GigG Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 1 hour ago, Gun1 said: You're right! I haven't. I'm trying to get into competitive USPSA production. In USPSA Production you are going to be shooting minor power factor. So you are safe with pretty much any gun on the list as far as longevity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun1 Posted November 2, 2022 Author Share Posted November 2, 2022 24 minutes ago, GigG said: In USPSA Production you are going to be shooting minor power factor. So you are safe with pretty much any gun on the list as far as longevity. I don't really like to reload though so so far I go with factory ammo. Still pretty safe as far as longevity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mcfoto Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 1 hour ago, Gun1 said: You're right! I haven't. I'm trying to get into competitive USPSA production. With that in mind, if your budget allows I’d get a CZ Shadow 2 and not look back. If that’s too expensive, Glock G34 or G17 (G34 is not on the international list). If you go Glock, go for MOS as once you get get in the game, eventually you will get a dot and join the cool kids in carry optics. Resistance is futile… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeMKY Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 2 hours ago, Gun1 said: About $2,500 here in Cali, but the problem is that there's not many of them since they can only be obtained through ppt from someone coming into CA, and since most people are leaving CA, Lol. Yes, it's been challenged many times, the two most relevant ones one ended in the CA Supreme Court where the biased liberal court upheld the ridiculous law, and the other ended with an en blanc review in the 9th Circus Court of Appeals which also upheld the ridiculous. There's a new one, but unless SCOTUS intervenes I don't see it going anywhere either. 2500 for a Sig P320 FCU that you can get from gun broker for 350 and have shipped to an FFL near you. Are they charging 2k for FFL fee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GigG Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 4 hours ago, Gun1 said: I don't really like to reload though so so far I go with factory ammo. Still pretty safe as far as longevity? There is minor PF 9mm you can buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DenC Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 (edited) I am not sure if aluminum handgun frames or even stainless steel frames can be rewelded. I have been through the rabbit hole of looking for a "forever" gun that can do all the other things I wanted. Was looking for a double stack 9mm, carbon or stainless steel framed handgun or handgun family with a drop/firing pin safety that I can someday give to my kids, use to shoot ipsc with and use as a defensive weapon. Would also prefer for the gun have the least amount of plastic or rubber for its parts. I only had 3 options when I started this search: CZ B series, Tanfoglio (and the rebranded Armscor MAP steel frame series), and IWI Jericho 941. (Didnt know about Sarsilmaz then) I chose to go with Tanfoglio/Armscor. They have carbon steel frames, have drop safeties (including in their competition models), are very nice for IPSC production division or even carry optics, a better design with regards to the firing pin safety (vs CZ B series) IMO, no plastic parts to replace (eg plastic guide rod in the CZ B series) and more models to choose from vs the IWI Jericho steel frame which only has 2 variants. I have 2 of them already and plan on getting more. One will be used for competition and another will be for competition backup. Another 2 will be kept to give to the kids later on and to shoot occasionally and another 2 will be kept for defensive use (in case they will be used I expect these to be surrendered to police, hopefully never have to use them!) This is also a good justification to have more guns But if I do get really deep into IPSC and am able wear out my main competition gun, I am ready to replace it. If Im feeling stingy might have it rewelded and rebuilt. Of course if I feel the main competition gun is worn out I also can swap it with the back up competition gun and relegate the first gun to backup. Just dont know if the Tanfoglios (or derivatives like the Armscor steel framed MAP1, Jericho or Sarsilmaz) are approved in California. Edited November 3, 2022 by DenC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun1 Posted November 3, 2022 Author Share Posted November 3, 2022 2 hours ago, DenC said: I am not sure if aluminum handgun frames or even stainless steel frames can be rewelded. I have been through the rabbit hole of looking for a "forever" gun that can do all the other things I wanted. Was looking for a double stack 9mm, carbon or stainless steel framed handgun or handgun family with a drop/firing pin safety that I can someday give to my kids, use to shoot ipsc with and use as a defensive weapon. Would also prefer for the gun have the least amount of plastic or rubber for its parts. I only had 3 options when I started this search: CZ B series, Tanfoglio (and the rebranded Armscor MAP steel frame series), and IWI Jericho 941. (Didnt know about Sarsilmaz then) I chose to go with Tanfoglio/Armscor. They have carbon steel frames, have drop safeties (including in their competition models), are very nice for IPSC production division or even carry optics, a better design with regards to the firing pin safety (vs CZ B series) IMO, no plastic parts to replace (eg plastic guide rod in the CZ B series) and more models to choose from vs the IWI Jericho steel frame which only has 2 variants. I have 2 of them already and plan on getting more. One will be used for competition and another will be for competition backup. Another 2 will be kept to give to the kids later on and to shoot occasionally and another 2 will be kept for defensive use (in case they will be used I expect these to be surrendered to police, hopefully never have to use them!) This is also a good justification to have more guns But if I do get really deep into IPSC and am able wear out my main competition gun, I am ready to replace it. If Im feeling stingy might have it rewelded and rebuilt. Of course if I feel the main competition gun is worn out I also can swap it with the back up competition gun and relegate the first gun to backup. Just dont know if the Tanfoglios (or derivatives like the Armscor steel framed MAP1, Jericho or Sarsilmaz) are approved in California. Nice plan for eight guns, Lol. Unfortunately the Tangfolio isn't sold here in CA, or any of the other ones you mentioned for that matter. The only one sold here in CA is the CZ Sp 01 75, but not the shadow version. I've been thinking about getting one of these but since it's not the shadow version I looked at having the slide milled for optics but couldn't find replacement slides amd have heard that CZ won't replace just the slide? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 7 hours ago, Gun1 said: Nice plan for eight guns, Lol. Unfortunately the Tangfolio isn't sold here in CA, or any of the other ones you mentioned for that matter. The only one sold here in CA is the CZ Sp 01 75, but not the shadow version. I've been thinking about getting one of these but since it's not the shadow version I looked at having the slide milled for optics but couldn't find replacement slides amd have heard that CZ won't replace just the slide? Are SP-01's reasonable priced at least? People go over board on guns. You don't really need a Shadow. You don't really even need to cajunize guns like everyone seems to do. Drop in a $7 hammer spring and learn to shoot the gun. So your trigger is going to have a little longer reset and more pretravel for the firing pin block. It's really not a big deal at all. I'm currently shooting a P-01, I could buy 4 of theses setup the same for the price of just one of your 320 FCU's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun1 Posted November 3, 2022 Author Share Posted November 3, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Racinready300ex said: Are SP-01's reasonable priced at least? People go over board on guns. You don't really need a Shadow. You don't really even need to cajunize guns like everyone seems to do. Drop in a $7 hammer spring and learn to shoot the gun. So your trigger is going to have a little longer reset and more pretravel for the firing pin block. It's really not a big deal at all. I'm currently shooting a P-01, I could buy 4 of theses setup the same for the price of just one of your 320 FCU's. For the non-shadow I guess it's MSRP, $900 - $1k. But I really like the modularity of the P320. It's a real bummer I can't buy form an FFL here in CA. I spoke to Sig Sauer yesterday and one of their lead CS guys said eventually the FCU would fail, it would just be a matter of when, not if. Edited November 3, 2022 by Gun1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 42 minutes ago, Gun1 said: For the non-shadow I guess it's MSRP, $900 - $1k. But I really like the modularity of the P320. It's a real bummer I can't buy form an FFL here in CA. I spoke to Sig Sauer yesterday and one of their lead CS guys said eventually the FCU would fail, it would just be a matter of when, not if. Eventually all things fail. You can have two and half SP01's for the price of just a FCU. I'd go CZ all day. Then you can have a beater practice gun and a low round count match gun. And if some how you ever get to the point you wear out one of the CZ's, you can again buy two more for less than a new FCU would of been. To me it seems crazy to spend 2.5k on just a fcu. You'll easily have over 3k once you finish the gun out and its' still just a 320 that in the real world is worth less than that SP-01. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun1 Posted November 3, 2022 Author Share Posted November 3, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Racinready300ex said: Eventually all things fail. You can have two and half SP01's for the price of just a FCU. I'd go CZ all day. Then you can have a beater practice gun and a low round count match gun. And if some how you ever get to the point you wear out one of the CZ's, you can again buy two more for less than a new FCU would of been. To me it seems crazy to spend 2.5k on just a fcu. You'll easily have over 3k once you finish the gun out and its' still just a 320 that in the real world is worth less than that SP-01. Very true. The modularity of the P320 is very intriguing to me, but at that price yes, the P320's real market value is significantly less than a CZ. I wonder ehat would fail from the actual metal part of the FCU. Would it be the slide rail tabs thinning down to unusable, cracking, or another part of the FCU cracking? Because those 3 possibilities are the only ways I see the actual FCU cracking. Edited November 3, 2022 by Gun1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun1 Posted November 3, 2022 Author Share Posted November 3, 2022 Now, onto revolver frames stretching, lol. Is it true that everytime you fire a revolver the frame stretches just a tiny bit? Or does this have to do only with the aluminum revolvers more so, or what if I but a 357 mag revolver but only shoot 38 special. Will it still stretch eventually, just much slower than with full power 357 mag loads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 9 minutes ago, Gun1 said: Now, onto revolver frames stretching, lol. Is it true that everytime you fire a revolver the frame stretches just a tiny bit? Or does this have to do only with the aluminum revolvers more so, or what if I but a 357 mag revolver but only shoot 38 special. Will it still stretch eventually, just much slower than with full power 357 mag loads? Let's back up a little, how much does 9mm ammo cost out in Cali? How many rounds do you plan to shoot a year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun1 Posted November 3, 2022 Author Share Posted November 3, 2022 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Racinready300ex said: Let's back up a little, how much does 9mm ammo cost out in Cali? How many rounds do you plan to shoot a year? I get 1,500 rounds for $300. But a lot of competition shooters out here have sponsors and they burn through like 10k - 20k rounds per month. So if you get a sponsor the sky is the limit as far as round counts. That's why I was wondering around how many rounds a Sig P320 FCU lasts, because that would come out of my pocket, lol. And $3k every year if they last around 150k rounds, that's kind of high for a production handgun. Edited November 3, 2022 by Gun1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 (edited) 56 minutes ago, Gun1 said: I get 1,500 rounds for $300. But a lot of competition shooters out here have sponsors and they burn through like 10k - 20k rounds per month. So if you get a sponsor the sky is the limit as far as round counts. That's why I was wondering around how many rounds a Sig P320 FCU lasts, because that would come out of my pocket, lol. And $3k every year if they last around 150k rounds, that's kind of high for a production handgun. I think you may be mistaken. There are a lot of guys with fancy shirts, but there really aren't many getting free ammo. Even top level guys really aren't shooting 20k rounds a month. You should probably set your expectations a touch lower. Maybe be realistic with what you can fund yourself. You're going to need to establish yourself before anyone is going to give you anything let alone $50,000 in ammo a year. There really isn't any money in this sport. Besides if you get good enough to get that much free ammo, you should be able to find someone to give you a free gun too. In fact it's way easier to get a sponsorship that will give you free or discounted guns than it is to get free ammo. A sig for example would out way less to give you a $500 gun vs $50k in ammo. lol Edited November 3, 2022 by Racinready300ex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParrytheWind Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 "I get 1,500 rounds for $300",... I want this deal, as I'm seeing $0.28/cpr locally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 1 hour ago, Gun1 said: I get 1,500 rounds for $300. But a lot of competition shooters out here have sponsors and they burn through like 10k - 20k rounds per month. So if you get a sponsor the sky is the limit as far as round counts. That's why I was wondering around how many rounds a Sig P320 FCU lasts, because that would come out of my pocket, lol. And $3k every year if they last around 150k rounds, that's kind of high for a production handgun. Another thought, 150k a year so you'll be shooting about 3k a week. So that's a trip to the range every day shooting about 400 rounds. Or maybe you take a couple days off and shoot closer to 600 rounds a day. I'm guessing you'll shoot a lot of club matches too. That's a lot of shooting, your hands will be smoked but you should get better faster if you're smart about what you're doing and not just wasting ammo. Now what are you going to do for your sponsor? I'm assuming you'll shoot a lot of majors? Plan on a major costing you about $1,000. Entry fee, hotel, travel, food etc. Are you going to pay for that or will your sponsor? How many majors? I'd assume at the level of commitment you're talking about at least 10 plus nationals. So that's 11-12k out of pocket. Unless your sponsors pick it up. Let's assume they're only covering the ammo, you still need to help them sell ammo to justify the $35k worth they gave you, that's basically a full time jobs salary. And considering how many serious people in this sport reload that's going to be a tough to sell to us. Any idea what you're going to offer them to get them a ROI? Thinking about this stuff is probably more important than how you're going to come up with the money for the gun you've worn out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpaw Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 (edited) 9 hours ago, Gun1 said: I get 1,500 rounds for $300. But a lot of competition shooters out here have sponsors and they burn through like 10k - 20k rounds per month. So if you get a sponsor the sky is the limit as far as round counts. That's why I was wondering around how many rounds a Sig P320 FCU lasts, because that would come out of my pocket, lol. And $3k every year if they last around 150k rounds, that's kind of high for a production handgun. Do you currently own any firearms? Have you shot any matches yet? Edited November 4, 2022 by Southpaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich406 Posted November 4, 2022 Share Posted November 4, 2022 On 11/3/2022 at 6:18 AM, Gun1 said: For the non-shadow I guess it's MSRP, $900 - $1k. But I really like the modularity of the P320. It's a real bummer I can't buy form an FFL here in CA. I spoke to Sig Sauer yesterday and one of their lead CS guys said eventually the FCU would fail, it would just be a matter of when, not if. So, for the record, what’s the max round count you have on one single handgun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted November 4, 2022 Share Posted November 4, 2022 Why did the 2011 in carryops thread get closed yet this one still goes on...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted November 4, 2022 Share Posted November 4, 2022 25 minutes ago, RJH said: Why did the 2011 in carryops thread get closed yet this one still goes on...... Well, this one is still on topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zachjet Posted November 4, 2022 Share Posted November 4, 2022 On 11/3/2022 at 1:41 PM, Southpaw said: Do you currently own any firearms? Have you shot any matches yet? I’m wondering the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GigG Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 On 11/3/2022 at 12:41 PM, Southpaw said: Do you currently own any firearms? Have you shot any matches yet? According to the one post our OP has made that wasn't about wearing out guns... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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