toddrod Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 the local 4h club that my 10 year old belongs to is starting up a 4H shooting sport program with the 1st project focusing on skeet shooting. My question is what would be an appropriate shotgun for her (something <$500 incase she does not stick with it), what gauge is better for her (12 or 20), and what would be a good store bought load for her to shoot ( we are restricted to only using 7/8oz #7 or #8 shot). Any help is appreciated as I am a pistol shooter and have no knowledge of skeet shooting, especially for a child. I really hope this 4H club works out so that we can get these kids shooting early and show them the joy of competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mscott Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 The 20 will be perfectly fine. You are only shooting about 20 yards anyway. You might look for a gas gun of some sort like a Remington 1100. Used ones are readily available and even new ones are pretty close to your budget. Don't buy a cheap over/under. Shells won't matter a whole bunch, but stay away from the super fast 1350 fps ones as they will not be nearly as nice recoil wise. I generally use #8 or 9 shot for skeet and buy what's cheap. Some guys buy good shells so they will have nice hulls for reloading, but it doesn't make much sense for 12s and 20s other than you can load them really light if you want. She will also need a pouch to hold shells in or a vest. It's about the same as pistol shooting ... the longer you are in it, the more "stuff" you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBunin Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 (edited) Berretta makes a youth model of their 391 in 20g that is very light and has a much shorter stock. My nephew learned to shoot Trap with one when he was 10. Edited January 29, 2007 by BBunin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishlad Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 Overall, I'd probably go with a Remington 1100, Beretta is good too, in 20 gauge. I wouldn't be "afraid" to look at good, used ones either. They weigh about a pound less than the 12 gauge and you can buy, or cut down stocks, to fit if needed. You can buy "reduced" recoil loads, around 1100-1150 fps or standard, 1200 fps in 7/8 oz. If you are only going to shoot as a "club", then maybe the club can buy a couple of shotguns to start because not everyone in the skeet squad needs their own gun...just hand it off to the next shooter. Plus, when the young ones are learning, it's better to have one gun "waving around" rather than five. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkS_A18138 Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 12 ga is the only way to go. We went with the new beretta RL-391. My daughter is 11 and has no problems. She shoots a trainging load and the gun has no problem feeding. There are a lot more low recoil rounds made for 12 than 20. She shot over 200 rounds sunday and was only tired of holding the gun. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganShootist Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 One thing not mentioned thus far... is the size and physical strength of your daughter. At the age 10 there is often a major range. That might well be a determining factor in picking a 12 or a 20. BTW--- Good for you.... getting her involved at 10. By the time she's 13 you'll be buying her a open pistol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 Gas gun for sure. 12 GA if she can hold it up, 20 if not. I learned on a 410 Rem 870. Went strait to a 12 O/U once I could hold it up. It is all about her ability to hold the gun up. They make some very light trap loads in 12 GA so don't be afraid to start there if she is stron enough to hold it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Bell Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 12 ga is the only way to go. We went with the new beretta RL-391. My daughter is 11 and has no problems. She shoots a trainging load and the gun has no problem feeding. There are a lot more low recoil rounds made for 12 than 20. She shot over 200 rounds sunday and was only tired of holding the gun. Good luck I was not aware that there was such a thing as a training load, but now that I know, I fully agree. Eventually, she'll wind up shooting 12 guage anyway. On the other hand, if she doesn't, you'll still have a shotgun you'll like. I learned to shoot skeet and trap with a Mossberg pump, the same one everybody else started with. It was fine for singles doubles and anything else that came my way. If I were to do it over again, I'd probably go for a higher end pump as my first gun, but might opt for an autoloader. It just depends on price and availability. Eventually, I moved up to an over and under simply because a good one swings and points better. Unfortunately a good one, even used, tends to be a bit expensive. Other than that, find out who that coach is going to be and talk to him/her. If the program is worth anything at all, the coach will be able to help. Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 Toddrod Your question about the 12, or 20 with 7/8 load= the 12 barrel will weagh more but she will have less felt recoil with a 12 than a 20.-With a trianing load The 12 will paturn better than the 20. not all 7/8 loads are the same. The training load Mark tauked about are very good, but they can be hard to find and sometimes cost more. Mark got the best help he could for his girl, his coach/ instructor is one of the best in the nation. A 20 is good but it will have a few limitations but the ease of learning will offset that. If she stickes with it she will finaly want a (good) 12 like the 391. Please don't let them teach her with a pump, or a singal shot I had a student that was 10 that did fine with a 391 and light loads. he would get tired as all. The 4h is great, BUT the level of coaching veries alot. Skeet can be fun, I like sporting 10X as much. Five stand is a good start too. If you are near the Clark's range your girl could get some help from Kay, and some of the other shooting games. Jamie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddrod Posted January 29, 2007 Author Share Posted January 29, 2007 (edited) Thanks for all the input so for. It is very helpful and I realize how much I will have to learn about the shotgunning sports if she stays with it. Here is some more info on what I am looking at. 1. My daughter is 5ft and weighs about 80 pounds. She is all legs. 2. The coaches are just everyday folks with some shotgunning experience that went to get trained by the 4H to coach this project. there are some pretty big shotgunning clubs in the area that I will inquire into about some further hands on training if she stays with it. 3. The club is scheduled to meat once a month for 2 hours right now and there are 25 kids that have joined. So, outside practice and coaching will be necessary. 4. Since the club is so new we have no money to spend on buying guns or hardly anything else. Fundraising and donations this year will be very important to keep it going. Edited January 29, 2007 by toddrod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 The 391 with light loads can be handled by your daughter with ease. But the best method would be to take her to the range and see if she could "borrow" or even rent a few different shotguns. Show up with a box of Winchester AA Light loads and give it a try. Locally, the 391 seems to be readily available as a rental. Now some folks seem to think I shoot sporting clays like a 10 year old girl, but that is another story. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkS_A18138 Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 Todd find your Friends of the NRA rep as fast as you can!!!! They have money and are willing to let go of it for KIDS!!!!!!! Our group down here donated 5 kimber .22 Target rifles to our 4H group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ButchW Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 Todd find your Friends of the NRA rep as fast as you can!!!! They have money and are willing to let go of it for KIDS!!!!!!! Our club always has some shotguns on hand during events. (Members are asked to bring in all they don't mind letting others use.) But we buy shotgun shells by the truck load (standard not reduced loads). NRA does more or less fund our 4h events and scouts and kid's safety and I don't know what else. I am new to the club. I know nothing about shotguns past they are fun about every 10 years or so to cut down small trees. Most of the guys buy the big plastic bags of 12/20 shells at Walmart before hunting season and keep them all year. Cabella's had some really good deals on rifle ammo before hunting season maybe shotgun too??? Just something to keep in mind later. Just my opinion if you haven't already get her some serious practice with a 22 rifle to get use to a rifle before letting her on a shotgun. Another good rifle is the 30 carbine. Loud but minor kick. The kick and blast might stop her interest cold. great age to teach her too about guns at age 13-15 (puberty) she will go to her mother and not really like you anymore. Butch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxshooter Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 If she can handle the weight of a 12 guage gun that is the way to go. The Beretta 391, 390 or the older 303 model are all excellent shotguns. They all weigh less than a Remington 1100 because they have alloy receivers. Winchester makes a load for the 12 guage called a Superlite. The box label has a feather logo on the end flap. They will not cycle an 1100, but will cycle the Beretta guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micah Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 (edited) I'd recommed whatever Glen Curry is shooting Edited February 2, 2007 by Pharaoh Bender Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glen517 Posted February 5, 2007 Share Posted February 5, 2007 What are you trying to say Micah ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishlad Posted February 5, 2007 Share Posted February 5, 2007 The 12 gauge will do everything the 20 will do...only better! Better patterns with the same shot charge, less recoil will the added weight, better selection of shells, etc. It really just boils down to what the "kids" can physically handle swinging and holding the gun. They spend a lot more "time" than a "veteran" lifting, swinging, adjusting, dry firing the shotgun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irate Posted February 5, 2007 Share Posted February 5, 2007 (edited) Also, there is a beautiful stock called the "specops" stock. They call it "recoilless" because it eliminates up to 95% of recoil. This might let your daughter shoot a 12.... It's not that cheap at $110 but it is definately worth it. Check out the videos on the page. I have one on my 870 magnum express and I love it. http://www.knoxx.com/NewStyleKnoxx/Product...ecOpsStock.html (It's on the left) Irate Edited February 5, 2007 by Irate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddrod Posted February 5, 2007 Author Share Posted February 5, 2007 Well guys, thanks for all the input. Unfortunately my daughter is unable to hold up a youth model pump shotgun. She does not mind the recoil much but she just can not manage to keep it up for any length of time. So she says that she will wait for the club to start with the .22 cal rifles and pistols as she does like those after shooting them. Again, thanks for all the input. Todd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcmbang Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Well guys, thanks for all the input. Unfortunately my daughter is unable to hold up a youth model pump shotgun. She does not mind the recoil much but she just can not manage to keep it up for any length of time. So she says that she will wait for the club to start with the .22 cal rifles and pistols as she does like those after shooting them.Again, thanks for all the input. Todd Don't give up yet Todd. Try a Remington 870 Lightweight 20 gauge Youth model. Get one with the wood stock so that you can cut it down. It is very important to make sure the stock is not too long for your small daughter. If the stock is even a little bit too long for her she is forced to hold the majority of the weight with an extended support arm. Holding weight with an over extended arm is hard for anyone. I'm guessing that right now when she tries to balance the gun she tends to lean back. Cut the stock down enough so that the center of balance of the shotgun is closer to her body and she doesn't have to lean back. This might not result in the perfect shotgun stance but it will make it easier for her to support the weight of the gun. (You've got to start somewhere!) Be sure to save the piece you cut off the stock. You'll be adding it back on in no time. Kay Try a Remington 870 Lightweight 20 gauge Youth model. Whoops.....scratch the 870 model. I meant to say a Lightweight 1100 or 1187. I'm not sure they make a lightweight 1187 in 20 ga. but you should be able to find a used 1100. Kay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddrod Posted February 14, 2007 Author Share Posted February 14, 2007 Well, I have not given up completely. she still wants to go watch the other clubs members shoot. So, I am hoping that with her watching she will want to eventually shoot, just like her friends are. I will keep my fingers crossed. Todd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillL223 Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 It will take a little work to find one, but try a Remington 1100 in 28 ga. The whole package is smaller. The cost of shells is significantly higher, if she gets into it, you may decide to reload. My wife is liking a Sig-Rizzini O/U in 28 and I just bought a Beretta 686 O/U in 28 to supplement my 12 ga 682 Gold E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ffl Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 congrats on your daughter shooting I am a 4h shooting instructor as well as a parent of 3 4-her's shooting. the most important thing is to get a gun that fits. You also must not get so hot a load that she doesn't want to shoot because it hurts. 20 ga is great 7/8 oz load to start get target loads or load your own. MEC 600 JR is great. my son loads his own shells and he loves to shoot. he is 11 and has been shooting a shotgun since he was 8. He now shoots USPSA with a 45 1911 and he shoots 22 sporter in 4-h. His birthday is in Jan. so he is still a youth this year. He hates that because he wanted to shoot shootgun as well as air pistol. back to you, get something in an auto because that will reduce the recoil to her and make it more enjoyable. Good Luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardschennberg Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 (edited) You probably need a lightweight 28 gauge auto, or .410 (any action), with an adjustable stock (perhaps with a recoil spring). My personal favorite is the Ruger Red Label 28 gauge with the auto-safety disabled. The adjustable stock will cost something, but you need a shotgun with the correct LOP and you do not want her to outgrow her gun. Or you could use a cut-down or custom fixed-length stock that fits her perfect right now, and then add spacers and a thicker recoil pad as she grows. If you and your daughter are free for the Grand American trap championship in southern Illinois at the end of the summer, vendors there will likely have every variant of shotgun and stock to shoulder. Once you have found the lightest suitable shotgun, you have to note that even full-size adults have to get used to holding up a long gun and that 4-10 shots for your daughter might be reasonable for every 25 shells fired by the adults. Edited March 23, 2007 by richardschennberg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Dunlop Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 I just got back from the range with my daughters, 10 and 11. I borrowed a Turkish 20guage gas gun and had some light trap loads for it. Recoil was fine, the problem was the weight of the gun. A 20guage with a short stock and 20 inch barrel would be as perfect as I could imagine. While I look for one, its back to the 22's! P.D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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