British Surplus .223

[chp5]

Midway has "British 5.56x45mm (223 Remington) SS109 62 Grain XM855 NATO Headstamp FMJ" on sale for $200/1,000.

Anyone shoot it before? Any good?

Question #2: will a 1/12 stabilze a 62 grain bullet?

Thanks.

[cking]

SS109 is an armor piercing and you'll ruin the range steel. Many ranges won't allow its use.

[chp5]

SS109 is an armor piercing and you'll ruin the range steel. Many ranges won't allow its use.

Good point. Thanks.

[Dan Sierpina]

I don't think the 1/12 twist will stabilize it.

[TBF]

I'm not sure ifthis is the same stuff Dillon sold years ago , theirs was headstamped " RG " and my rifle would not function well with it at all. YMMV

My son's rifle digested it with no problems , not sure about accuracy compared to anything else .

Travis F.

[No.343]

I experienced National Guard matches with the 62gr armor piercing ammo out of a rack grade, 1:7 twist M-16, and that stuff was simply awful. We shot bullseye and combat matches with it. We had unexplained misses frequently. I would not even use it for practive beyond 100 yards.

[CaseyJ]

The X in XM855 means it is not fit for military use and is only to be used for training. Remember that if the Army is kicking it back there must be a reason. the good ss109 is M855 and can be used for short range stuff on paper targets but not steel as cking stated before.

[the gman 763]

The X in XM855 means it is not fit for military use and is only to be used for training. Remember that if the Army is kicking it back there must be a reason. the good ss109 is M855 and can be used for short range stuff on paper targets but not steel as cking stated before.

Some of you folks don't seem to be reading the poster's initial question which was "what is the surplus RG ammo that Midway is selling like?" (to paraphrase)

Radway Green ammo is of excellent quality, it is the standard issue SS 109 spec ammo issued to the British Armed forces. I have shot hundreds of thousands of rounds of this ammo in military competitions, in training & some in combat. It DOES contain the tungsten penetrator in the tip but it is NOT AP ammo per se. The penetrator tip aids in piercing helmets & body armour, but it WILL swiss cheese steel targets. Ergo, as correctly stated, most comps (unless all paper) will not allow it's use. It's great for practice on paper tho'.

I used to be a member of the British Army Combat Shooting Team & in 1995, the rifle team used US issue M855 in our SA 80 rifles in the AFSAAM comp in Little Rock AR. The boys did not shoot up to their usually high standards & were disappointed with the ammo quality.

In 1997 at the next match, we brought our own standard issue RG & whupped all comers, the best of the US Army, Reserves, NG, USMC & the rest of the world went home empty handed, with the rifle team winning almost every stage. It's good ammo....

All it is, is surplus to requirements for the Brits. What happens is that the ammo in stock has a 'shelf life' that the military has pre-determined that it will 100% perform to original specs & after that point, is no longer allowed to be issued for operational (or combat if you prefer) use.

At that point, most of the ammo is classed as 'training use' only & the remainder is sold as 'surplus' on the commercial market. This is where the ammo on the market has come from right now. It is still in perfect shape & will shoot excellent groups with the right twist, as it was intended for a 1 in 7". 1 in 9" will stabilise it but I don't think you'll have much luck with a 1 in 12".

This ammo was issued on stripper clips with 2 tracer rounds to 8 ball. Import regs don't allow tracer ammo to be imported for sale to civilians so the tracers are stripped off the clips & the boxes are re-packed. The ammo was packed into 900 rnd boxes so most importers simply remove the 180 tracers, re-pack the boxes & sell them as 720 rnd lots, complete with the clips & bandoliers that the clips came in. Midway shows that ammo as out of stock & at least in my opinion, was over priced as they simply re-packed the ammo into cardboard boxes & you didn't get the stripper clips, the bandoliers or the nice metal ammo case. (but they would sell you that lot seperately..... )

AIM surplus, www.aimsurplus.com will sell you 720rnds with the box et al, for the reasonable figure of $140 + shipping are really nice people to do business with too.

On a side note, true AP ammo is usually issued for MG's & therefore doesn't need to be as accurate but some can be. Sweeping statements such as those above often confuse & become internet legends to be bandied about for years as fact. I personally have shot plenty of true AP ammo in military weapons but would not do so in my own guns on anything but an emergency situation as some (but not all) true AP has a hardened jacket as well as a hardened core, hence that can damage the rifling.

Hope this helped correct some mis-conceptions & inaccurate info.

[mike_pinto]

oops

Edited September 3, 2006 by mike_pinto