DeepFried Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 Historically, I would agree with your comments about primers and their impact. At this point, I have lots of data showing comparing primer brands as the only variable. I’m not the only person reporting these findings. Consistently lower velocity‘s around 30 ft./s and consistently higher spreads in extremes. I theorize The powder is not getting full ignition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbzero Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Seoderus said: Historically, I would agree with your comments about primers and their impact. At this point, I have lots of data showing comparing primer brands as the only variable. I’m not the only person reporting these findings. Consistently lower velocity‘s around 30 ft./s and consistently higher spreads in extremes. I theorize The powder is not getting full ignition I can only say what I've seen, but if there is any parallel to rifle loading, I agree on the full ignition theory. Often if I am getting bad ES/SD's with WSR's, switching to either CCI 41's or Rem 7.5's will improve those numbers considerably. In those cases, I'm basically going from a standard primer to a magnum primer, so better/more consistent ignition has always been my running theory. I haven't really observed it in pistols so much, and have just assumed that such an effect would be far less pronounced with such small charges. On the other hand, it does seem like some powders benefit while others don't really benefit much on the rifle side of things, so another possibility is that the pistol powders I've typically used just don't need that extra "oomph" for consistent ignition. My current charge for USPSA loads is 3.3gr of Prima SV under a 135gr RMR MW, so maybe I'd see this effect if I was using one of the slower ones people use where they are dropping 5.5-6.5gr... Edited February 23 by fbzero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeilAndrew Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 3 hours ago, fbzero said: Before I ran out of them, I picked up a 1050 from a guy that was getting out of pistol reloading and never had another problem once my brass was getting swaged during the loading process. That's helpful! Thanks a bunch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cltpewpew Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 7 hours ago, fbzero said: I grabbed some and would do it again based on my first trip with them. Only loaded up a small batch to start with to check things on the chrono with my current load and make sure they go bang, etc. Initial thoughts are below. -They seat easy enough, not super tight like the Ginex I used during the Obama shortages. -Some people have reported that they are "hard", but my S2 with an 11.5lb mainspring/extended CGW firing pin set them off without issues. May or may not be harder than some others, but that's a pretty light mainspring, so I'm thinking people must be taking things to extremes with their trigger work or weren't getting them fully seated. -Compared to the Fiocchi's I have been using, the ES and SD were a bit higher, but still pretty good. If you're one of those people loading to 127PF, throw 10-20 rounds over the chrono and make sure you aren't going to get bit. If I throw out the one round that was the biggest outlier, the ES/SD are almost identical, so maybe just something related to the mixed range brass I use or a light powder drop, etc. I had to move to 13lb spring. With the 11.5 I had a couple light per match. Very since changing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbzero Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 14 minutes ago, Cltpewpew said: I had to move to 13lb spring. With the 11.5 I had a couple light per match. Very since changing. Out of curiosity, are you using the stock firing pin or an extended one? In addition to the 11.5lb, I have the extended firing pin, so perhaps that is what's making the difference... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlockCanMan Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 You should never take anyone else's word. Send me a case of them and I will perform an independent study and test for you. And give you the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cltpewpew Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 On 2/23/2024 at 5:30 PM, fbzero said: Out of curiosity, are you using the stock firing pin or an extended one? In addition to the 11.5lb, I have the extended firing pin, so perhaps that is what's making the difference... I have the extended from Cajun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeepFried Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 2 hours ago, Cltpewpew said: I have the extended from Cajun. What type of press are you using. Maybe adjustable seating depth plays a role Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cltpewpew Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 1 hour ago, Seoderus said: What type of press are you using. Maybe adjustable seating depth plays a role I’m using a Lee so it’s not adjustable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbzero Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 On 2/25/2024 at 11:00 AM, Cltpewpew said: I’m using a Lee so it’s not adjustable. I'm using a 1050, so my brass is getting swaged making it pretty easy to seat primers. Sometimes foreign primers can be just a bit larger in diameter making them harder to seat than our domestic ones, which has bit me with Ginex primers on a 650 before. Sometimes they'd look fully seated, but it would take two strikes to set them off still. That stopped as soon as I started loading 9mm on the 1050 though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m700 Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 I bought a case of 5k and I cant get them to run in anything but 2011's. 4 different sigs will fire second strike only. Only loaded 200 to test. but loaded 2k in tubes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jubi351 Posted February 29 Share Posted February 29 (edited) Generally if they fire on second strike the primers are not seated fully. Edited February 29 by jubi351 Add text Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
392heminut Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 4 hours ago, jubi351 said: Generally if they fire on second strike the primers are not seated fully. Yup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savagemann Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 I'm 250 rounds in with the Servicios and they have all gone bang. The first 100 were loaded on a Dillon 650. The remainder I did a little testing with hand priming tools....from squishing them until they were flat, to seating them with moderate/heavy pressure a little beyond fully seated. All were good. Firing them mostly in my Glock 17 with 5lbs striker spring and 13lbs recoil spring. Also in stock g17 and g19 as well. ES and SD are not bad. Very close to Win and Federal SPP. Maybe around 1fps higher SD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrior75 Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 I have used about 5,000 so far with out any issues. Them seat easy and my guns have no trouble igniting them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murzikrv Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Used 10K of them. No issues, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbzero Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 (edited) Just wanted to follow up on this after getting more rounds loaded with these primers down range. -My first range trip to chrono/test was 50 rounds, no issues. -After this, I brought 200 to a local USPSA match and ended up having a single light strike, which went off on the second strike. Didn't read too much into it at that time. -Took another 200 out for testing purposes yesterday and had two more light strikes that both went off on second strike. Firearm is a S2 w/ CGW pro kit installed, 11.5lb hammer spring, extended firing pin, etc. Never had any light strikes with Fiocchi or WSP, so assuming the issue is that the primers are indeed harder at this point. Have installed the 13lb hammer spring for now to see if the issue goes away, and if it does, will keep it in until I shoot through the SA primers. Not knocking the primers at all, some are harder than others and we can make our firearms less reliable when we change internals. Just the nature of the beast. Edited March 13 by fbzero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodair Posted March 13 Author Share Posted March 13 Yes I agree with your experience. I now have about 500 rounds down range using these primers. I had no real malfunctions using a STI 2011. Lately I have been shooting a couple single stack guns. An officer and commander and have had a few ftf issues. All fired the second shot. I would say one or two in a hundred. Good for practice but would not be good at a match. I wish there was an alternative at this price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cltpewpew Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 4 hours ago, fbzero said: Just wanted to follow up on this after getting more rounds loaded with these primers down range. -My first range trip to chrono/test was 50 rounds, no issues. -After this, I brought 200 to a local USPSA match and ended up having a single light strike, which went off on the second strike. Didn't read too much into it at that time. -Took another 200 out for testing purposes yesterday and had two more light strikes that both went off on second strike. Firearm is a S2 w/ CGW pro kit installed, 11.5lb hammer spring, extended firing pin, etc. Never had any light strikes with Fiocchi or WSP, so assuming the issue is that the primers are indeed harder at this point. Have installed the 13lb hammer spring for now to see if the issue goes away, and if it does, will keep it in until I shoot through the SA primers. Not knocking the primers at all, some are harder than others and we can make our firearms less reliable when we change internals. Just the nature of the beast. I moved to 13 lb spring and have only had 1 light strike on last 5k or so rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
392heminut Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 6 hours ago, fbzero said: Just wanted to follow up on this after getting more rounds loaded with these primers down range. -My first range trip to chrono/test was 50 rounds, no issues. -After this, I brought 200 to a local USPSA match and ended up having a single light strike, which went off on the second strike. Didn't read too much into it at that time. -Took another 200 out for testing purposes yesterday and had two more light strikes that both went off on second strike. I had the same issue with my Prodigy, started getting light primer strikes when I had never had an issue before using other primers. They all fired with a second strike. I replaced the titanium factory firing pin with a steel one and the issue seems to have gone away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbzero Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 Had the 13lb CGW spring in, but it did have a considerable effect on the DA pull. Got my hands on a 12lb Eric Grauffel spring from BSPS and it felt considerably nicer than the 13lb, so I rolled the dice and took it out to a match this weekend with more of the SA primed ammo. No more light strikes so far, so hoping that extra little bit is all I needed for reliability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbzero Posted March 25 Share Posted March 25 So far since putting in the 12lb mainspring, I've done two matches and a practice session without any more light strike issues with the SA primers. It's close enough to the 11.5lb spring on the trigger pull that I'll probably just leave it that way even after running out of the SA primers. Hopefully that will help some of the other S2 shooters using them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted March 25 Share Posted March 25 My stock Staccato CS doesn't like these primers. It's possible they were seated 100%, but my other 2011 with a 15 lbs hammer spring and ext. firing pin has no trouble with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddjob Posted March 25 Share Posted March 25 Stock Staccato XL and a Sig 320 X5. About 2K used without a problem in the XL and about 500 through the Sig without a problem. If it matters I use a 1050 to load 9mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yeti Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 (edited) No failures using the Servicios primers in three different pistols...a stock G34 and 2011 as well as a P16 (both with 19# mainsprings). Edited March 30 by Yeti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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