davidb72 Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 Our local IDPA club generally runs a low light stage every month on our indoor range. Since IDPA decided to allow weapon mounted lights it has become just about mandatory to have one if you want to be competitive on that stage (and in the overall). Would you support a separation of the haves and the have nots re: weapon mounted lights? I have two really nice 1911's that I used to enjoy shooting at the IDPA matches in ESP division but stopped shooting them since they don't have a light rail and I was getting slaughtered in the results trying to use a handheld light for the stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 Is there any rules against railed 1911's? It seems like a great opportunity to buy one if not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 Yes, I'd support differentiating between weapon mounted and handheld/no light Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deerslayer Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 This is why I didn’t want lights allowed in the first place. If it were up to me, activating a WML during the COF would result in a DQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runswithwood1 Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 Looks like a good opportunity to NEED a railed 1911 now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 I don't really understand any reason not to have a wml in IDPA. It would seem like those two would go together like peanut butter and jelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deerslayer Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 33 minutes ago, RJH said: I don't really understand any reason not to have a wml in IDPA. It would seem like those two would go together like peanut butter and jelly IDPA was supposed to be the anti-equipment race game. Requiring anyone who wants to be competitive to go buy a new gun, light, and holster seems contradictory, especially when many people have no business even putting a WML on their carry gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 I remember when having a ring on a hand held flashlight was bridge too far in idpa..... And I also remember making sure I had a handheld flashlight in my bag at all times, as some sort of lowlight scenario was sure to be at most matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deerslayer Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 (edited) 21 minutes ago, rowdyb said: I remember when having a ring on a hand held flashlight was bridge too far in idpa..... And I also remember making sure I had a handheld flashlight in my bag at all times, as some sort of lowlight scenario was sure to be at most matches. I’ve shot a lot of sanctioned IDPA matches and have encountered low light stages twice. One years ago was no flashlight allowed and last year in IL State was handheld light only. Maybe low light is a new trend, at least in places I don’t go. I hope that’s not the case. I don’t think low light stages belong in sanctioned matches. Edited September 18 by deerslayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted September 18 Share Posted September 18 1 hour ago, deerslayer said: IDPA was supposed to be the anti-equipment race game. Requiring anyone who wants to be competitive to go buy a new gun, light, and holster seems contradictory, especially when many people have no business even putting a WML on their carry gun. I thought the d stood for defensive, a wml seems like equipment that ought to almost be required for that game. Not sure why anybody would have no business putting a wml on their carry gun. Identifying targets sounds like a wonderful idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deerslayer Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 (edited) 2 hours ago, RJH said: I thought the d stood for defensive, a wml seems like equipment that ought to almost be required for that game. A competent carry gun does not require a light to be attached to it. 2 hours ago, RJH said: Not sure why anybody would have no business putting a wml on their carry gun. Identifying targets sounds like a wonderful idea A citizen with a carry permit pointing his gun at or even toward an unknown person to identify them is asking for it. Edited September 19 by deerslayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 7 minutes ago, deerslayer said: A competent carry gun does not require a light to be attached to it. But it doesn't hurt anything 7 minutes ago, deerslayer said: A citizen with a carry permit pointing his gun at or even toward an unknown person to identify them is asking for it. This would depend on a lot of things and would sometimes but, not remotely always, be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deerslayer Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 6 minutes ago, RJH said: But it doesn't hurt anything This would depend on a lot of things and would sometimes but, not remotely always, be true. I completely agree. This is why I said many people don’t need them (as opposed to NOBODY needs them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerTrace Posted September 19 Share Posted September 19 Thankfully, our club does not do the low light stages at our indoor matches. I'm not opposed to having a light on my duty gun, but I don't want to buy all new holsters to run a light at matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb72 Posted September 20 Author Share Posted September 20 The equipment race argument is a good one. There is no way you can be competitive without a WML when the stage allows one. I don't really want another 1911 - I like the ones that I have and they are all without rails. For competitive equity I would support splitting it into WML - non WML because it is such an advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilk73 Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 2 hours ago, davidb72 said: The equipment race argument is a good one. There is no way you can be competitive without a WML when the stage allows one. I don't really want another 1911 - I like the ones that I have and they are all without rails. For competitive equity I would support splitting it into WML - non WML because it is such an advantage. Is it WSSA? They run a great IDPA match and they always do an indoor lights out. I kill it on that stage every month with my weapon mounted light. James Cantrell also does really well on that stage and he doesn’t use a weapon mounted light. So there is both sides of the coin. As far as purpose if I’m in my house and something goes bump in the night. I have no problem holding my light low enough to not point it at anyone but be ready to point it at someone once a threat is identified. A really bright light with wide bloom makes that possible. I don’t support splitting it up into two divisions. There are not enough low light shoots to even warrant that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted September 20 Share Posted September 20 I'm thinking matches 8n the western US, 2012 to 2015 is when I seem3d to see it very frequently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHicks Posted September 21 Share Posted September 21 Is every division going to be seperated by wml or not? Or just for fun list them separately on only the low light stage? How would you make separating the two work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb72 Posted September 21 Author Share Posted September 21 3 hours ago, Twilk73 said: Is it WSSA? They run a great IDPA match and they always do an indoor lights out. I kill it on that stage every month with my weapon mounted light. James Cantrell also does really well on that stage and he doesn’t use a weapon mounted light. So there is both sides of the coin. As far as purpose if I’m in my house and something goes bump in the night. I have no problem holding my light low enough to not point it at anyone but be ready to point it at someone once a threat is identified. A really bright light with wide bloom makes that possible. I don’t support splitting it up into two divisions. There are not enough low light shoots to even warrant that. Yes, it is definitely the best IDPA match in the area. I might just skip that stage in the future - probably better for my lead levels to stay out of the indoor range anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted September 21 Share Posted September 21 NcStar 1911 Pistol Accessory Rail Adapter (MAD1911) https://a.co/d/07mo3I6 Maybe this is in your future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb72 Posted September 21 Author Share Posted September 21 3 minutes ago, RJH said: NcStar 1911 Pistol Accessory Rail Adapter (MAD1911) https://a.co/d/07mo3I6 Maybe this is in your future NcStar makes some nice stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilk73 Posted September 21 Share Posted September 21 33 minutes ago, davidb72 said: NcStar makes some nice stuff. What are you doing over here in the IDPA section Dave! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb72 Posted September 21 Author Share Posted September 21 12 hours ago, Twilk73 said: What are you doing over here in the IDPA section Dave! IDPA is my first love and where I got my start in practical shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe4d Posted September 21 Share Posted September 21 On 9/18/2023 at 5:24 PM, RJH said: I thought the d stood for defensive, a wml seems like equipment that ought to almost be required for that game. Not sure why anybody would have no business putting a wml on their carry gun. Identifying targets sounds like a wonderful idea becasue they end up being used as flash lights,, not aiming devices.. nothing like watching a cop point a loaded AR at a baby in a car seat, because thats where his flash light is. Show me someone with a WML and I will show you someone pointing loaded guns at people they shouldnt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted September 21 Share Posted September 21 (edited) 1 hour ago, Joe4d said: becasue they end up being used as flash lights,, not aiming devices.. nothing like watching a cop point a loaded AR at a baby in a car seat, because thats where his flash light is. Show me someone with a WML and I will show you someone pointing loaded guns at people they shouldnt. Why is it I feel like there was some extenuating circumstances you're not divulging? Like had the car just been used in a robbery? Where you might think somebody in the back seat could be a threat Did they drag the driver of the car out because they'd been chasing him after drug deals? Where you might think somebody in the backseat could be a threat Or was there just a car sitting there and a cop wanted to look in and so he immediately grabbed his AR with flashlight and started pointing it around the minivan at the Little League game? Edited September 21 by RJH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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