Burying The First Round In Production

[Pierruiggi]

That said, I started a long time ago with a SIG P-226 and learned to deal with the DA first shot in several ways none of which is a safety violation.

Method 1 is to practice drawing to a small steel plate (6-8") at 20-25 yards until you can hit it 100% of the time ;-)

Method 2 is to always take the DA shot into the easiest or most open target available.

Method 3 is to carefully thumb-cock the hammer using the weak hand prior to getting your grip.

I don't know abou USPSA, but under IPSC Rules, "method 3" will result in a procedural penalty when shooting Production.

[Flexmoney]

That said, I started a long time ago with a SIG P-226 and learned to deal with the DA first shot in several ways none of which is a safety violation.

Method 1 is to practice drawing to a small steel plate (6-8") at 20-25 yards until you can hit it 100% of the time ;-)

Method 2 is to always take the DA shot into the easiest or most open target available.

Method 3 is to carefully thumb-cock the hammer using the weak hand prior to getting your grip.

I don't know abou USPSA, but under IPSC Rules, "method 3" will result in a procedural penalty when shooting Production.

You know, I had to look that up when George posted it. I was thinking it wasn't allowed. But, all I found was it wasn't allowed in IPSC, not USPSA. Anybody else???

[George]

I thimk it's still USPSA legal, but now I knows' it's not IPSC legal.

[D.Hayden]

I think it became legal in the new book, in the red book it was illegal in USPSA.

[splashdown]

Yep. Hammer must be down at the start signal for a DA pistol. You can thumb cock after the beep, but I've only done it on a 50 yd standards course.

I'm suprised I didn't see anyone mention that you can be DQ'd for firing a shot into the ground within 3 meters of your feet (unless actually engaging a target).

I got my B card with a Beretta 92. The DA first shot is not that bad, and that's a good read from Ernest Langdon that someone posted.

Good luck. Welcome to USPSA.

splashdown

[bierman]

Mike,

Dry fire is a great plan. I have also had to rethink the way I shoot some stages. Someone mentioned earlier that, if possible, try to take the closest or most open target with that first shot. That is one of the (many) things I am working on right now when I shoot a match. Don't make it harder than it has to be.

[mike_pinto]

Thanks for the information. I always try to take the closest target first, especially on the first stage of the day to get the blood flowing. Good advice from all (Except I could never intentionally throw the first shot, kinda defeats the purpose of the game IMO)

Mike

[Radical Precision Designs]

What a bone head. The little bit of extra time to make your first shot will still be faster than throwing one into the ground then trying to line up the sights.

About the time you did that and put one to close to you into the ground could get you DQ'ed.

Flyin40

For the better part of last year I have been shooting almost eclusively Open with a 2011, so I have been programmed/sidetracked a bit.

Recently I decided to go back to the "long trigger pull" single and DA as a "practice and de-programming" effort. I picked up my CZ Champion in 9 Major (Open) and quickly got a DQ in my first stage after I put a shot a little too high in the berm while taking up the trigger slack (S/A only trigger) on the way to the target after a mag change. It was a big eye opener and wake up call. Today we had a "Carry Gun Match", with shooters bringing in all sort of shooting irons. One even brought in his "Bersa .380 ACP", which he quickly quipped it was really a 9mm ... "Kurz"...?! Some shot their STI "Executive's" (concealed Executive carry?) in .40 S&W and a myriad other guns, mostly small Glocks. I brought in my Para 14-40 LDA (Officer's Model sized). We were all limited tp a maximum 10 rounds total per mag, and only three mags. It was a real fun match, and a great "comraderie" time was had by all...

Being out of practice with the Light/Long Double Action of the Para I had a bit of trouble in the first stage, which was composed of two arrays of head-shots overposed sets of three 'tombstone' targets side by side, with a no-shoot at the bottom, and a third 'turtle' target array in between at the bottom, all at about fifteen feet from a box that had two restraining/squeezing side hard board pieces to limit your start up and movement while shooting with "mandatory" mag changes between arays. In the first array all my shots were a bit low, missing the first upper head which shots went into the lower head perfectly but in the lower head went into the lower no shoot area. By the second array I was right on target with a similar set-up, and on the third 'turtle' target I was right on. I had a very poor scoring but it was an invaluable lesson in double action trigger control. By the third stage I was truly calling my shots and finished near the top of the heap, even shooting against the "STI's Executives". As you can see, with a little bit of pressure to perform, and steady trigger pull (and feeling that little hesitation in the trigger before it goes off) it is not so hard to pull it off without "throwing off" that first shot ... especially when all your shots ARE d/a.

Now is time to go and have "serious talk" with my CZ Champion and get familiar with that "longish" S/A trigger and not repeat that DQ.

Edited May 1, 2006 by Radical Precision Designs

[Larry White]

9mm Kurz. Yep, really old German name for 380( 9mm short).------Larry

[Radical Precision Designs]

9mm Kurz. Yep, really old German name for 380( 9mm short).------Larry

Well, while it was an IPSC 'sanctioned/conducted' match, it was really a 'Club' match. As a Club match with no real meaningfull (IPSC-wise) scores, it was just a practical training session to really bone-up in with a gun you actually carry rather than a race-only gun. Definetely not a 'gaming' match. Targets were close up. Many of the guns used were indeed D/A only, or D/A first shot as the essence of this thread dictates. Since it was a "practical use match", the fact that many people actually carry a .380 ACP/9mm Kurz as a concealed carry in many situations, it made sense to practice and be proficient with it, regardless of the 9X19 "minimum" dictated by IPSC for normal/standard matches. Kind of like a Club "dispensation" for the day.

It is important to practice that "first" D/A shot to a level of accurate proficiency and familiarity, much more so for "real life" scenarios than for a competition 'game'. After all many normal day concealed carry and defensive situations are handled with a D/A first shot. I believe that in itself should create enough incentive to eliminate that "low position first shot". Wrong placement of that first shot could be critical in a real life situation, regardless of proficiency with follow-up shots.

Edited May 1, 2006 by Radical Precision Designs

[Vlad]

That said, I started a long time ago with a SIG P-226 and learned to deal with the DA first shot in several ways none of which is a safety violation.

Method 1 is to practice drawing to a small steel plate (6-8") at 20-25 yards until you can hit it 100% of the time ;-)

Method 2 is to always take the DA shot into the easiest or most open target available.

Method 3 is to carefully thumb-cock the hammer using the weak hand prior to getting your grip.

I don't know abou USPSA, but under IPSC Rules, "method 3" will result in a procedural penalty when shooting Production.

You know, I had to look that up when George posted it. I was thinking it wasn't allowed. But, all I found was it wasn't allowed in IPSC, not USPSA. Anybody else???

For some reason I could have sword the books said "First shot must be double action", but according to US D9.19 the only requierment is that the gun may not be in single action mode at start signal, so I guess you can cock your gun before the first shot. Now I have to worry about some hot shot trying to cock his gun on the draw.