Kimberkid Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 I saw an ad for SPS mags in Front Site that now come with a Dawson basepad and claim 21+1. They also claim to be 140mm and I know in the past that wasnt exactly true. Has anyone tried or seen any of these new mags? Do they actually get 21 in a 140mm legal package? Is it a reloadable 21? I thought $89 for a new mag with a Dawson pad getting 21 rounds was a pretty good deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 The SPS tubes are 140mm long without a basepad. For these mags to be used at all in USPSA Limited this means the basepad must be only 1.25mm thick or they won't fit in the gauge. If you had someone manufacture a sheet metal basepad that thin (who doesn't have sheet metal fabricators on speed dial?) the magazines will only hold 19 or 20 rounds. So it's kind of false advertising, they know what we want but rather than build it they just falsely market their product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 The SPS tubes are 140mm long without a basepad. For these mags to be used at all in USPSA Limited this means the basepad must be only 1.25mm thick or they won't fit in the gauge. If you had someone manufacture a sheet metal basepad that thin (who doesn't have sheet metal fabricators on speed dial?) the magazines will only hold 19 or 20 rounds.So it's kind of false advertising, they know what we want but rather than build it they just falsely market their product. Pickles With a Dawson 6.5 mm basepad, this is legal, and holds 21 rounds of .40. It would be very tough to reload, but reloads like a champ with 20. I also have switched out the follower to the Grams. NOT false advertising, I have 2 of them with the above mentioned basepads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 NOT false advertising, I have 2 of them with the above mentioned basepads. The SPS tube that I bought to experiment with doesn't even fit into the gauge without a basepad on it. Tell me more about your experiences, as I'd written off the SPS mags as junk. Does anyone know what's up with the tube I recieved? It sounds like my tube is 6mm longer than what zhunter has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Dirtypool is the MAN on this subject. He told me what to do and how to do it, I just followed his instructions. I believe he used them at the Nationals this year. They don't require any tweaking. Just the 6.5 mm basepad and they are good to go. I put the Grams spring and follower in them because I really trust them, that was a personal choice. Getting the 21st round in is a tough task, but it WILL fit. Once ya learn the trick, there is nothing to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carinab Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Depends on when you ordered your mag pickles. I had someone give one to me that was prior to them entering the US mkt and like you, I measured the mag body itself as 140mm. From what I understand, they changed the mag body length...Perhaps Z can tell us what date he purchase his mags. The one I got was about 2.5 years ago and it was almost six months old at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimberkid Posted December 30, 2006 Author Share Posted December 30, 2006 I knew a lot of people got burned on the before, but what peaks my interest is that the new ad shows the mag, with Dawson pad, and a little schematic measurement thing as 140mm. Just curious is they are still hosing people on the deal, or if they got their stuff together with the new offer. They also show mags with their own pad, also claiming 140mm and 20+1 for like $58 (i think) which also sounds like a good buy, if they in fact got it together and its all legal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 I bought mine about 5 months ago. And they are LEGAL!!! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 The one I got was about 2.5 years ago and it was almost six months old at the time. That's about the age of my mag too, roughly 3 years old. I had no idea their product had changed either. Like I said, the tube I bought won't even fit the 141.25mm gauge with no basepad at all. I didn't even bother testing the mag once I saw that. I have working STI mags now. I don't really need any mags right now either, for which I'm glad... because I don't know if I'll buy anything SPS again. They definitely weren't forthright about things in the past, I mean they knew they were selling unusable magazines to the US market but they did it anyway with lots of marketing and gloss. But, ~$90 for a 21 round magazine is a chin scratcher for sure. Eh, good luck Kimberkid. BTW, the S&W 610 is shooting great - I cleaned up the trigger a bit and lightened the action. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam B Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 I bought 2 a few months ago and they do fit the gauge with a 6.5mm Grams basepads and SPS followers. Mine hold 20 reloadable not 21 but 20 is fine with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 (edited) Oops Edited December 30, 2006 by .40AET Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Anyone got a websight for these guys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 SPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 (edited) Well we're heading off in different directions. Let me address what questions I can. Yes the OLD SPS tubes were over the 141 limit. Yes, the new tubes are shorter than 140mm. Roughly 134mm. Yes, I built, and showed others how to build a USPSA legal 21 rounder using the Grams 6.5 pad. The bad news is most suppliers are sold out of the pads. I've been working with SPS to update and improve things a little, and I guess now is as good a time as any to say I am "supposed" to be the "exclusive US distributor" for all things SPS. In actuality I'm waiting to place my first big order, because the mags AS ADVERTISED IN FRONT SITE DO NOT HOLD 21 ROUNDS. Those are built on the older 134 mm tubes and will easily fit in the gauge, but will NOT hold 21. I am in contact with SPS several times a week, waiting for the newer 137/138mm tubes to be produced. I will post here and offer some sort of "Enos-Intro" Special as soon as I have them in hand. I have waited this long because I didn't want to offer a product I did not have, or ship a product that was not as advertised. SPS seem like good folks, and I like their magazines. However, they do not understand our rules, or needs, and I am having a tough time getting them "on the same page". My wife (native Spanish speaker) and I spent about an hour a day at the nats, talking gauges, aftermarket pads, and how to market. I am sorry they went off half cocked with the new Front Site ad, and hope you guys can be patient while I try to work it out and deliver the right product. I am hoping to have them to deliver at or before the FL Open. Look for my ad here or in Front Site as soon as they are ready. Please feel free to contact me with any questions or concerns. Pic attached is of a 30 round 9mm Big Stick and 21 round 40x140 Edited December 30, 2006 by dirtypool40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDRODA396 Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 (edited) DP40, do you know will they lock the slide back when they get the length issue resolved or are they like the grams follower and might require some "tuning? before you overcome the slide locking back with one round still in the mag? They look like the ticket at the projected price. On another note, I have looked around this forum and cant find it...is there a way to "sign up" for a thread so that you get some kind of notice when a new post is made, I would like to "get in on" the first run when all the kinks get worked out? (Thanks to .40AET got this one figured out!) Edited December 30, 2006 by CDRODA396 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 OK now that the 140mm issue is resolved I have a few 20 round (reloadable) S_I tbes with Grams guts and a Dawson pad and all will hold 20 but only 2 are reloadable (easily) the others you must seat firmly so I run 19 in those. I don't know how much more a 21 rounder would be other than 1 more round as insurance or "just in case", but it can't hurt so what the heck. But not to be the only kid on the block who goes without, I would too be very interested in a few in some "replacement" tubes. Darn feed lips dont like concrete very much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scirocco38s Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I just recently recieved 4- 40/140 mags with the stock flat pad and they will fit the guage with no problems. They will even fit with either the grams or the dawson pads and have a little wiggle room. I can get 19 easily in with the stock pad and 20 with either the dawson or grams pads. I have tried both the new sps follower and the grams and they work very well also. If you are in want of the SVI style of mag tube and dont want to wait for months, they are a good alternative. (I ordered mine dec2 and recieved them dec14 registered mail) Their price is reasonable and the quality of finish on the new mags are excellent. I have several of the old mags from 2002/2003 season in 38 super and they have always worked flawlessly but fitting those in the guage was never an issue for us guys in open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 DP40, do you know will they lock the slide back when they get the length issue resolved or are they like the grams follower and might require some "tuning? before you overcome the slide locking back with one round still in the mag? They look like the ticket at the projected price. The SPS Spring / Followers are not intended to lock the slide back on the last round. If you really need that (for IDPA?) you'll have to tune them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDRODA396 Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 DP40, do you know will they lock the slide back when they get the length issue resolved or are they like the grams follower and might require some "tuning? before you overcome the slide locking back with one round still in the mag? They look like the ticket at the projected price. The SPS Spring / Followers are not intended to lock the slide back on the last round. If you really need that (for IDPA?) you'll have to tune them. DP40, Thanks again for the reply, it was more out of curiosity than necessity. Once SPS works out the "issues," put me down for number 1 and 2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I just spoke with SPS again today, and man is it like herding cats!!!! Long story short they are still confused and or dragging their feet and we still HOPE to have the new 138's by FL Open. I'll keep you all posted and will let you know when I have them. Keep your fingers crossed.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 DP- Have you sent SPS a gauge? If they had it in their hand it may help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joecichlid Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Interesting. If my math is right, according to the SPS web site the 170mm .38 Super mags are about $102 WITH the Dawson base pad? I might have to give them a try as I paid that much for a bone stock STI mag then had to add a spring, follower and base pad to get it up to 27 (28 if I push it) rounds. If I remember right, right out of the package I could only get 25 rounds in their 27 round magazine. I was wondering if the 140mm .38 Super mags will be offered with the Dawson base pads or if they will only be offered with the plastic base pads as seen on their web site. Joe W. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 I just spoke with SPS again today, and man is it like herding cats!!!!Long story short they are still confused and or dragging their feet and we still HOPE to have the new 138's by FL Open. I'll keep you all posted and will let you know when I have them. Keep your fingers crossed.... RE: SPS MAGS and dealing with them through the website: BUYER BEWARE. You will "have trouble" getting what is advertised, and there is NO CUSTOMER SERVICE DEALING OVERSEAS. Guys I really appreciate your patience. Right now things are at a standstill. SPS is still selling misleading products on the internet to US customers when I am supposed to be their "exclusive US distributor" , and making people mad because the stuff they are selling DOES NOT do what it is advertised to. They never seemed to have enough to sell me any for inventory. Then they came to the FL Open with NO TUBES and didn't even show up for Sunday. I don't know what's going on, but it is the most "interesting" business management and ethics model I've ever seen. They'd rather make a quick $1 selling around me and making people mad, than making $1,000 working with me and being sure folks are happy. Everyone who has tried to work with them in the past, tried to warn me. I’ve spent the better part of a year trying to help them understand our rules and market and let's just say “I was not rewarded for my efforts”. I haven't sold any mags or tubes and I'm about at the end of MY patience. When you are ready to write a check for 5 or $10k and they can't seem to deliver, things are unquestionably fishy. Anyone interested in making them work and getting a 21 rounder feel free to PM me. I'll be happy to help you where I can, for free, but I will probably not have mags to sell. Sorry. I tried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.Diddy Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Sounds like some good folks to deal with.....Lets get things straight...They copy the SV/STI Grip and Frame design....Bring Products in to the US Illegally.....Lie about the magazine capacity.....whats next.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 The guns I won't comment on, quality or patent infrginement. I was interested in the mags, the S_I cartel has made them too expensive and to hard to get with any regularity. I was hoping to go all capitalist and have a better product, available for less money. Doesn't look like I can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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