Production review

[Fireant]

I was going to put it up to buy that 38 super you have posted.

[eerw]

I was going to put it up to buy that 38 super you have posted.

that's a good plan

[Cy Soto]

Yep, I was thinking the same thing. Glad I didn't go putting the FPB back in or putting it up for sale like I almost did a couple of times.

I felt that same temptation... This time I can say that I am glad to be a procrastinator!

[Alan Meek]

The combined USPSA Rule book that is on the USPSA Web is just a combination of the previously existing USPSA Rule Books. The pending ruling on Production Division is not incorporated into the any of the rule books at this time. The Production Division ruling is not implemented yet.

Alan

[Cy Soto]

What is the deal with the magazines? Do they still have to be "the same length and capacity as those originally provided with the gun"?

i.e. In the case of the SP-01, do you have to shoot with SP-01 magazines or are CZ-75/Mec-Gar (16 rnd) magazines OK?

[eerw]

The combined USPSA Rule book that is on the USPSA Web is just a combination of the previously existing USPSA Rule Books. The pending ruling on Production Division is not incorporated into the any of the rule books at this time. The Production Division ruling is not implemented yet.

Alan

Thanks Alan..

guess we are just anxious to get out of the gate.

everyone..back to where you were.

[Fireant]

Darn, it looked good for a few minutes. They took the production rules change/interpretation off, so that document looked like what we were waiting for. Anyone need a SP01?

[ChuckS]

I guess I stirred it up a bit, eh

Thanks for clearing it up, Alan...

[Alan Meek]

I guess I stirred it up a bit, eh

Thanks for clearing it up, Alan...

Yep ChuckS it is those darn left coasters causing trouble again

[ShaunH]

What is the deal with the magazines? Do they still have to be "the same length and capacity as those originally provided with the gun"?

i.e. In the case of the SP-01, do you have to shoot with SP-01 magazines or are CZ-75/Mec-Gar (16 rnd) magazines OK?

I'm also interested in an answer to this question.

[Alan Meek]

What is the deal with the magazines? Do they still have to be "the same length and capacity as those originally provided with the gun"?

i.e. In the case of the SP-01, do you have to shoot with SP-01 magazines or are CZ-75/Mec-Gar (16 rnd) magazines OK?

I'm also interested in an answer to this question.

Has this been submitted to DNROI for interpretation/ruling. That is where the official process begins

[pbosik]

yep the mag answer is not addressed in the latest front sight mag and i am unsure if the cz alum grips are ok at this point..anyone know?

[oddjob]

I had to cancel a slot to the production nationals. I didn't want to spend the money to go and be greeted to open (I have a SP-01). Oh well........

[ShaunH]

I had to cancel a slot to the production nationals. I didn't want to spend the money to go and be greeted to open (I have a SP-01). Oh well........

Yeah, not the way you want to go into open. I'm glad I picked up a Shadow.

[pbosik]

Cy, I e-mailed J.A. and his response is that under current rules you have to use mags that are the same as came in the gun,,i.e SP01 mags with SP01,,the rules in front sight are not finalized as of yet and there may be revisions. I ordered SP01 mags today and installed my fpb so my cz's are good to go. It also looks like the alum cz grips are ok as of this time.

[Cy Soto]

Cy, I e-mailed J.A. and his response is that under current rules you have to use mags that are the same as came in the gun,,i.e SP01 mags with SP01,,the rules in front sight are not finalized as of yet and there may be revisions. I ordered SP01 mags today and installed my fpb so my cz's are good to go. It also looks like the alum cz grips are ok as of this time.

Thanks a bunch for the info!!

[oddjob]

Any update??

thanks.........ron

[EricBudd]

Cy, I e-mailed J.A. and his response is that under current rules you have to use mags that are the same as came in the gun,,i.e SP01 mags with SP01,,the rules in front sight are not finalized as of yet and there may be revisions. I ordered SP01 mags today and installed my fpb so my cz's are good to go. It also looks like the alum cz grips are ok as of this time.

So, no 3rd party magazines in production? That doesn't seem right to me. At least the BoD still has to approved his rulings, right? Also, not all SP-01's were shipped with 18/19 round magazines. Some shipped with the 10 round magazines which are the same size as the 16 round CZ and MecGar magazines. I'll say it again - if the gun and magazine fit in the box the gun should be good to go.

I'm starting to see why 'outlaw' matches are so appealing. No BS rules and no $$$ to USPSA.

[Wideload]

Ok it's been about a month since last post waiting clarification from USPSA. Anyone have an inkling on when the rulings will be final?

Also to add to the comments below...

So, no 3rd party magazines in production? That doesn't seem right to me. At least the BoD still has to approved his rulings, right? Also, not all SP-01's were shipped with 18/19 round magazines. Some shipped with the 10 round magazines which are the same size as the 16 round CZ and MecGar magazines. I'll say it again - if the gun and magazine fit in the box the gun should be good to go.

If the ruling is NO 3rd party magazines, the rule will also need to apply to every other model of gun used in PD and not just for CZ shooters.

[mpolans]

Ok it's been about a month since last post waiting clarification from USPSA. Anyone have an inkling on when the rulings will be final?

Also to add to the comments below...

So, no 3rd party magazines in production? That doesn't seem right to me. At least the BoD still has to approved his rulings, right? Also, not all SP-01's were shipped with 18/19 round magazines. Some shipped with the 10 round magazines which are the same size as the 16 round CZ and MecGar magazines. I'll say it again - if the gun and magazine fit in the box the gun should be good to go.

If the ruling is NO 3rd party magazines, the rule will also need to apply to every other model of gun used in PD and not just for CZ shooters.

Hmmm...if so, that's going to hurt folks that bought up those cheap KHI mags.

[Thomas H]

Ok it's been about a month since last post waiting clarification from USPSA. Anyone have an inkling on when the rulings will be final?

Also to add to the comments below...

So, no 3rd party magazines in production? That doesn't seem right to me. At least the BoD still has to approved his rulings, right? Also, not all SP-01's were shipped with 18/19 round magazines. Some shipped with the 10 round magazines which are the same size as the 16 round CZ and MecGar magazines. I'll say it again - if the gun and magazine fit in the box the gun should be good to go.

If the ruling is NO 3rd party magazines, the rule will also need to apply to every other model of gun used in PD and not just for CZ shooters.

Hmmm...if so, that's going to hurt folks that bought up those cheap KHI mags.

Nope. FAQ #18 says:

----------

18) What provisions of this interpretation apply to magazines? May I modify my magazines?

ANSWER: In general, NO. All existing rules and rulings remain in effect for magazines. While there are no specified limits on magazine length, an existing ruling requires that the gun must fit in the box with a magazine inserted, and that all magazines (whether OEM or aftermarket) must be “dimensionally the same as the original magazine for that model of gun”. Adding aftermarket base pads, adding or removing material from base pads or adding grip-tape would all be considered external modifications and are not allowed. Springs and followers, for purposes of this ruling, would be considered “internal parts” and may be modified or replaced without restrictions.

-----------

The KHI mags are aftermarket, and made specifically to the same dimensions as the OEM mags. As such, they are fine. Far as I know, there has been not been a ruling disallowing all 3rd party mags---merely the ones that aren't the same size.

I'm thinking that the original response from J.A. was paraphrased. (Was it, pbosik?) The original FAQ allowed aftermarket mags. It would be strange for J.A. to suddenly change that completely.