Doubles now constitute a crime?

[chuckbradley]

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article....RTICLE_ID=59650

If this is true what does this mean for a competition shooter whose gun doubles?

[Chris Keen]

Can you say "TOTAL BS" ??? :angry:

A couple of police officers who also were at the ranged immediately approached him and started asking questions about the "automatic" fire, and he told them it was a borrowed weapon.

"Mr. Olofson, being a responsible person, went down to the police station and said, 'I'm in the National Guard. I know what a machine gun looks like. That's not it,'" Savage said.

But instead of having the issues resolve, Savage said, it got worse.

He reported that because of the malfunction, the rifle was seized and sent to the Firearm Technology Branch, the testing arm of the federal agency.

"The examined and test fired the rifle; then declared it to be 'just a rifle,'" Savage said. "You would think it would all be resolved at this point, this was merely the beginning."

He said the Special Agent in Charge, Jody Keeku, asked for a re-test and specified that the tests use "soft primered commercial ammunition."

.........And then during the trial, the prosecution told the judge it would not provide some information defense lawyers felt would clear their client, Savage continued. That included the fact that the rifle's manufacturer, Olympic Arms, had been issued a recall notice for that very model in 1986 over an issue of guns inadvertently slipping into full automatic mode, if certain parts were worn or if certain ammunition was used.

:angry:

Edited January 15, 2008 by CHRIS KEEN

[Jim Rusert]

Very upsetting.

[Carlos]

Can you say "TOTAL BS" ??? :angry:

He said the Special Agent in Charge, Jody Keeku, asked for a re-test and specified that the tests use "soft primered commercial ammunition."

..

:angry:

Using certain ammo or other tricks to "prove" a violation is not new.

For example, cut-up military guns are often sold as "parts kits" and some of the parts are used to make US-made, semi-auto sporting guns, like the many US-made clones of the FN-FAL (a decent 3gun rifle for "He-Man" or "Heavy Metal" division).

Some of these kits have later been collected (even door to door) after .gov decided that the kits were still "functional guns." How'd they decide that? Apparently, they zip-tied the parts to a plywood board and managed to set off a single primed case. That was enough to "prove" to them that the cut up guns need to be confiscated because they were actually "functional firearms". Setting off a primer does not constitute "functional firearm" in my book, but they don't abide by my book when threatening to prosecute people and taking their parts away without compensation. I believe the company involved was InterOrdinance and it appears one of their rival parts sellers convinced the authorities to investigate so they could gain a business advantage in the market.

Another example: there was once a .50 cal known as a Maadi-Griffin. Some rifles were sold complete through FFLs, some were sold as uncompleted kits. One of the kits was assembled by .gov only enough to set off a primed case. The kit was found to be a "gun" during the trial. Now, in this case, there was no question that the company owner had a prior conviction and should not have possessed the completed guns he apparently had. He was a bad person who deserved his conviction. But the prosecution really stretched the truth on other aspects of the case.

Using special ammo to prove that a factory-recalled AR is somehow a "machingun" seems to be a similar stretch. Anyone see things getting better after the next election? I expect greater scrutiny of us gunowners no matter what happens in November.

Edited January 15, 2008 by Carlos

[ChrisStock]

Wow... LAME.

They would have probably soiled their shorts when my 1911 went full auto last week after my 'smith replaced the disconnector, sear, and grip safety. My 'smith's office is about a 100' or so behind the firing line, and he met me on my way back to his workshop. SmittyFL commented on the burst as he was practicing in the next bay, and I told him "that wasn't full auto, those were SPLITS".

[GentlemanJim]

Years ago I was the person that designed and manufactured the tripods for the maadi griffin

Political powers were used to put as many 50 cal manufacturers out of buisness as possible. and records of all guns and kits were to be obtained.

Maadi was asked by batf to divulge all records of kit sales ...he refused...several weeks later in the dark of night they came.

As far as I know this man did not break any law!! but was effectively destroyed and put out of business.

There may be more to this story than I know of....as I only manufactured his tripods and did not sell his guns.

Jim

[AikiDale]

Further evidence that alcohol, tobacco and firearms should be a covenience store, not a government agency.

Edited January 15, 2008 by AikiDale

[North]

Further evidence that alcohol, tobacco and firearms should be a covenience store, not a government agency.

+1

[chuckbradley]

While I dont disagree with many comments here I dont want it to get political and hence closed. Its a real problem when the precedent has been set that makes something that happens literally every weekend in shooting a felony crime. How will this effect competition shooting? Is this something that is not political but legal and we as shooters and organizations need to be active in getting it resolved?

[JThompson]

I hope they take this up the chain... this one needs to be over-turned pronto.

[rishii]

back in the early 80's if you wanted an AR, you had 2 choices, colt and oly. the colt's came with ar15 internals, the oly's had m16 internals, minus the auto sear. if you wanted to repair or build a lower you had the choice of the cheaper m16 parts or the more expensive ar15 parts. well shooter being shooter usually went with the cheaper m16 parts kit.

the rest is from memory from over 20 years ago:

sometime in the mid 80's the atf made a ruling something to the effect any ar15 with any m16 internal parts was a machinegun. yep, if there was a single m16 specific part in there, it was a machinegun, the story goes they tested an ar with m16 internals with federal ammo and they got it to slam fire. thus the instant ban and the recall notice from oly.

soon after federal came out with their 205 primers which supposedly had a harder cup than their 200 primers.

I wonder how old was the rifle in question, and if it was one of those old oly's

[boz1911]

Must not be enough "real" criminals out there to be caught??

[LPatterson]

Real criminals take a lot of work to dig out from under the rocks & might shoot back. For the lawabiding it is easier to put them in jail.

[Bigbadaboom]

We gave up our control of the Gov. so now they control us. Our lackadaisical, submissive attitudes towards the whole issue has gotten us what we deserve. They've chipped away slowly enough that we've arrived where we are and now it will be very difficult to change it without something extremely drastic taking place.

I'm sad for my childrens future.