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Canik Rival-S with all the goodies!


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11 hours ago, WxGuy said:

Simple.  If making changes, do ONE at a time to evaluate.

For example, when my gun arrives this week, I'll clean/lube it first then take it outside to my range and fire the first 100 rounds with hot 115/124 ammo.  Then I'll get out the ammo I like to run and see if the gun chokes on it.  I'll assess one thing at a time from there as the gun parts break in.  I like the process.  What works for the poly may not obtain the same result for the metal gun.  This is a great forum isn't it?!

In a lot of cases I agree but in his case and mine we both already have rivals we basically the same mods on the plastic guns and know what works and what doesn’t. Only real difference is some weight so should really just need to mess with recoil springs to get it to track right.

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I hear you.  I sold my Rival poly because the work I did on my SFX made it shoot better.  Initially without the gun, I think you are correct on the recoil springs.  Hopefully I can get 5-600 rounds in it before thinking about making mods if needed.

Edited by WxGuy
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11 hours ago, WxGuy said:

I hear you.  I sold my Rival poly because the work I did on my SFX made it shoot better.  Initially without the gun, I think you are correct on the recoil springs.  Hopefully I can get 5-600 rounds in it before thinking about making mods if needed.

Just got back from the range with mine. Shot it side by side with the polymer gun. It’s a nice gun and there’s definitely less dot bounce but maybe since I’m more used to the plastic gun inwas shooting them pretty equally but slightly better hits with the plastic gun. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Have any of you guys who were leaning more towards your polymer Rivals had a chance to shoot your steel Rivals more? Any change of heart, or other observations? I’ve got both now (poly and steel). I really like the poly. I haven’t shot the steel yet (just got it today), but I really dig the weight and the way it feels in hand. All I’ve been able to do is some dry fire to this point, and it moves and handles pretty good for me. Of course, live fire may render different results. 

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It will be interesting to hear what you think of the comparison! 

 

Use the same ammo so it's a really good side by side run.  Some say it's too heavy and when I shot my TP9 SFX side by side to the Rival Steel, give me steel/weight everyday.  But then again, I prefer a gun in the 41-43oz range.  I put the small grip back on because I was able to hit the mag release better with it.  For me, the "Arch" Rival likes 124-125g projectiles. 

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Ok playing devils advocate here. Doesn’t he have to say the Steel is better ? 
Did you hear him say he was non committal about shooting the steel gun in competition.

It will be interesting to see which gun he competes with in 2023. But I think the mothership will want him to shoot the Steel Rival.

 

So for the guys that have the Steel Rival……….is it better than the polymer gun in competition ?

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8 hours ago, WxGuy said:

Page 21 of the Rival-S manual has all of the plates with sight interfaces.  I'm sure the poly Rival and any other optic ready pistol manuals will have the information.

 

I can't seem to find a recommendation for in lbs of torque to set the screws for the plate/optic with. Do you or anyone else have a guidance for this? 

 

EDIT Heard back from Canik "Hand tighten screws and let the helicoil do the work" and there's no maintenance schedule per say but just to replace all springs around 7500-10,000 rounds.

 

I hope this helps others🙂

Edited by Itgma
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9 hours ago, Itgma said:

 

I can't seem to find a recommendation for in lbs of torque to set the screws for the plate/optic with. Do you or anyone else have a guidance for this? 

 

EDIT Heard back from Canik "Hand tighten screws and let the helicoil do the work" and there's no maintenance schedule per say but just to replace all springs around 7500-10,000 rounds.

 

I hope this helps others🙂

I do 15 inch pounds on the plate and 12 on the optic. I go with that on all my guns and haven’t had any issues. 

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On 2/23/2023 at 3:00 AM, WxGuy said:

Page 21 of the Rival-S manual has all of the plates with sight interfaces.  I'm sure the poly Rival and any other optic ready pistol manuals will have the information.

So you have to buy the gun BEFORE you find out what sights are compatible.  I don't own the gun.

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I finally made it out to the range to put some rounds through the Rival S. About 200 or so. I like it. But then I have always liked heavier pistols, and have done things to polymer framed pistols to make them heavier. At any rate, the load I was shooting consisted of The Blue Bullets 135gr over 3.6gr of Prima V at an OAL of 1.115". I've used this load before in my P320s and GLOCKS. The S shot very soft and flat. I haven't put a dot on it yet, but the front sight tracked beautifully. As far as transitions and gun handling, I thought the S does those well, and for me the extra weight is an advantage as I tend to transition more precisely with a heavier gun. 

 

I had a polymer Rival with an SRO on it with me, and towards the end of the session I shot Wilson's 5x5 Drill with it and the S (with irons) just to compare. My score with the S was about 5% better, and what it came down to was splits. It was easier to pull quicker splits, a couple hundredths faster, with the S. I need to shoot some more drills involving more gun handling and transitions to further compare, but first impression from shooting the S is it's a hell of a pistol with a lot of potential. That, and I really enjoy shooting it....and all of my Caniks for that matter. It's going to be fun to work with the S some more see what it can do.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Got my Rival-S in... Ready to sell my S2. Questions I have so far:

Which Sprinco guide rod system goes with the Rival-S? This one is for the Rival... Is the guide rod/spring the same between guns? I had a W74 Tungsten rod for the TP9SFX I had and it sticks out the front of the slide on the Rival-S.

Anyone have a line on grip screws? I already have lost one after 3 range sessions and one has one thread left after a bit of misalignment swapping grips.

 

Love the gun.

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On 3/12/2023 at 12:55 PM, Slow250 said:

Got my Rival-S in... Ready to sell my S2. Questions I have so far:

Which Sprinco guide rod system goes with the Rival-S? This one is for the Rival... Is the guide rod/spring the same between guns? I had a W74 Tungsten rod for the TP9SFX I had and it sticks out the front of the slide on the Rival-S.

Anyone have a line on grip screws? I already have lost one after 3 range sessions and one has one thread left after a bit of misalignment swapping grips.

 

Love the gun.

I used tungsten rods with commander 1911 springs. I’ve settle on the 15 pound. 
 

I'm not surprised on the grip screw getting lost. That seems to be a questionable design. I’m going to throw some vibratight on mine I think

On 3/13/2023 at 7:17 AM, Seoderus said:

Every time I see a comment about selling a S2, I become much more intrigued by these pistols. Guess I need to get my hands on one and check it out.

I switched from shadow 2s to the polymer rival and was very happy with the switch. Im even happier now with the steel. 

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Got out to shoot my S some more today. As per recommendations, I installed a Wolff guide with a 15# recoil spring. This set up performed really well. The little bit of muzzle dip I was perceiving during my previous session went away. I have a tungsten guide rod for it, but don’t know if I’ll try it in this pistol. As it is, the weight is an asset, and it transitions nicely. The doggone thing is just fun to shoot. Looking forward to doing more work with it.

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  • 4 weeks later...

To add to this topic, I'll say I've been very disappointed in my Rival-S. I've yet to not have an issue.  Firstly the grip panels are horrible. The small size that came stock fits well. The other two sizes (which I prefer) don't fit properly. The holes in the grip don't align properly with the holes in the frame so its impossible to get purchase of enough threads on the screw to keep the screw in. I contacted Canik and they immediately responded by saying they'll send new grip panels. Almost 4 weeks later they're still "waiting to ship." The main issue is failures to feed or go into battery.  I shoot 147 grain (coated and fmj) projectiles at a power factor of 129-130 with an OAL of 1.155. These loads work in all of my guns perfectly. WIth the stock recoil spring, the slide wouldn't fully cycle and I'd get fails to eject.  My coach is a GM who only shoots the polymer canik. He recommended a tungsten guiderod and a 14 or 15lbs wolff colt commander spring. With the 14 and 15 lbs springs, the recoil spring wasn't strong enough to get the slide back into battery. I have to kick it with my palm.  I installed a 17lb spring but haven't had time to get to the range to test it. But just in dry cycling the gun, the 17 seems to be the better choice. The few times I was able to shoot the gun without malfunction I did notice the recoil impulse isn't good. It tends to drop the nose of the barrel when coming back to zero from the recoil.


So far I've had nothing but annoyances and am not a big fan of the gun. I plan to get it up and cycling properly and then I plan to sell it and stick with my Accushadows. 

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15 minutes ago, rddvet said:

To add to this topic, I'll say I've been very disappointed in my Rival-S. I've yet to not have an issue.  Firstly the grip panels are horrible. The small size that came stock fits well. The other two sizes (which I prefer) don't fit properly. The holes in the grip don't align properly with the holes in the frame so its impossible to get purchase of enough threads on the screw to keep the screw in. I contacted Canik and they immediately responded by saying they'll send new grip panels. Almost 4 weeks later they're still "waiting to ship." The main issue is failures to feed or go into battery.  I shoot 147 grain (coated and fmj) projectiles at a power factor of 129-130 with an OAL of 1.155. These loads work in all of my guns perfectly. WIth the stock recoil spring, the slide wouldn't fully cycle and I'd get fails to eject.  My coach is a GM who only shoots the polymer canik. He recommended a tungsten guiderod and a 14 or 15lbs wolff colt commander spring. With the 14 and 15 lbs springs, the recoil spring wasn't strong enough to get the slide back into battery. I have to kick it with my palm.  I installed a 17lb spring but haven't had time to get to the range to test it. But just in dry cycling the gun, the 17 seems to be the better choice. The few times I was able to shoot the gun without malfunction I did notice the recoil impulse isn't good. It tends to drop the nose of the barrel when coming back to zero from the recoil.


So far I've had nothing but annoyances and am not a big fan of the gun. I plan to get it up and cycling properly and then I plan to sell it and stick with my Accushadows. 

Sounds like one issue is that your rounds are possibly too long. My 125 BBI barely passes plunk at 1.110"

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12 minutes ago, rddvet said:

The main issue is failures to feed or go into battery.  I shoot 147 grain (coated and fmj) projectiles at a power factor of 129-130 with an OAL of 1.155. These loads work in all of my guns perfectly.


I shoot 125 gr. BBIs and load them to 1.100". 

If you pull the barrel and drop a round in the chamber, can you twist the base of the case and have it spin freely? If not, you have three main choices:

1. Incrementally shorten the OAL until the rounds plunk, then shorten another 0.025" or so and load there.
2. Ream the throat longer so it accommodates your ammo.
3. Sell the gun and switch to one that runs your ammo.
 

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26 minutes ago, Andreas said:


I shoot 125 gr. BBIs and load them to 1.100". 

If you pull the barrel and drop a round in the chamber, can you twist the base of the case and have it spin freely? If not, you have three main choices:

1. Incrementally shorten the OAL until the rounds plunk, then shorten another 0.025" or so and load there.
2. Ream the throat longer so it accommodates your ammo.
3. Sell the gun and switch to one that runs your ammo.
 

I chose option 2 for my sfx.  Having to load shorter for one specific gun is a nuisance to me, so i found someone who can throat the hardened canik barrel and had them do it.  Well worth it

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1 hour ago, goneracin said:

I chose option 2 for my sfx.  Having to load shorter for one specific gun is a nuisance to me, so i found someone who can throat the hardened canik barrel and had them do it.  Well worth it

2 hours ago, Andreas said:


I shoot 125 gr. BBIs and load them to 1.100". 

If you pull the barrel and drop a round in the chamber, can you twist the base of the case and have it spin freely? If not, you have three main choices:

1. Incrementally shorten the OAL until the rounds plunk, then shorten another 0.025" or so and load there.
2. Ream the throat longer so it accommodates your ammo.
3. Sell the gun and switch to one that runs your ammo.
 

2 hours ago, jpm2953 said:

Sounds like one issue is that your rounds are possibly too long. My 125 BBI barely passes plunk at 1.110"

 

I tried my coach's ammo that he loads to 1.125 and had the same issue.  A few people have said to run my ammo down to 1.10, but to be honest if 1.155 works perfectly in all of my guns there's zero reason to adjust my press down for 1 gun that I'm not super sold on anyway.  I did do a plunk test and it passed just fine. Bullet freely spun in the barrel. It does seem like some of the ammo is getting stuck on the landing part of the barrel. So eventhough the plunk is fine, the length may be getting it stuck on the land as the gun is working.  Not really sure. I will reply once I get some free time to see if the 17lbs spring fixes it. I also have an 18lbs and 20lbs spring I can try, but I suspect 17 will work.  If it doesn't then the ammo probably would have to go shorter.

 

One other note, I did run syntech through it as well which is flat nose whereas my loads are round nose.  The syntech is obviously shorter than my ammo and still had the same issues.

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