RayB Posted August 24, 2002 Share Posted August 24, 2002 Just Retired .Started hitting some clays.We go to a range in Pa. with our own thrower. Using an Ithaca Pump 37/ 12Ga. Then we went to Thunder Mountian A Range in NJ.to watch.Looks like 99.9% are using over&under guns. Where do you start when trying to come up with the right gun? Is the Beretta Silver Pigeon 686,687L or ll the way to go? As you know these GunsGo for $2K+ Thank You All Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 25, 2002 Share Posted August 25, 2002 Depends how deeply you want to get into it. I shoot a 682 Gold Beretta, and have something like 35K rounds thru it and no problems. Yes, I paid over 2500 for it, but it will last you for ever if you take care of it.. I bought both my sons a 391 Sporting for Christmas last year and they love them. I tried them but could not get used to the bolt going back and forth by my ear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 25, 2002 Share Posted August 25, 2002 Suggest you borrow as many different shotguns as you can B4 you drop a lot of $$ on a clays gun. try them B4 you buy and it will broaden your perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 25, 2002 Share Posted August 25, 2002 RayB, It's doesn't make a stinkin' bit of difference for general fun shooting. All a gun has to do is pattern decently and actually work. If the Ithaca is what you use in the field, great!, stick with it. I guy I really respected used to shoot trap with the ugliest, most roached out Winchester 97's he could find. He'd let me borrow one of his whenever I need that little extra psychological "advantage." (Nothing PO's a high dollar gun owner more than getting whooped by some 16 year old yahoo with a $75 special. Plus, with the '97, it's really easy to catch the shell mid air when you shuck it - something else that makes people cringe.) If you're shooting a lot, you might want to consider a gas gun for comfort. If you're trying to impress the fella's at the country club, spring for the O/U with the extra $5K in engraving. Do fly before you buy. Do not buy thinking that a dramatic improvement in your score will be the net result. For Sporting Clays, that pump will be a handicap for certain pairs, so that may be a good justification to upgrade. E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishlad Posted August 26, 2002 Share Posted August 26, 2002 Hello, It is good advice to try(shoot) as many guns as possible before you buy. Most shooters would be glad to let you try their shotguns during practice. There is no "shooting" advantage between auto loaders and the O/U. It just depends what feels better and what you want to spend. Shoot some autoloaders and some different O/U's with different bbl lengths to give you a feel for the balance and your preference. Light shotguns are an advantage for hunting but not clay targets. Autoloaders have less "felt recoil" and are cheaper. Generally, they are not as reliable or durable as a quality O/U ,but you can buy 2-3 of them for the cost of a single $2,000 stacked gun. Beretta would be the best bet in autoloaders. In the $2000 and under price range I would stick with the Browning and Beretta. Lot's of them around and both are proven and reliable. There are many good used sporting clays guns that can save you a lot of money. Just make sure the bbls have not been altered and it doesn't look abused. Good luck and have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 27, 2002 Share Posted August 27, 2002 Good advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickster Posted August 27, 2002 Share Posted August 27, 2002 Ray I shoot tactical shotgun and 3-gun mostly but just recently (3 weeks ago) started shooting 5-stand. My first time out I shot a 7 out of 25. Second time 17, then 18 and now 21. I get goofy looks when I haul out my Benelli M1Super90 with 8 shot tube but you know what, I like it and I'm very comfortable with it. If you like that pump and feel comfortable with it, spend the money you saved by not buying an expensive over/under (for now anyway) on cases and cases of shotshells and go out and do lots and lots of shooting. Good luck. I'm just starting to see how much fun shooting at flying clays can be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted August 29, 2002 Share Posted August 29, 2002 My favorite real clay gun is either a Browning Sporting clays O/U or a Rizzini O/U. But I've shot good scores with my Benelli M1 Practical with an aimpoint. I just love the looks I get when I load up with a techloader. You'd a thunk I needed to use the servant's entrance! My All time favorite though was the time I used my buddy's Win 97 trench broom with ventilated handguard and a 3 foot bayonet! Rather than use a rack you'd just stick the gun in the earth while you waited to shoot. I'm surprised that Beretta, Browning or Kreighoff don't have bayonets as a standard feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 29, 2002 Share Posted August 29, 2002 A bayonet on my 682, well I guess if anyone could make one Briley's could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayB Posted August 30, 2002 Author Share Posted August 30, 2002 Thank you all for helping out. I think for now I will keep trying with the Ithaca Pump and see how it goes. In the mean time I will keep my eyes open for a used Beretta O/U.What do you think about Franchi,s O/U? Thank You all Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 For years Franchi made autoloaders that weighed 5.5 lbs. I just don't think a double with an alloy receiver is a good idea. Light weight will beat you to death and then there is the question of durability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 Ray, If you're really serious about an O/U, look hard at the Veronas. (Marketed by BC Outdoors, I believe.) They're relatively new to the US market but the ones that I've seen are very nice given the price tag. I saw a very nice field grade in the travelling PMC truck that was $1100 *retail*. Their most expensive model is only about $2000-2500, which might sound like a lot, but is very reasonable for a quality O/U. Keep in mind that a $750 Beretta 391 is every bit as usable and is more comfortable to shoot. The 391 is becoming the 1911 of the clays world. It seems like everyone is making some kind of part to customize it these days. (Not that it needs much of anything except some weight in the stock.) Think about giving one a whirl. I sure love mine. E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 I love the feel of a sweet-fitting O/U, but do I shoot it any better than my 1187? Maybe, just because I love it. Or maybe not. It's hard to say for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 Dang it Brian! Cut it out! I damn near broke down and bought a Verona O/U on the spot a couple of weeks ago. Fortunately I was able to get leave the area before I could pull out my checkbook. Now that the fever has passed, you have to start taunting me... ...must...resist...temptation....do...not...*need*...new...shotgun... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 E, lol...I took Brian's post to mean it was a toss-up as to if he shot better with his 11-87 or the high $$ gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 Flex, It's just the damn temptation of it all... I don't want to know how "sweet" the O/U's are, or the next thing you know I'll be jetting down to Mitchell's and making a very unsound purchase. E (Edited by EricW at 1:58 pm on Aug. 30, 2002) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted August 30, 2002 Share Posted August 30, 2002 I could give you pages of pro retoric on the advantages of O/U shotguns. It is mostly between your ears what matters most of all. It is just like pistols, you shoot better with what you like and feel good shooting. Most of the hot rocks now shoot autoloaders with the 391 leading the pack, Browning in 2nd. O/U's give you instant choice of chokes and usually handle better, and that could be pertinent when you shoot true pairs when each have enough distance to need different chokes. the pros to autoloaders is softer recoil and cheaper investment initially. Unless you are sponsored and have a bag full of extra parts to fix your auto during the match, you will probably do better with an O/U I have never had a problem with my 682 Beretta and have over 35K rounds through it. If you don't plan to shoot a lot, auto is probably the way to go. Nothing is as nice to look at, hold and shoot as a quality O/U, but practically any auto will break them just as well as an O/U. I knew Bobby Fowler, Scott Robertson, and Bob Brister when they all shot O/U, but Bobby and Scott now shoot auto loaders because their sponsors pay them to do so, Brister shoots an auto because he has had two retina operations on his eyes and the recoil is less. There you have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayB Posted September 2, 2002 Author Share Posted September 2, 2002 UPDATE:Thanks for all your help.So this is what I ended up with.I went up to my local dealer and he had In stock a New Remington 1100 Sports about $700.00 Feels Good Looks Good.What do you think of the 1100? Thanks Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 I would have spent another 75 bucks and gotten the 391 Beretta, but an 1100 will do. Keep a pocket full of the O rings with you out in the field. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Ray, I'm not saying Remingtons 1100's are bad, but the Beretta 391 is substantially better. It is better engineered, comes with more chokes and accessories, and will run and run and run without meticulous maintenance or cleaning. Like Tightloop said, it also does not use consumbable parts like O-rings. The stock is easily adjustable for cast and drop and comes with the parts you need to adjust it with. You also get a very nice takedown case with the Beretta. The only thing I've had to buy for my Beretta is a check pad when I got the gun fitted. That's it. No tuning, no custom tricky parts, nothing. You pay your dough and get a workable gun and everything you need to go. My 391 also patterns extremely well. It patterns a full step tighter than my Browning. i.e. an IC choke in the Beretta throws the same pattern as a Modified in my Browning (using the original type Invector chokes). As for reliability, the 1100 has a lot of stamped steel parts, which tend to break down over the long haul. (This is not from personal experience, just anecdotal reports.) I've seen rental 390's with probably tens of thousands of rounds through them still running without much significant maintenance or cleaning. (Note: I don't recommend this, it's just what I saw.) Finally, while the 1100 is dominant for 3 gunning because of it's capability for accepting extended mag tubes and the wealth of accessories available, the 391 really dominates the gas gun scene in the clays world. There's very little you can't get for it: new stocks, forend weights, custom triggers, recoil buffers, yadda yadda yadda. If it sounds like I'm trying to steer you away from the 1100, you're right. It was great in it's day, but has been eclipsed by better technology. You will not regret getting the Beretta. I promise. Eric (Edited by EricW at 7:08 am on Sep. 2, 2002) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Eric We are too late, he already bought the 1100...I agree with everything you said. Sounds like you really know your stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Whoops! Didn't read closely enough...again. I've got to start paying attention. Ray, Sorry for railing on your new baby. You'll really love shooting a gas gun over your trusty pump. Very comfy, but still light enough to hunt all day with. Enjoy! E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twix Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Really informative thread. Thanks. I guess Ray could use his 1100 for 3gun, sell it to a 3-gunner, or see how many years it takes to wear it out..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayB Posted September 3, 2002 Author Share Posted September 3, 2002 Eric Thanks for your input the 1100 may be going back We will see Talk later Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 I think of the 1100 like I do the Glock 9mm...every shooter on Earth should have one. (and a good knife, a piece of rope, a flash light that works and a roll of duct-tape) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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