Heavyweight 610 Loads?

[sargenv]

Ok,

I know there is a lot of data out there for 200 grain loads generally with clays or some fast burner. I have in my hands about 1000 - 220 grain 40 caliber bullets from West Coast. I'm thinking about loading them up for either ICORE or IPSC. Mind you with a 220, I won't need them to go very fast to make major. They will be seated long (out as far as I can in the 610). Does anyone have any experience with something similar or am I breaking new ground? Let me tell you what I've done so far.

I loaded 30 rounds in once fired Winchester Nickel 40's. I'm not going to get into that whole brass/nickel thing. These are what I use because I have lots of them and it's easy to sort it from my minor/major 40 loads for my bottom feeders For now I'm going to stick with a slower burning powder and may change up to something faster later. I picked up a keg of Longshot and I see that there is data for 200's in 10 mm and 40. I'm using the data for the 40 right now since I don't need a load that is at 200 pf. I'm seating these currently to 1.295". Powder weight is 5.5 gr of Longshot. The bullet heel actually seats about as deep as a 180 (about an eighth of an inch) but since the bullet is so long, it sits at the above length. I will of course check to see that they fit in the cylinder when i get my gun back from D. Carden who is doing some work on it for me. That other powder I may switch out to will probably be universal clays. I have an ample amount of that too. If you have done this before and have load data, post it, I'm all ears.

Vince

Edited February 17, 2006 by sargenv

[shred]

I loaded a bunch of Precision 220's for Pins once, but that's not quite the same thing..

[sargenv]

I loaded a bunch of Precision 220's for Pins once, but that's not quite the same thing..

Naw, Not quite.. but um, what kind of load were you using? If it turns out not to be that great, it would be nice to have some data that other people had luck with.

Vince

[10mmdave]

I loaded a bunch of Precision 220's for Pins once, but that's not quite the same thing..

Naw, Not quite.. but um, what kind of load were you using? If it turns out not to be that great, it would be nice to have some data that other people had luck with.

Vince

I too have some load data with the WestCoast 220's, also pin shooting loads but I'll let you

know later tonight or this weekend.

I don't use the powders you list, I think most of my data is with Power pistol.

Funny, but I settled on 1.30 OAL, pretty close to your 1.295.

Oh !?! all my loading was done with Win nickel 10mm brass.

I finished butchering my 610 last night for USPSA play and I also have 1.5K-2K of the 220's

left to try out so I'll share whatever I find.

[sargenv]

You know.. I wonder if I could get enough H110 into a 40 case to help me. I've loaded some 180 gr loads in 10 mm with H110 (WC820 actually) and they worked fairly well. Since I'd be long loading the 40 case, I could potentially get enough case volume for that slower powder. Maybe I'll look into that tonight. It's all moot until I get my 610 back from Dan though I do have a good supply of Power Pistol so that could be another route as well. In fact, I have some of the classic "magnum" powders available. Blue Dot, Herco, WC820, now LongShot, HS-7, AA #9, and SR4756. I think part of this stems from wanting to burn up some of this slower burning pistol powder

Vince

Edited February 17, 2006 by sargenv

[10mmdave]

OOh OOh ! ! !

I just remembered, I loaded my 220 Westcoasts long because I had to, I've had these bullets

for awhile and I think they were intended for semi-auto use in long throated 40 cal. guns.

Anyways, if I loaded to 1.25/1.26 OAL I would get bullet setback, once I went to 1.30 OAL it seemed

to go away.

Never tried H110 but I might try Bullseye and definitly VV320.

[shred]

The load I tried was 220gr Precision LFP over 4.8gr 231 at ~1.25" in 10mm brass for pins.

They went about 900 fps / 200 PF in my 6.5" 610 and didn't blow up the gun, but I have been told this is too hot a load for 231. It also wasn't a very good pin load. I think the precision coating let them slide off too easily and I switched back to 180gr JHPs.

[sargenv]

The load I tried was 220gr Precision LFP over 4.8gr 231 at ~1.25" in 10mm brass for pins.

They went about 900 fps / 200 PF in my 6.5" 610 and didn't blow up the gun, but I have been told this is too hot a load for 231. It also wasn't a very good pin load. I think the precision coating let them slide off too easily and I switched back to 180gr JHPs.

Yeah, it seems with these bigger bullets that something like 231 or Bullseye might be a tad too fast a powder. I know that generally the bullet makers reccomend a more medium or slower pistol powder for their coated stuff due to being a cooler flame temp and less chance fof blowing the coating off them. I've used coated bullets in the past (158 LSWC) loaded to magnum velocities. No leading and pretty accurate. With the plated bullets speed won't be so much an issue but I figure that something with a more gradual pressure spike might be better for the gun/brass than something that would spike so fast as 231 or bullseye might do.

I will be firing this stuff in a 6.5" 610 with a non fluted cylinder. When I take it to the Northern California Sectional, I'm probably going to want something major and the 220's will easily make that. I'm probably going to swap out to a 140 rn when I shoot the ICORE since 120 pf will be all I'd need. The 140 should be more than plenty and for the standards I might just use 10 mm brass to see if they are any more accurate than the 40's I use for closer in stuff. Time will tell. Thanks for the input though, the more data I can get the better

Vince

[10mmdave]

I loaded a bunch of Precision 220's for Pins once, but that's not quite the same thing..

Naw, Not quite.. but um, what kind of load were you using? If it turns out not to be that great, it would be nice to have some data that other people had luck with.

Vince

I too have some load data with the WestCoast 220's, also pin shooting loads but I'll let you

know later tonight or this weekend.

I don't use the powders you list, I think most of my data is with Power pistol.

Funny, but I settled on 1.30 OAL, pretty close to your 1.295.

Oh !?! all my loading was done with Win nickel 10mm brass.

Well I checked my records and sorry but no 220 grn WestCoast data, yet! All I have right now

is a 168 avg. pf load with a 200 grn Westcoast, 4.2 grns of Titegroup, Win nickel case, Fed

primed, 1.265 OAL.

[10mmdave]

Well I checked my records and sorry but no 220 grn WestCoast data, yet! All I have right now

is a 168 avg. pf load with a 200 grn Westcoast, 4.2 grns of Titegroup, Win nickel case, Fed

primed, 1.265 OAL.

I have to edit this....I was wrong on the case, it was Fed case, not Nickel Win.

I have 2 reasons for bringing this up, first, it was bad info and should be corrected.

2nd, I just tried a 45 load last Friday using all the same stuff except for the case

(Win vs Starline) Starline load clocked out at 160 pf where the Win cased load did

168pf

Glad I only loaded 30-40 of 'em.

[sargenv]

I still haven't had a chance to try it, since my 610 is still being worked on, for which I am very grateful. I told him to take as long as it takes. That being said, I can't wait for it. His work done on another shooter's 645 was awesome.. I can hardly wait!

Thanks for clarifying your load data. That could make a difference. I'll be making sure that all the nickel stuff I have is Winchester so that I get one burn rate. I'll post here and let everyone know what happens with the load I mentoned above and then I'll make up some with Universal Clays, and maybe some with some other powder or more of the Longshot.

Vince

Edited February 27, 2006 by sargenv

[10mmdave]

Another load that made major....

10mm Win nickel case (yes, I'm sure, but very old, 10+ pin load firings)

3.8 VV N320

220 Westcoast bullet

Fed prime

1.27 OAL

168 PF out of a 6.5 inch 610

[sargenv]

Ok, I have some data to share. That load of 5.5 grains of Longshot with Winchester Nickel plated 40 cases, Federal Small Pistol Primers and 220 gr West coast plated bullets. I made 176 Power factor out of a 6.5" 610. I was pleasantly surprised that I'd hit it pretty much where I wanted to. Average velocity was about 800 fps. It felt less snappy than comparable power factor loads with 180's would feel like. I could easily load upward if I wanted to, but this may just be the perfect Major load for IPSC revolver for me. Accuracy was just ok and I didn't get to bench it, but it seemed to do ok at about 35 yards distant. D.Carden shot 6 through it and they stayed pretty much where he pointed things.

I may try it with Universal clays and I'll report my findings later..

Vince

[haras]

Presision Bullets has been planning to produce 220/.40 bullets for some time now and Dave says he will get to them this summer. They're taking a back seat to a new 9mm bullet due to popular demand.

If any of you who are interested in a 220/.40 would email Dave and let him know you are good for an order it may raise the priority level. We need to show him that he can recoup his investment on the die sooner than what it looks like now. There are only 3 people who are bugging him to make them.

I used a 220 D&J lead bullet years ago (no longer available) and it was a sweet poo-poo load for IPSC major.

http://www.precisionbullets.com/

[Skywalker]

My only experience with heavy bullets in .40 has been the following:

- 213 grs lead FP-BB bullet

- 1.235" O.A.L.

- CCI small pistol primers

I loaded them all with Vitavuori N320, to obtain the following results:

- 3.6 grs, 795 fps, 169 PF

- 3.9 grs, 828 fps, 176 PF

- 4.2 grs, 873 fps, 186 PF

Velocities measured out of my 5" SVI.

For listed loads ES vas in the 20/30 fps ballpark.

HTH

Edited March 6, 2006 by Skywalker

[COF]

Presision Bullets has been planning to produce 220/.40 bullets for some time now and Dave says he will get to them this summer. They're taking a back seat to a new 9mm bullet due to popular demand.

If any of you who are interested in a 220/.40 would email Dave and let him know you are good for an order it may raise the priority level. We need to show him that he can recoup his investment on the die sooner than what it looks like now. There are only 3 people who are bugging him to make them.

I used a 220 D&J lead bullet years ago (no longer available) and it was a sweet poo-poo load for IPSC major.

http://www.precisionbullets.com/

Are these going to be RN bullets or FP?

[10mmdave]

Ok, I have some data to share. That load of 5.5 grains of Longshot with Winchester Nickel plated 40 cases, Federal Small Pistol Primers and 220 gr West coast plated bullets. I made 176 Power factor out of a 6.5" 610. I was pleasantly surprised that I'd hit it pretty much where I wanted to. Average velocity was about 800 fps. It felt less snappy than comparable power factor loads with 180's would feel like. I could easily load upward if I wanted to, but this may just be the perfect Major load for IPSC revolver for me. Accuracy was just ok and I didn't get to bench it, but it seemed to do ok at about 35 yards distant. D.Carden shot 6 through it and they stayed pretty much where he pointed things.

I may try it with Universal clays and I'll report my findings later..

Vince

And what was your OAL ??

Presision Bullets has been planning to produce 220/.40 bullets for some time now and Dave says he will get to them this summer. They're taking a back seat to a new 9mm bullet due to popular demand.

http://www.precisionbullets.com/

Are these going to be RN bullets or FP?

Ditto... (course I guess I should just email/call precision )

[sargenv]

And what was your OAL ??

Um.. these were the loads that I started the thread with

1.295"

Dan gave me the gun back Saturday so I could shoot the postal match with it. While I had it, I put some rounds over the chrono. This was one of them. I gave it back to him to make my firing pin a bit sharper as I was getting misfires from what appeared to be a rounded firing pin. He said he'd probably have it back to me this week and I'll load some more testing ammo maybe tonight for tomorrow or Weds. Most of our IPSC shots are under 35 yards. Since I had 1000 or so, these will probably be what I use till the sectional match in 2 months. For ICORE I prefer the 140 RN's from Bear creek. Dan said I looked like a kid in a candy store.

I also picked up some of the Berry's 155 Plated hollow-based round nosed bullets. I tried them with Red Dot and Titegroup and they produced decent accuracy. In other words, they were not all over the place and could mostly hold the group within the A zone on a ICORE Tombstone target. I'll be playing a bit more with these since I got 1k anyway. D.Carden (Dan) says he had really good results in his 625 with the 45 caliber version (185 HB-RN).

Vince

Edited March 6, 2006 by sargenv

[haras]

Are these going to be RN bullets or FP?

RNFP - Round Nose Flat Points

Check out the web site and you can see what that looks like. I'm using the 200gr now and they fall in.

[10mmdave]

And what was your OAL ??

Um.. these were the loads that I started the thread with

1.295"

Thanks, guess I should have remembered

[sargenv]

Personally, I'd prefer that if anyone were making a heavyweight bullet in 40 cal, it should be in a round nose and not a RN-FP since that is already available. There are so few actual RN bullets that I can find for 40 cal. Berry's makes that hollow based 155, and I think they have a regular based 155, Bear creek makes a 140, Lasercast makes a 185, but I don't like lead bullets without a coating on them and um... that's pretty much it.

The only reason I'm using the West coast 220's is that's the heaviest I could find but I actually prefer a true round nose.

Vince

[Mustang1]

I once played with 220 Gr. lead bullets. Even shot them at the Limited Nationals, once. This was in my 10MM bottom feeder. Load was 3.4 of Clays (green container) in 10MM cases with OAL of 1.245.

[COF]

Personally, I'd prefer that if anyone were making a heavyweight bullet in 40 cal, it should be in a round nose and not a RN-FP since that is already available.

Amen to that! Rainier used to have 200 gr RN bullets in their inventory, but don't anymore. Berry's also makes a 180 gr RN. I've shot both the 155 and the 180 in my 610 and my 646 with good results.

Edited March 7, 2006 by COF

[sargenv]

Bear creek apparently used to make a moly coated 220 in 40 since I have a 100 pack of them. But they aren't listed in their current online catalog. Maybe the owner made these up as a trial run and never marketed them, I don't know. I will see if I can ask a shooter who talks to the owner regularly. They are in a truncated cone flat point and have no grooves for grease like other moly coated bullets do. In other words, the sides are straight till they truncate in. I only have 100 of these and am probably not going to load them for IPSC.

Vince

[SIX SHOT]

Bear creek apparently used to make a moly coated 220 in 40 since I have a 100 pack of them. But they aren't listed in their current online catalog. Maybe the owner made these up as a trial run and never marketed them, I don't know. I will see if I can ask a shooter who talks to the owner regularly. They are in a truncated cone flat point and have no grooves for grease like other moly coated bullets do. In other words, the sides are straight till they truncate in. I only have 100 of these and am probably not going to load them for IPSC.

Vince

Chey-Cast in Cheyenne, Wyoming makes a wonderful 200 gr. RN using a Magma mould, I have the same mould & they come out 205 grs. using wheel weights. My load in 40 S&W cases is, 3.7 grs. of WST & of course Federal primers, this loads clocks 171 PF out of my 6 1/2" 610 S&W.

Dick

Wear your seat belt, that way you wouldn't have to walk back to the wreck!