No.343 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 Let me start by saying that I think highly of Starline products. I use them in 38 special. I am finally getting around to finishing my setup for a GP-100 that I had rebored to 40S&W. Harold Nicholson did a great job on that gun. The balance is great and it reloads like my old 625. The problem that I have is that the extractor groove dimension on my Starline brass is not consistent. I set my calipers to 0.333" and anything that fits does not clip in my TK moon clips. The moon clips are spot on. Out of 200 rounds of Starline 40 S&W brass I had 76 that were too loose for my moon clips. I understand SAAMI specs and manufacturing tolerances allow the differences. It just doesn't help with my moon clips. Have any of you fine folks worked with a brass manufacturer to order brass with a specific extractor groove dimension? Thanks, Javier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Sahlberg Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 My 38 Colt Shorts since 1996 have always worked in my Pan Pacific & S&W full moon clips! Never had any QC issues with Starline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 From what I've heard the same issue happens with 9mm starline brass. No idea why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMM50 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 I would call Starline directly. They've always taken my calls and answered technical (dimensional) questions. Another assumption is that they make brass to SAAMI spec. I bet the extractor groove has a large (relatively) tolerence. 9MMfor example is +0.00 / -0.020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted October 10, 2022 Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 I called Starline a few moments ago. They can't help me. TK is next. Thanks for the replies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 See if you can find some moon clips that have slits between the rounds. Those should be more springy and hold variable sizes better (theoretically). If I were making moon clips, that's what I'd do. Then one clip would fit all the different brands of brass for that caliber. The clip would fit the smallest size, but be able to spring open enough for the largest, or any in between. You might check out RIMZ polymer moonclips. I don't know if they are suitable for competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMM50 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 SAAMI spec on the extractor groove diameter is 0.347 +0.00 / - 0.020 And that is too much for a regular old moon clip to work with 0.347 grooves and 0.327 grooves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted October 10, 2022 Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 1 hour ago, GMM50 said: SAAMI spec on the extractor groove diameter is 0.347 +0.00 / - 0.020 And that is too much for a regular old moon clip to work with 0.347 grooves and 0.327 grooves. Starline says their smallest is 0.333, so their standards are a little tighter. Unfortunately, that is a little too small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted October 11, 2022 Author Share Posted October 11, 2022 5 hours ago, Toolguy said: See if you can find some moon clips that have slits between the rounds. Those should be more springy and hold variable sizes better (theoretically). If I were making moon clips, that's what I'd do. Then one clip would fit all the different brands of brass for that caliber. The clip would fit the smallest size, but be able to spring open enough for the largest, or any in between. You might check out RIMZ polymer moonclips. I don't know if they are suitable for competition. I wonder if its time for one of those 3D printers. Have you tried one yet for stuff like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishbreath Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 48 minutes ago, No.343 said: I wonder if its time for one of those 3D printers. Have you tried one yet for stuff like this? I haven't tried printing a moon clip yet, but I have 3D printed a lot of other stuff, and I don't think the rigidity is there for the common plastics at moon clip thicknesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Phil Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 7 hours ago, Toolguy said: See if you can find some moon clips that have slits between the rounds. Those should be more springy and hold variable sizes better (theoretically). If I were making moon clips, that's what I'd do. Then one clip would fit all the different brands of brass for that caliber. The clip would fit the smallest size, but be able to spring open enough for the largest, or any in between. You might check out RIMZ polymer moonclips. I don't know if they are suitable for competition. Rimz are great moonclips. The only problem I see with them for competition s that they are not metal, hence not attracted to a magnet. The 0mm that I use tend to wear out after 40k or so loadings. They are great for practice, but I don't use them where I need magnetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted October 11, 2022 Author Share Posted October 11, 2022 I forgot that I have some TK clips that are 0.050" thick. They hold the offending brass. Some of it fits tighter that others, but loaded rounds stay in the clip after a gentle shake. Unfortunately, the way my cylinder is cut I cannot close the cylinder with the thick moonclips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 Have you taken actual measurements so you can know the range which you will need to fit? Then try contacting Dave Hearth, on this site as Hearthco. PM him and see if he can make you some that will work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted October 12, 2022 Author Share Posted October 12, 2022 (edited) On 10/11/2022 at 12:28 PM, pskys2 said: Have you taken actual measurements so you can know the range which you will need to fit? Then try contacting Dave Hearth, on this site as Hearthco. PM him and see if he can make you some that will work. Yes sir I have. Any of brass with an extractor groove diameter equal to or less than 0.333" would not stay in the moonclip. The challenge is that 76/200 are too small, but the remaining 134 fit great with my moonclips. I remember the days when I shot my 625 with Ranch Products clips and range pick up brass and never gave this stuff a second thought. Ignorance was kind of nice. Edited October 12, 2022 by No.343 got the name of Ranch Products wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted October 12, 2022 Share Posted October 12, 2022 4 hours ago, No.343 said: Yes sir I have. Any of brass with an extractor groove diameter equal to or less than 0.333" would not stay in the moonclip. The challenge is that 76/200 are too small, but the remaining 134 fit great with my moonclips. I remember the days when I shot my 625 with Ranch Products clips and range pick up brass and never gave this stuff a second thought. Ignorance was kind of nice. What I was trying to say was if you have the maximum and minimum hearthco might be able to cut a series that would work for all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtYankee Posted October 17, 2022 Share Posted October 17, 2022 I use Ranch moonclips in my GP100 10mm and they work fine for Starline and Federal brass - not so well for foreign brass. The brass is held tight with just enough rattle for easy loading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted October 21, 2022 Author Share Posted October 21, 2022 On 10/17/2022 at 9:28 AM, CtYankee said: I use Ranch moonclips in my GP100 10mm and they work fine for Starline and Federal brass - not so well for foreign brass. The brass is held tight with just enough rattle for easy loading. I will give them a call. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.343 Posted November 7, 2022 Author Share Posted November 7, 2022 I received the Ranch moonclips and they work fine. They are holding samples of all my brass regardless of extractor groove dimensions. Problem solved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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