting or 125 JHPs to make minor out of my 5" XD9.

[Fire_Medic]

I would be suprised if you are making power factor with that load. 3.2 to 3.3 is what most are running under a 147grain moly or lead bullet loaded a touch longer to make 130 pf.

Build loads, chrono loads to determine velocity and ensure pressure is within tolerance, then reload rounds. You are probably not getting enough pressure to seal the lead bullet off and getting gas shear on the side of the lead bullets causing excessive smoke.

Oh ya, and these loads are typically out of a G17 or 34. With the shorter barrel, it will take even more to make pf.

Thanks I guess I'll continue to up the charge, just going by the numbers provided by the manufacturer, according to them I'm not far from the max for this load. Just trying to play it safe.

[TM262]

Be safe and work up slowly. BTW - my bullets are pretty short 1.130 OAL. I do not always have the discipline to do this, but work up a spread of ammo about two tenths of a grain apart. Then when you go to the range, you start on the low side and work up to the load that works.

Edited May 18, 2009 by TM262

[Merlin Orr]

It takes me 4.1 of Solo 1000 in a 5" 9mm M&P Pro with 124 Precisions to make 125 pf.

Less powder - less pressure and incomplete burn.....?

[tk4]

Here are my results. Looks like I am headed torwards 4.8 or 4.9 to make PF with 180 MG CMJ @ 1.150"

Gun is a stock STI Tactical 5.0 in 40S&W.

4.2 grains S1000

814 FPS @ 146.5 PF

4.5 gr S1000

858 FPS @ 154 PF

4.7 gr S1000

904 FPS 162PF

So far brass and R-P Primers look good. Guess I am going to find out what 4.9 will do.

Anybody else having to run this much to make PF?

4.9gr S1000

930 FPS for 167.4 PF That's cuttin' it a might close for me. Primers and brass looked good , going to add one more tenth of grain. The good news has been the faster I push this bullet the more accurate it gets.

Went to 5.0 grains today with the same 180MG. Things got quirky. Velocity did not go up in Linear fashion. Also got some large spreads (lo 868 hi 954). Brass still looked good ,but I may abort this project and go to a safer more consistent powder. But I may make one more range trip with this load just to be sure it wasn't chrono maddness, as it was cloudy today. I believe with lead or black bullets , 4.7 would have been good.

I have been using solo 1000 for a while now. I bet at 5.0gr with your oal you are slightly compressing the powder which is causing the erratic chrono results. I had this problem when loading 125gr jacketed 9mm rounds, 135gr molys. I could not make minor without compressing the load. Use your caliper to measure how much space is left in the case, and then how much of the bullet is being pushed into the case

[SA Friday]

Just got the email. Precision 170's shipped today.

[mwx40x40]

Here are my results. Looks like I am headed torwards 4.8 or 4.9 to make PF with 180 MG CMJ @ 1.150"

Gun is a stock STI Tactical 5.0 in 40S&W.

4.2 grains S1000

814 FPS @ 146.5 PF

4.5 gr S1000

858 FPS @ 154 PF

4.7 gr S1000

904 FPS 162PF

So far brass and R-P Primers look good. Guess I am going to find out what 4.9 will do.

Anybody else having to run this much to make PF?

4.9gr S1000

930 FPS for 167.4 PF That's cuttin' it a might close for me. Primers and brass looked good , going to add one more tenth of grain. The good news has been the faster I push this bullet the more accurate it gets.

Went to 5.0 grains today with the same 180MG. Things got quirky. Velocity did not go up in Linear fashion. Also got some large spreads (lo 868 hi 954). Brass still looked good ,but I may abort this project and go to a safer more consistent powder. But I may make one more range trip with this load just to be sure it wasn't chrono maddness, as it was cloudy today. I believe with lead or black bullets , 4.7 would have been good.

I have been using solo 1000 for a while now. I bet at 5.0gr with your oal you are slightly compressing the powder which is causing the erratic chrono results. I had this problem when loading 125gr jacketed 9mm rounds, 135gr molys. I could not make minor without compressing the load. Use your caliper to measure how much space is left in the case, and then how much of the bullet is being pushed into the case

embarrassed to say, but I think I found my problem. Somewhere along the way my OAL changed from 1.150 to 1.178" . I may just stay at that length and go up another tenth.

[uscbigdawg]

So for you limited warriors...I'm used to using N320 and a 180gr. MG-FMJ. How does Solo 1k compare with regards to recoil type (i.e. snappy vs. rolling, etc.)? The pistol is a 5" Brazos BCG Pro Series Limited.

Thanks,

Rich

[SA Friday]

So for you limited warriors...I'm used to using N320 and a 180gr. MG-FMJ. How does Solo 1k compare with regards to recoil type (i.e. snappy vs. rolling, etc.)? The pistol is a 5" Brazos BCG Pro Series Limited.

Thanks,

Rich

I jsut so happened to have a very accurate answer for that. I'm currently rolling some MG 180's with 5.2gr of N320 with Wolf SRP's, and have been shooting the 180 BBI's mixed into the 180 MG loads. Not in the same mag, but a mag of this and a mag of that. The same pf for the BBI's is 4.7gr of Solo 1000 with a Win SPP. The Solo rounds are a tad softer in recoil and have a sharper slide movement like Titegroup.

Unfortunately, it takes more than 4.7gr of Solo 1000 to get the same results with a MG round. I haven't tested it yet, but from my initial testing of Solo 1000 with the MG bullets, I suspect 4.9 to 5.1 of Solo 1000 is the area I will get around to get the same pf with the MG.

They are both very accurate, and are hitting the same POI. In my opinion, if you are thinking of making the change for the recoil aspect, it's a waste of time. If you are thinking of the change for cheaper reloads, it's monetarily worth it only if you also switch from MG's to BBI's or Precisions.

I just cleaned both of my STI's today, and the barrels came out squeaky clean. I usually just clean the chamber, but wanted to see if there was any build-up from the rounds. There was a tiny bit of moly that came loose instantly. It was about as dirty as if I was shooting only Zero bullets.

[scribble]

So are you saying they shoot softer with solo and BBI or with VV and MG ?

So for you limited warriors...I'm used to using N320 and a 180gr. MG-FMJ. How does Solo 1k compare with regards to recoil type (i.e. snappy vs. rolling, etc.)? The pistol is a 5" Brazos BCG Pro Series Limited.

Thanks,

Rich

I jsut so happened to have a very accurate answer for that. I'm currently rolling some MG 180's with 5.2gr of N320 with Wolf SRP's, and have been shooting the 180 BBI's mixed into the 180 MG loads. Not in the same mag, but a mag of this and a mag of that. The same pf for the BBI's is 4.7gr of Solo 1000 with a Win SPP. The Solo rounds are a tad softer in recoil and have a sharper slide movement like Titegroup.

Unfortunately, it takes more than 4.7gr of Solo 1000 to get the same results with a MG round. I haven't tested it yet, but from my initial testing of Solo 1000 with the MG bullets, I suspect 4.9 to 5.1 of Solo 1000 is the area I will get around to get the same pf with the MG.

They are both very accurate, and are hitting the same POI. In my opinion, if you are thinking of making the change for the recoil aspect, it's a waste of time. If you are thinking of the change for cheaper reloads, it's monetarily worth it only if you also switch from MG's to BBI's or Precisions.

I just cleaned both of my STI's today, and the barrels came out squeaky clean. I usually just clean the chamber, but wanted to see if there was any build-up from the rounds. There was a tiny bit of moly that came loose instantly. It was about as dirty as if I was shooting only Zero bullets.

[SA Friday]

The BBI Solo 1000 rounds are softer, but not enough difference to be considered substantial. The Solo snaps the slide a lot like TG, but without the heat or smoke. N320 has a little more of a push, but not as much as rounds made with Universal Clays. Ultimately, the difference in feel is minimal. The difference in price over a year is not.

[scribble]

Ok but for someone who shoots lead only it might be worth investigating.

The BBI Solo 1000 rounds are softer, but not enough difference to be considered substantial. The Solo snaps the slide a lot like TG, but without the heat or smoke. N320 has a little more of a push, but not as much as rounds made with Universal Clays. Ultimately, the difference in feel is minimal. The difference in price over a year is not.

[uscbigdawg]

Luckily, I've got a ton of 180gr. bullets around as I haven't shot limited in well...5 or 6 years. Not ready yet but my Dad's going to Wyoming on a hunting trip and his buddy is coming from Kansas (i.e. Powder Valley). They're already getting me new powder for the Super (N350 to IMR 4756) as well as some 308 components. Just want to get some powder for the 40 & 45 as well as bullets for the 45.

Thanks,

Rich

[Apiarian]

Just got the email. Precision 170's shipped today.

Do you prefer the 170 over the 180s? I have ordered a little of both to try them out.

[Apiarian]

Well the precisions came in today. I'll try the same load I use with MG 165gr.

In the G22 3.9 gr S1K gives me a 137pf.

So, 3.9 gr Solo 1000

170gr Percision

Need to go Chrono it now.

[CocoBolo]

Interesting thread.

For comparision MTG 180 and Zero 180. The MTG 180 takes +.1 to +.2 gr to make same FPS over Zero.

A 185 gr Precision takes .5 gr less than either of the 180 jacketed bullets for the same PF.

I have used WST 4.7 on Precision 185, 5.1 or 5.2 on Jacketed 180 gr bullets.

Tite Group at 4.3 gr with a 200 gr jacketed.

I have also made PF with 5.0 gr of N320.

I have a friend that shoots SOLO in limited with precision, he gave me a few bullets to shoot they were soft, but the chrono told me why, they were also 160 pf.

The best choice for me has been WST as it is cheap at $111.00 for 8 lbs, or you can get 3 lbs of N320 for about that. WST is cleaner than TiteGroup. WST also works great in 9 mm and 45 acp. It don't work in my 38 Super Comp open gun. TiteGroup produces so much smoke with lead bullets that you have a hard time seeing the targets.

Edited June 8, 2009 by CocoBolo

[SA Friday]

Interesting thread.

For comparision MTG 180 and Zero 180. The MTG 180 takes +.1 to +.2 gr to make same FPS over Zero.

A 185 gr Precision takes .5 gr less than either of the 180 jacketed bullets for the same PF.

I have used WST 4.7 on Precision 185, 5.1 or 5.2 on Jacketed 180 gr bullets.

Tite Group at 4.3 gr with a 200 gr jacketed.

I have also made PF with 5.0 gr of N320.

I have a friend that shoots SOLO in limited with precision, he gave me a few bullets to shoot they were soft, but the chrono told me why, they were also 160 pf.

The best choice for me has been WST as it is cheap at $111.00 for 8 lbs, or you can get 3 lbs of N320 for about that. WST is cleaner than TiteGroup. WST also works great in 9 mm and 45 acp. It don't work in my 38 Super Comp open gun. TiteGroup produces so much smoke with lead bullets that you have a hard time seeing the targets.

WST is a very good powder with lead and moly bullets. It's second place in all of my tests to Solo 1000. Also, WST is reverse temp sensitive. Chrono the same WST loads at 20 degrees and then at 90 degrees and you will see there is some very interesting results. It will be a much hotter load at 20 degrees.

[Cy Soto]

Following SA Friday's recommendation I too did a little bit of experimentation with SOLO 1000 and here are my results:

Solo 1000 - 4.5gr

1) 950.0 fps

2) 962.7 fps (173.3 PF) High

3) 955.4 fps

4) 957.4 fps

5) 949.0 fps

6) 942.3 fps (169.6 PF) Low

7) 958.0 fps

8) 949.5 fps

9) 962.6 fps

10) 956.5 fps

Max Dev 20.4

Std Dev 6.5

Median 956.0 fps

Average 954.3 fps

Variance 42.5

Bullet 180gr

PF Median 172.1 PF

PF Avg 171.8 PF

Firearm: SA 1911 5" (.40S&W)

Powder: SOLO 1000 4.5gr

Bullet: Two Alpha 180gr TC Bare Lead

Crimp: 0.421"

COL: 1.170"

Brass: Winchester

Primers: WSP

Shot on June 10, 2009

Temperature was approximately 55 Deg

Humidity level near 100% (right after a rain)

[ben b.]

Std Dev 6.5

Median 956.0 fps

Average 954.3 fps

That is a nice,tight std dev