38stupid Posted January 8, 2007 Share Posted January 8, 2007 Guys, What seems to be the best holster for a Open gun with mover mount / wings and scope? Thanks, Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted January 8, 2007 Share Posted January 8, 2007 I bounced this off of Frank Glenn a couple of years ago and the Ghost Holster would be ideal. Positive retention and an absolute minimum of material to retain the pistol. Thad said, any of the IPSC race holsters would do the trick. Limcat, CR Speed, Guga Ribas, Xtreme, et. al. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantJ Posted January 8, 2007 Share Posted January 8, 2007 Prefer Safariland 012 myself. Multi adjustable and also supports the muzzle. With all of the bells and whistles we have on an open AP blaster I like the security this one offers. The Bianchi Hemisphere is another good one, both will pretty much work out of the box with no modification. GrantJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted January 8, 2007 Share Posted January 8, 2007 It's not like you're runnin' and gunn'in. Too holsters like the Ghost, CR WSM, et. al. are infinitely more adjustable than anything from Safariland. Positive retention is not an issue either. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan550 Posted January 8, 2007 Share Posted January 8, 2007 I'm with Grant on this one. Doesn't the Ghost require drilling a hole in the trigger guard? Just my $.02, but the 012 is what most Cup shooters use, and I agree with the muzzle support part of that. Alan~^~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Abrahams Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 the new Ghost doesnt require drilling of the trigger gaurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Action Pistolero Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 +1 on the 012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantJ Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Rich AP is a special game, drop it and your done. Loaded, unloaded, it doesn't matter you go home. As for adjustability, up, down, left, right, forward, backward, in, out. Did I miss something? In the final analysis, it comes down to personal preference. Remember an open AP gun has special characteristic. GrantJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwhited Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 The 012 does not have near the security of the Ghost. I have use both for a number of years (012 is basically the same as the 011). Guess which one drops the firearm more offen? The 012 by a large multiple. The only way a Ghost will drop the firearm is if you do something wrong. The 012 will drop the firearm more times then I care to remember just from moving around and not holding onto the firearm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDave Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 +2 (or is it 3 or 4 by now?) for the 012. I use mine for USPSA, Multigun, Bianchi and Steel. It is a great holster. That said, any of the race holsters will work. If it were me, though, I'd look for something with muzzle support. The CR Speed fits that bill, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
half inch groups Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I dont shoot competitively yet, but I practice a lot and I have a bit of gear. I love my 012 for my single stack guns. I hate it for my STI. It barely fits in it. Its a struggle to get it out of the 012. I have a limcat righty (im a lefty) and I draw better with my STI in that limcat than my 012! I am hoping to get a lefty ghost from someone here, as I noticed they are really setup for widebody guns. The metal on my 012 is exposed as the paint has chipped off. I was really bummed on that. I worked in action sports for a long time and all the best surfers, snowboarders and skaters use what the get the most most money for, and the most photo incentives they can earn being seen wearing or using their spnsor's logo. I'm not saying this is a bad thing at all. I wish I were in the position to negotiate who pays me what to use this or that.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 (edited) Different strokes for different folks. I'll take the Ghost or CR-WSM where I can adjust the holster in every possible way....unlike the 012. As for drilling, you don't have to, and even you did as in the first generation, it's a tool, not a show piece and one hole isn't any more gunking that AP shooters do to their pistol with like bondo/plumber's goo on the grips. As for muzzle assistance on the retention, y'all don't run and gun with your pistols in the holster and LIKE virtually every other shooting game if y'all drop your pistol you deserve to get booted. Rich Edited January 11, 2007 by uscbigdawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38stupid Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 Thanks for all the input......... When I shot the cup in 2005 I was waiting to shoot the mover. (The upper one (which is much more difficult to see targets at - I digress)) and a fellow shooter hit me with his shooting bag as he slung it over his shoulder. Had I not freaked out so quickly, the gun would have been on the ground! I would have been out of the match for no fault of my own. I have seen folks getting up from the prone position and almost dump their gun. I think I will opt for the locking type of holster to make sure the gun is secure no matter what. I guess you got to make sure you unlock it before shooing the stage!!!! I always bag my gun as soon as I am done shooting the stage. We spend too much money in practice, guns, ammo, travel, hotels, match fees, and precious vacation time to get DQ'd of something like this. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwhited Posted January 11, 2007 Share Posted January 11, 2007 It is soooooo much fun to draw the firearm from a holster that was not unlocked. It is like a wedgie. Thanks for all the input.........When I shot the cup in 2005 I was waiting to shoot the mover. (The upper one (which is much more difficult to see targets at - I digress)) and a fellow shooter hit me with his shooting bag as he slung it over his shoulder. Had I not freaked out so quickly, the gun would have been on the ground! I would have been out of the match for no fault of my own. I have seen folks getting up from the prone position and almost dump their gun. I think I will opt for the locking type of holster to make sure the gun is secure no matter what. I guess you got to make sure you unlock it before shooing the stage!!!! I always bag my gun as soon as I am done shooting the stage. We spend too much money in practice, guns, ammo, travel, hotels, match fees, and precious vacation time to get DQ'd of something like this. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Action Pistolero Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 To me, it seems that a holster with a lock would only invite disaster. For example, you are at Bianchi and standing there at the 10 yard line on the Practical. You assume the start position getting ready to fire 1 shot on each target in 3 seconds. The nerves have kicked in and you are trying to visualize the sight in the x ring. The targets turn and you go for the gun but you forgot to unlock the holster. You give yourself a wedgy from hell, reach back and unlock the holster and try to rip off two shots before the targets turn. You just lost 20 points. If your lucky you may get 10. There's an easy solution to this. If you're not on the firing line the gun is bagged. If you are on the firing line and holstered, your hand NEVER leaves the grip of the gun until you assume the start position. I'll stick with my 012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 If your nerves have kicked in you are most certainly a good candidate to experience the disaster factor... IMO if you are shooting an Open Gun in USPSA you better have a lock as you should be walking up and down range helping paste, reset steel and etc. etc. Again, IMO, of all the SFF Open holsters the Gugas is the winner due to its infinite adjustability and great locking (UNlocking system) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 The CR Speed can be drawn from while still locked. I'm not sure that's really a great feature to have for a locked holster but that's just how the CR Speed is built. I'd go with a Ghost, I never liked the Safariland stuff very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Since it's apparent that the AP crowd doesn't know how the Ghost works, you can get sub-1 second draws with the holster locked. The lock release lever is positioned for this reason. When you execute the draw your middle finger disengages the lock. As stated by others though and from when I shot the Bianchi course (not the match) most AP shooters bag their guns and the holster is an after thought. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantJ Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Merlon There were pearls of wisdom in Kevin's comments. Anyone who wanders around the range with a holstered gun is a disaster waiting to happen. I cant remember the number of sob stories I've heard about how a gun was knocked out of a holster and the owner got DQ'd. Lesson for the day! Holster the gun when under the control of the range official, bag it as soon as practicable after the "unload and show clear." No Exceptions! If you don't think I know what I am talking about, take a look at the top dogs next time you are at a major match. How many of them do you see pasting targets with their gun still holstered? There is an important fact that seems to have been missed here. The holsters we use are designed and built for competition/Speed, not for personal defense/carry. There is a significant difference between the two and they should never be confused. An important point to be remembered. I would respectfully suggest that anyone contemplating the purchase of a holster for competition check out as many options as they can. Make sure the one you choose suites the gun you intend to use it with, set it up to suit your personal preference then practice with it until you know it backwards. Best part of this is that you never need to load the gun to get your holster drills right. Food for thought? GrantJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gm iprod Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Listen to those that shoot it. +1 to Grant and Kevin. Learn, cock it up, learn some more. I never leave my gun in the holster (which ever brand) for 1 second longer than I need to. I have $6000 tied up in each of my AP guns. They live in a bag. Nuff Said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allgoodhits Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 The holster for serious BC shooting does not have to be the fastest holster, as their is plenty of time if all goes right. However, it must not be locked or latched, when you don't want it to be, because that is a disaster. Keep in mind there are par times. An unintended locked holster is a disaster on the 3-4 seconds strings. If all is normal there is no problem. Taking Kevin's example to a more likely "oh sh_t". There is some range issue, where there is a delay between strings. You have a loaded holstered gun. The RO does not ask that guns be unloaded, but simply for the line to standby while something is checked. A minute or 5 minutes later, it is time to resume. You being cautious during this decide to lock your holster. Now you are just anxious to get going again. You forget to unlock your holster. If this occurs on the 10, 15 yd line of barricade, or the 10, 15 or 25 yd line of the practical you are likely toast. Other strings you maybe be able to recover, but it likely will not be pretty, and will likely draw unwanted attention from some RO. Good Luck, until we draw again! MJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmbeckwith Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 In all my years of compitition, I have never understood why someone would want to walk around with their firearm in the holster at an Action Pistol match. You know if you drop it and you are seen by a R.O. or someone reports you, your DQ! The only time I holster is prior to the match after checking and before walking to the line. Heck I even walk with my hand on the slide and holster to prevent someone bumbing it by accident then. I didn't spend all that time and money prior to a big match to have someone or me bunb my gun and see 6 grand hit the ground and then a DQ! As fare as a locking holster, I have enough to think about (did I move my stick shift?) and if your have a brain fart it will be at Bianchi! Kim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted January 13, 2007 Share Posted January 13, 2007 (edited) Having used both holsters, I can say within a doubt that the Ghost has more security than the Safariland 012 - when locked. When unlocked, it has about the same retention as the 012 set on "ultra light" (ie, no tension on the screw). That is, you don't want to go bending over and doing stuff with the gun in either holster without appropriate measures to lock the gun in.... ETA - witness the Burner and his retention strap on the Bianchi holster.... I'd say it ain't so secure, either... If you're not walking around with the gun holstered, muzzle support means nothing, in practice. I don't know about the Bianchi Cup or AP matches - at IPSC matches, its not uncommon at all the see "top dogs" walking around with guns in holsters while pasting targets, etc. However, if they're going to be checking out a stage that involves odd crouched positions or prone, they'll typically bag in the safe area.... Which is a good practice for anyone, anyway... Frankly, I don't want my gun in a holster that will drop it - I don't care about the DQ angle - I paid a heap 'o cash for that piece of equipment, and I don't want it damaged. I've dropped my gun out of my Ghost once already (luckily, over carpet - I bent over w/ the holster unlocked while dry firing). That cured me of that particular habit - the gun is always locked if I'm not about to draw, and always checked for being unlocked as part of LAMR.... This is one reason why I stopped using the 012 (though it was much more heavily weighted by the ergonomics of the 012 don't work for me...) Edited January 13, 2007 by XRe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfgang Posted January 16, 2007 Share Posted January 16, 2007 I am using a Ghost Holster now for 4 years in IPSC and Bianchi. The same Holster for 5 different guns all based on SVI/STI Frames: IPSC Open, Standard, Modified and Bianchi Open / Metallic. There is no adjusting or whatever because there is nothing holding onto the slide or Barrel. It is by far the most versatile, savest and strongest (and fastest) Holster I have used. And I started shooting IPSC in 1988. There were some Holsters during that time. Instead of taking a sponsored Holster from company " ", I just bougth a second Ghost last year ! Wolfgang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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