Cy Soto Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Hello there, I am (almost) certain that the Blade Tech DOH is not IDPA legal but, are female shooters exempt from this rule? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Hello there,I am (almost) certain that the Blade Tech DOH is not IDPA legal but, are female shooters exempt from this rule? Thanks! Here is the rule (2H) "Holsters for females may position the breech face of a pistol or rear of the cylinder of a revolver up to 1 ½” below the center of the belt. " I measured my SP-01 in a DOH and it would be right on the line. A problem here is that they said to the center of the belt so the reference point is not exact. In any case, I would try before you buy if I were you. Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Bell Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 ¹ NOTE: Holsters for females are exempt from F. criteria, but maynot cant the handgun away from the body past 90 ° to the ground. Above is the key to it, I've seen a lot of women using this holster that do not really meet this criteria. It is reliant upon where they wear their belt in relation to their hip. To high and it cants the gun way out as it rests on their hip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 ¹ NOTE: Holsters for females are exempt from F. criteria, but maynot cant the handgun away from the body past 90 ° to the ground. Above is the key to it, I've seen a lot of women using this holster that do not really meet this criteria. It is reliant upon where they wear their belt in relation to their hip. To high and it cants the gun way out as it rests on their hip. Greg, The DOH (or at least the one I bought a couple years ago) has no adjustment for cant. It is just fixed perpendicular to the belt. So the only issue is how low the gun rides. Having said that and re-read the rule, I think in your quote the rule book is referring to cant as some tilt of the gun outward away from the body as opposed to the classic use of cant to mean gun rotation forward or aft as in "FBI Cant". The DOH does have some outward tilt, so I guess based on that note above, the DOH is a NO-GO. Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Bell Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Chuck, Yes it is referring to outward tilt. Some women with pants that have the belt riding lower can wear this just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I'm not sure there are many ladies that "don't" wear a Blade-Tech DOH. My wife has been using one for close to 10 years in IDPA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I'm not sure there are many ladies that "don't" wear a Blade-Tech DOH. My wife has been using one for close to 10 years in IDPA. That is interesting. I guess since I am not female and I do not use the DOH outside of USPSA production I really don't care all that much but the DOH I have has ~ 10 degrees of outward tilt and would not be female legal according to the rule 2F Note 1. Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I'm not sure there are many ladies that "don't" wear a Blade-Tech DOH. My wife has been using one for close to 10 years in IDPA. That is interesting. I guess since I am not female and I do not use the DOH outside of USPSA production I really don't care all that much but the DOH I have has ~ 10 degrees of outward tilt and would not be female legal according to the rule 2F Note 1. Later, Chuck Chuck, I guess your curves are different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoMiE Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 (edited) Edited February 24, 2008 by HoMiE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 (edited) I'm not sure there are many ladies that "don't" wear a Blade-Tech DOH. My wife has been using one for close to 10 years in IDPA. That is interesting. I guess since I am not female and I do not use the DOH outside of USPSA production I really don't care all that much but the DOH I have has ~ 10 degrees of outward tilt and would not be female legal according to the rule 2F Note 1. Later, Chuck Chuck, I guess your curves are different. Good point! I was just measuring the holster and not the holster on a female body. Since the rule says "on the body" that is where the measurement should be. That means that (assuming that 10 degrees is the correct tilt value) the ratio of where the holster hits the hip to where it rides on the waist can only be 1.1763. So, for a female with a waist of 24", the max legal hip size would be 28.4771". That assumes, of course, the waist in this case is perpendicular to the earth's surface where the female is standing, ignoring, of course that the earth's surface is not planar but actually curved. Latitude of the measurement site would need to be known, since the earth is not spheroid, to calculate the arc segemet from the foot to the measurement site. I guess I will write a letter to HQ to ask if differential GPS accuracy would be good enough or if we will need to make some celestial observations, in which case, I will need an approved sextant. edit: oops I made a mistake. That ratio would be the min and max hip size since the rule does not quote +/- on the offset from 90 degrees. Edited February 24, 2008 by ChuckS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Chuck, I think your math is off a little bit. I suggest a more intense study of female anatomy. Seriously, does that mean that only female holsters must meet the 90* issue? I have several paddle holsters that don't point the gun 90* to the ground when looking from the front. It would be hard to have any holster that points "only" 90* to the ground at all times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Chuck,I think your math is off a little bit. I suggest a more intense study of female anatomy. Seriously, does that mean that only female holsters must meet the 90* issue? I have several paddle holsters that don't point the gun 90* to the ground when looking from the front. It would be hard to have any holster that points "only" 90* to the ground at all times. Bill, I really think that the math is ok. For that given holster, the only person who could legally use it would be a person with that waist to hip ratio. I can only find that requirement stated for the female. My whole point was how silly (I mean that in the kindest way!) that rule is, given that there is no tolerance, direction or methodology for measuring given. Of course, the size of the hips determine where the holster is going to sit! And I really doubt that there is any calibration at the factory for holster perpendicularity. Heck, if the holster had no tilt and was worn perfectly up and down, the hips would have to be the same size as the waste! Like you all said, it has been used by women for 10 years so go for it. Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Homie, I though your pre-edit post was fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoMiE Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Homie, I though your pre-edit post was fine Yeah, but then I thought some people might not get it, didn't want to offend any ladies and surely in some parts of the country, might be considered fightin' words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I took my own advice and did a further study of female anatomy. My wife has 3 Blade-Tec DOH holsters, 1 Glock, 1 1911 and 1 revolver. All appear to have a different bend in the offset loop until worn. Then all of them point pretty much straight toward the ground. The length of the holster is what makes the difference. My anatomy study made me realize that the bottom of the holsters were well above the widest point of the hip. So the ratio that Chuck came up with is very close. Fist Holsters http://www.fist-inc.com/holsters/lady/Default.htm did a study on the ratio of ladies waist sizes etc in order to design ladies concealment holsters. Disclaimer: this study was with only one subject and for personal health reasons I will not do any studies with other subjects. Ladies have been using DOH holsters nearly since the beginning of IDPA. I doubt that will change soon. It would be nice if the rule was a little clearer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 My whole point was how silly (I mean that in the kindest way!) that rule is, given that there is no tolerance, direction or methodology for measuring given. Of course, the size of the hips determine where the holster is going to sit! Hey, Boy. That there be a can of worms yer opening I remember the exciting months between the first draft of the current rulebook and its finalized form. Wish I could find a copy now... but there was language about "some females with curves" needing holster dispensation. I posted a thread on IDPAforum beginning with the question "Who among you has the ball$ to decide which females are curvaceous ??" If any of you have wondered where Corky M's "have cloth tape will travel" sig line comes from... that be the occasion.... Jane, on whom a DOH Blade-Tech does not position a firearm outside of vertical.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 IDPAforum has switched software to a new system that actually has a decent search. Thread about female bodies and holsters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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